<?xml version='1.0' encoding='UTF-8'?><?xml-stylesheet href="http://www.blogger.com/styles/atom.css" type="text/css"?><feed xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom' xmlns:openSearch='http://a9.com/-/spec/opensearchrss/1.0/' xmlns:gd="http://schemas.google.com/g/2005"><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post113888484349405377..comments</id><updated>2011-07-13T16:13:18.645-04:00</updated><title type='text'>Comments on Silliman&#39;s Blog: </title><link rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#feed' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/feeds/comments/default'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html'/><link rel="hub" href="http://pubsubhubbub.appspot.com/"/><link rel='next' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default?start-index=26&amp;max-results=25'/><author><name>Unknown</name><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><generator version='7.00' uri='http://www.blogger.com'>Blogger</generator><openSearch:totalResults>39</openSearch:totalResults><openSearch:startIndex>1</openSearch:startIndex><openSearch:itemsPerPage>25</openSearch:itemsPerPage><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-7883917318942061792</id><published>2010-07-04T12:52:51.417-04:00</published><updated>2010-07-04T12:52:51.417-04:00</updated><title type='text'>from &amp;quot;Civilization and Its Discontents&amp;quot; ...</title><summary type='text'>from &amp;quot;Civilization and Its Discontents&amp;quot; (footnote 4, page 42, Standard Edition, trans. Strachey):&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&amp;quot; . . . . It is as though primal man had the habit, when he came in contact with fire, of satisfying an infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine.  The legends that we possess leave no doubt about the originally phallic view taken of </summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/7883917318942061792'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/7883917318942061792'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1278262371417#c7883917318942061792' title=''/><author><name>knott</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/10848525067425082815</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1665046687"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="July 04, 2010"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113907866217849095</id><published>2006-02-04T13:44:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-04T13:44:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>So this is why I&#39;m not in graduate school. This is...</title><summary type='text'>So this is why I&#39;m not in graduate school. &lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;This is the sort of thing that reminds me why I so much prefer poetry to poetry criticism.</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113907866217849095'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113907866217849095'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1139078640000#c113907866217849095' title=''/><author><name>BL</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/12521867776659586837</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1057392432"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 04, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113903773367231315</id><published>2006-02-04T02:22:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-04T02:22:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>I&#39;ll concede and give it a good review for the pos...</title><summary type='text'>I&#39;ll concede and give it a good review for the possible allusion to Hedwig and the Angry Inch.</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113903773367231315'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113903773367231315'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1139037720000#c113903773367231315' title=''/><author><name>brent</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/03491759302311728790</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-738178823"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 04, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113903724307278040</id><published>2006-02-04T02:14:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-04T02:14:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Ummm, seems like so much pissing up a rope.</title><summary type='text'>Ummm, seems like so much pissing up a rope.</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113903724307278040'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113903724307278040'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1139037240000#c113903724307278040' title=''/><author><name>nolapoet</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/13093723433052849060</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1237903846"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 04, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113903549151516291</id><published>2006-02-04T01:44:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-04T01:44:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Well, seedy semen, it really makes sense, I think....</title><summary type='text'>Well, seedy semen, it really makes sense, I think. Or maybe this is the influence of reading Rumi too much last night.</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113903549151516291'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113903549151516291'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1139035440000#c113903549151516291' title=''/><author><name>brent</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/03491759302311728790</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-738178823"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 04, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113902131502604087</id><published>2006-02-03T21:48:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-03T21:48:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Very shrewd, Brent, the business about &quot;seedy.&quot;  &quot;...</title><summary type='text'>Very shrewd, Brent, the business about &quot;seedy.&quot;  &lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;&quot;Raw&quot;?&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;&quot;Uncooked&quot;?&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;Ha!</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113902131502604087'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113902131502604087'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1139021280000#c113902131502604087' title=''/><author><name>Curtis Faville</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/01813159652010352331</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1749964855"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 03, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113900631425761838</id><published>2006-02-03T17:38:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-03T17:38:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Collins understands the basic active sentence bett...</title><summary type='text'>Collins understands the basic active sentence better than Dobyns whose lines are all passives and it&#39;s very hard to find a subject of any sort much less a verb.  It&#39;s just hard to believe that this level of slush could get published, but hell, maybe he&#39;s playing with a new sentence of his own.  I&#39;ve only read two or three of the poems and two sentences in a novel.&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;Collins is so much </summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113900631425761838'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113900631425761838'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1139006280000#c113900631425761838' title=''/><author><name>Kirby Olson</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/05952289700191142943</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1262696662"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 03, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113900220585984703</id><published>2006-02-03T16:30:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-03T16:30:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Dear Curtis,As an aesthetic preference, it seems a...</title><summary type='text'>Dear Curtis,&lt;BR/&gt;As an aesthetic preference, it seems a less formal style suits seedy subjects better. Iambics &lt;I&gt;can&lt;/I&gt; simply happen, of course. The treatment given in the poem has an unintentionally comic sense to it; a sort of mock epic. It might find its counterpart better in Ed Wood (Glen or Glenda?). Again, this is a personal belief/attitude.</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113900220585984703'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113900220585984703'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1139002200000#c113900220585984703' title=''/><author><name>brent</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/03491759302311728790</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-738178823"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 03, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113899117401202274</id><published>2006-02-03T13:26:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-03T13:26:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Who&#39;s worse?  Dobyns or Collins?</title><summary type='text'>Who&#39;s worse?  Dobyns or Collins?</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113899117401202274'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113899117401202274'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138991160000#c113899117401202274' title=''/><author><name>Kirby Olson</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/05952289700191142943</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1262696662"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 03, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113898551618363791</id><published>2006-02-03T11:51:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-03T11:51:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>OK, I was going to let this slide, but Curtis, who...</title><summary type='text'>OK, I was going to let this slide, but Curtis, who said anything about &quot;impure&quot;?  My claim was simply that it was inaccurate to claim that a line in question was iambically &quot;wooden&quot; when it didn&#39;t exhibit anywhere near a &quot;regular&quot; pattern of alternating stresses.  Nowhere do I say that any poet should adhere to &quot;rules&quot; of meter.  Hell, I&#39;m &lt;I&gt;Mister&lt;/I&gt; Variation.  I don&#39;t like Dobyns&#39; poem, but </summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113898551618363791'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113898551618363791'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138985460000#c113898551618363791' title=''/><author><name>K. Silem Mohammad</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/02565830726695506296</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-156654236"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 03, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113898015064528533</id><published>2006-02-03T10:22:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-03T10:22:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Brent:Does that make Buk&#39;s version better--that he...</title><summary type='text'>Brent:&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;Does that make Buk&#39;s version better--that he&#39;d present it unadorned, as chopped prose recounting?  &lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;I think we must accord the formalists their option, their wager that new poems can be made of old materials, as long as the imaginative force is powerful enough in them.  I also agree with jenny--what&#39;s all this &quot;impure&quot; iambics talk?????????  Rules are made to be broken, </summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113898015064528533'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113898015064528533'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138980120000#c113898015064528533' title=''/><author><name>Curtis Faville</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/01813159652010352331</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1749964855"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 03, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113895232214984457</id><published>2006-02-03T02:38:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-03T02:38:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>I&#39;m unsure of whether he&#39;s &quot;mastered&quot; this territo...</title><summary type='text'>I&#39;m unsure of whether he&#39;s &quot;mastered&quot; this territory (as the article says), but he&#39;s extended it. Still, I&#39;m surprised that it can create shock; I&#39;d rather read the same subject matter written by Buk. Eh, he probably has one kind of like this. Maybe in an unpublished ream someplace.</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113895232214984457'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113895232214984457'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138952280000#c113895232214984457' title=''/><author><name>brent</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/03491759302311728790</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-738178823"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 03, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113894187570776079</id><published>2006-02-02T23:44:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T23:44:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Evaluative criticism is so 1985!</title><summary type='text'>Evaluative criticism is so 1985!</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113894187570776079'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113894187570776079'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138941840000#c113894187570776079' title=''/><author><name>Jenny Vroon</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/17499407317366551697</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-835167991"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113894159017677436</id><published>2006-02-02T23:39:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T23:39:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Jesus, K. Silem - read a fucking amateur&#39;s handboo...</title><summary type='text'>Jesus, K. Silem - read a fucking amateur&#39;s handbook of verse sometime. The ENTIRE POINT of making iambic yr baseline meter is TO HAVE SOMETHING TO PLAY AGAINST. VARIATION IS THE POINT. Cf. any fucking poem written in English, ever. &lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;Who are these morons?&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;(Whether the poet uses the meter interestingly is another matter, &amp; I guess Ron don&#39;t read much of Ed Hirsch&#39;s stuff if he </summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113894159017677436'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113894159017677436'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138941540000#c113894159017677436' title=''/><author><name>Jenny Vroon</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/17499407317366551697</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-835167991"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113894009590994357</id><published>2006-02-02T23:14:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T23:14:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Well it couldn&#39;t have been the Titanic...that is s...</title><summary type='text'>Well it couldn&#39;t have been the Titanic...that is simply ludicrous.&lt;BR/&gt;If it was the titanic there would have been a diamond in the SNATCH...another personal film favorite we might know but Mr. P perhaps hasn&#39;t seen.  Then we could explore all that Diamond Dealer depravity and violence so immortalized by Brad Pitt and the Parkers.  In that case, it is still the women who want the Diamonds in the </summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113894009590994357'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113894009590994357'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138940040000#c113894009590994357' title=''/><author><name>Lady Jane</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/04555982712708881025</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1542572767"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113893786407788991</id><published>2006-02-02T22:37:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T22:37:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>K. Silem, the line you quote fits Halle and Keyser...</title><summary type='text'>K. Silem, the line you quote fits Halle and Keyser&#39;s definition of scannable iambic pentameter: five feet, no stresses in weak positions. See Halle and Keyser, English Stress, Its Forms, Its Growth, and Its Role in Verse (Harper &amp; Row, New York, 1971). &lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;(It&#39;s a clunker of a line, even so.)</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113893786407788991'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113893786407788991'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138937820000#c113893786407788991' title=''/><author><name>Kirk Johnson</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/05529898733002317995</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-895736745"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113893231383732347</id><published>2006-02-02T21:05:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T21:05:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>&quot;You haven&#39;t seen the GLORY of Mr. Happy!!&quot;-made i...</title><summary type='text'>&quot;You haven&#39;t seen the GLORY of Mr. Happy!!&quot;&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;-made it all worth reading! Thank you Curtis.</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113893231383732347'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113893231383732347'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138932300000#c113893231383732347' title=''/><author><name>J. Watson</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/12672899200810079557</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-124579531"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113892782138954461</id><published>2006-02-02T19:50:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T19:50:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>I think what we miss is Mr.D&#39;s deliberate insisten...</title><summary type='text'>I think what we miss is Mr.D&#39;s deliberate insistence that the narrator really has only a skewed access to the boy&#39;s experience here.&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;&quot;Perhaps he is eight&quot; he says or something like that -- who cares?&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;Perhaps he is fifteen, perhaps he thinks of the Lusitania rather than the Titanic.  Mr. D&#39;s point is that we just don&#39;t know.  No doubt an enthusiast for Nietzsche he would, if </summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113892782138954461'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113892782138954461'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138927800000#c113892782138954461' title=''/><author><name>joe green</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/12257285616529795340</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1849826838"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113892466225288366</id><published>2006-02-02T18:57:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T18:57:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>I woke, dying....hahahaha.Lovely.I did like the al...</title><summary type='text'>I woke, dying....hahahaha.&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;Lovely.&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;I did like the alligator in the toilet.  That much was pretty good.&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;And we have those kindofboys too...oddly enough.  The ratio of sheepboys to sheepboys keep us all on the same par.  It is hard to know whether this fellow is being simply facetious or fractious or fellatious.&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;Perhaps we should consult Sonnet Central for the </summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113892466225288366'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113892466225288366'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138924620000#c113892466225288366' title=''/><author><name>Lady Jane</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/04555982712708881025</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1542572767"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113892435221214880</id><published>2006-02-02T18:52:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T18:52:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Very very interesting blogs here: will return late...</title><summary type='text'>Very very interesting blogs here: will return later for more:)!</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113892435221214880'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113892435221214880'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138924320000#c113892435221214880' title=''/><author><name>Vivek</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/00794419464988884719</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1742990918"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113892357267703031</id><published>2006-02-02T18:39:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T18:39:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Ron has fallen into Mr. D&#39;s cleverly laid trap.  T...</title><summary type='text'>Ron has fallen into Mr. D&#39;s cleverly laid trap.  &lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;The boy:&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;before Freudian notions could for him&lt;BR/&gt;ruin the simplest of pleasures.&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;simply has fun.  However, Ron -- besotted with the urge to interpret in ceetain ways -- is constrained to see a Freudian subtext to the poem.  It&#39;s Ron who sees those lips in certain sounds and Ron who, trapped again, imagines a blow job </summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113892357267703031'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113892357267703031'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138923540000#c113892357267703031' title=''/><author><name>joe green</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/12257285616529795340</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1849826838"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113892014190978057</id><published>2006-02-02T17:42:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T17:42:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Dear Spicegirl:You haven&#39;t seen the GLORY of Mr. H...</title><summary type='text'>Dear Spicegirl:&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;You haven&#39;t seen the GLORY of Mr. Happy!!</summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113892014190978057'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113892014190978057'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138920120000#c113892014190978057' title=''/><author><name>Curtis Faville</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/01813159652010352331</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1749964855"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113891678967971633</id><published>2006-02-02T16:46:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T16:46:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Ron, you raise some very interesting points.  Inde...</title><summary type='text'>Ron, you raise some very interesting points.  &lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;Indeed, the metrical inversion bit was bang-on.  I hate it when I see archaically ordered sentences for the sake of metrical flow because it seems so unnatural especially considering the contemporary setting of Dobyn&#39;s poem.  Not only that, but the formalist rearrangement of the words gives the poem a rather flowery feel.  I find that </summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113891678967971633'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113891678967971633'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138916760000#c113891678967971633' title=''/><author><name>Michael</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/03121299372911531389</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-790212726"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113891290502503896</id><published>2006-02-02T15:41:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T15:41:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>&quot;WASHing UP, he CALLS BACK, before FLUSHing&quot;--How ...</title><summary type='text'>&quot;WASHing UP, he CALLS BACK, before FLUSHing&quot;--&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;How is this at all iambic?&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;I&#39;ll buy &quot;Before Freudian notions could for him&quot; as pentameter, &lt;I&gt;pace&lt;/I&gt; Kent&#39;s backchannel objection, Ron.  That inversion in the second foot is awkward, but it still leaves four recognizeable feet.  The later line, however, may have ten syllables, but they&#39;d have to stressed as follows to count as </summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113891290502503896'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113891290502503896'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138912860000#c113891290502503896' title=''/><author><name>K. Silem Mohammad</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/02565830726695506296</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-156654236"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113891238254124849</id><published>2006-02-02T15:33:00.000-05:00</published><updated>2006-02-02T15:33:00.000-05:00</updated><title type='text'>Ron, in this post against Dobyns you used the term...</title><summary type='text'>Ron, in this post against Dobyns you used the terms: bad, dunce, simple, bad, special awfulness, worst, clunky, and finally wrenching the term squalid out of its original meaning, you change it to mean something else entirely (you shift it from a reference to topic or setting to a reference to style).&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;Then you complain that I used the term &quot;blimp,&quot; to refer to a fatso.&lt;BR/&gt;&lt;BR/&gt;But the </summary><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113891238254124849'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='https://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/113888484349405377/comments/default/113891238254124849'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html?showComment=1138912380000#c113891238254124849' title=''/><author><name>Kirby Olson</name><uri>https://www.blogger.com/profile/05952289700191142943</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='16' height='16' src='https://img1.blogblog.com/img/b16-rounded.gif'/></author><thr:in-reply-to xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0' href='https://ronsilliman.blogspot.com/2006/02/just-how-bad-does-poem-have-to-be.html' ref='tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3738579.post-113888484349405377' source='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3738579/posts/default/113888484349405377' type='text/html'/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.itemClass" value="pid-1262696662"/><gd:extendedProperty name="blogger.displayTime" value="February 02, 2006"/></entry></feed>