========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 19:38:21 -0400 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Pierre Joris Subject: Re: POETICS Digest - 23 Feb 1999 to 24 Feb 1999 (#1999-32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Mairead Byrne wrote: > It's finally come to me! One Life is the Wendell Wilkie book, is that > right? Yes indeed Mairead -- it is the Wilkie book, & despite my absolute devotion for MR I can't agree with Burt on this one -- it is a prose account, with some poetically ventilated pages,-- I wld think her conscious attempt is at creating a new, experiemntal or whatever, prose/biographical genre rather than a long poem. Come to think of it, my favorite of those books of hers is and remains THE TRACES OF THOMAS HARIOT -- an absolutely brilliant book. These works need to be brought back into print! Pierre > You may be right, Burt, but your "definitely" is very > questionable. At least Rukeyser's most recent publishers Paris Press > consider One Life to be, wait for it -- PROSE (witness their > classification of the book on page 141 of their edition of The Orgy, > 1997). > Mairead > > On Thu, 25 Feb 1999, Burt Hatlen wrote: > > > Re: David Baratier > > > > Rukeyser's _One Life_ definitely IS a long poem (book length, combining > > prose and verse). I was very pleased to see it on this list--another > > "disappeared" masterwork of our century. > > > > Burt Hatlen > > -- ======================== Pierre Joris joris@csc.albany.edu http://www.albany.edu/~joris/ 6 Madison Place Albany NY 12202 tel: 518 426 0433 fax: 518 426 3722 ======================== Nomadism answers to a relation that possession cannot satisfy. — Maurice Blanchot ======================== ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 16:53:57 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: George Bowering Subject: Re: the longer poem In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Good Grief! There appears no end to the candidates for this >important largely male title. It is only fair yo put Listmates on notice >that my entire oeuvre is now (by my own fiat, which is what counts) to be >regarded as one long poem, The Long Bromige Poem. My published volumes come >to upward of 700 pp.,but there are some 300pp as yet unpublished. This is GB. I would like to point out that David did not go far enough in his explanation. It happens that all my work counts as one long poem, and it includes all of Bromige's work as part of it, along with the work of Victor Coleman and Drum Hadley. George Bowering. , 2499 West 37th Ave., Vancouver, B.C., Canada V6M 1P4 fax: 1-604-266-9000 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 18:12:48 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Weiss Subject: Bronk obit Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I'd be deeply grateful to anyone who would backchannel me Bill Bronk's Times obit, which I missed. Mark Weiss ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 23:20:33 +0100 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Marjorie Perloff Subject: Re: Galassi's Montale MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The suggestion (Steven Scharf and others) that the NY Times put Galassi's Montale on the cover and gave it a big review (an excellent one, by the way, by Nick Jenkins!) becauseof his position at Farrar, Straus and at the Academy of American Poets is, I think, a cheap shot. Have you looked at the book? It's quite fabulous, a labor of love with incredible and impeccable scholarship that makes a great modernist poet come alive. Galassi evidently spent years doing the translation--no mean feat given his day job!--and I found it mind-blowing and have been reading it for weeks. My Italian is rusty but good enough to see that the translation is really superb. So what's wrong with the Times featuring it? True, they wouldn't do same for a contemporary and we all know how little attention they pay to the new, but at least they actually featured a 20th C poet, still not very well known in the U.S. Shouldn't we be pleased about that? Marjorie Perloff ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 11:43:24 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Michael Heller Subject: THE GIFT BY H.D. THE COMPLETE TEXT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Jane Augustine asked me to post this notice to the list: You are invited to a BOOK PARTY to celebrate the publication of THE GIFT BY H.D.: THE COMPLETE TEXT (Univ. Press of Florida, December 1998) Edited by Jane Augustine (This edition, almost half again the length of the original ND publication, contains, in addition to much added text, 94 pages of H.D.'s "Notes" which she considered part of the work, and, as well, a gallery of never-before-published pictures of H.D.s' relatives, ancestors, and historical sites.) Wednesday, March 3, 1999 Teachers & Writers Collaborative 5 Union Square West, 7th Floor NYC ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 13:39:42 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Catherine Daly Subject: Lee Ann Brown, Sun & Moon Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Is Lee Ann Brown still reading tomorrow afternoon at Sun & Moon? I went to her reading at the Rose Cafe. She sang some poems of E.D.'s and her own, some songs. Her sampler poem (read aloud) reminded me of a poem in Mary Leader's _Red Signature_, except it seemed so interesting in Brown's established context, acrostics like cross stitch. She mentioned the Sun & Moon reading but I seem to have fallen off the mailing list and wasn't paying attention if it was posted here. I was completely blown away by Will Alexander's reading at Beyond Baroque last night (with Philip Lamantia). I was impressed with Lamantia as expected, but Alexander read like the apotheosis of Sun Ra. He used some words I love, like "fulminous". After, I watched something on tv about Monk and slide piano (Johnson). The Alexander/Lamantia reading seemed a bit hearing the slide piano in "Thelonius". I have missed his readings at Sun & Moon, but also the panel/conference at LACMA. Rgds, Catherine Daly cadaly@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:17:48 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Karen McKevitt Subject: ezra pound Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain My cousin is doing a presentation on Ezra Pound (for a college class) in which he must address some of Pound's themes in the Cantos. To me this seems so large--I was wondering if anyone had some insights they would like to backchannel (or frontchannel). Thanks in advance Karen McKevitt ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 09:05:07 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Subject: Re: Goodbye Paul, Goodby Khlebnikov MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit had to reformat this one. Chris ----------------- Original message (ID=0E3A9CD6) (163 lines) ------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 14:48:00 -0600 (CST) From: David Baptiste Chirot cc: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: Goodbye Paul, Goodby Khlebnikov Mark Prejsnar's remarks re the "knownness" of Khlebnikov brought to mind discussions during the "eyerhymes" Visual Poetry Conference in 1997 with several Ukrainian and Russian visual/sound poets and with Professor Gerald Jenecek (author of The Look of Russian Literature and ZAUM which both discuss Khlebnikov and the "lesser known" giant of Zaum, Kruchonykh)--there was much discussion of how both in the USA and Russia/Soviet Union Mayakovsky was the first to gain fame--then, Khlebnikov and not yet Kruchonykh--though I hope that Professor Jenecek's book will change that!)--although for the Russians and Ukrainians he was the most revered and respected--and in their countries, as in ours, his work is very hard to come by, still considered beyond the fringe of knowness, so to speak-- A great thanks from all lovers of Russian poetry to Paul Schmidt and his brilliant translation of Khlebnikov and his interesting one of Rimbaud. --dave baptiste chirot ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 19:37:36 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "A. Jenn Sondheim" Subject: Alan Sondheim is In MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII +++++ +++++ +++++ +++++ +++++ +++++ +++++ This is an automated reply. Alan Sondheim is in at the moment but has nothing to say in reply to your post. He will be in his office until March 3, 1999. Alan Sondheim apologizes for having nothing to say Please do not respond to this automated message. ID7279901 +++++ +++++ +++++ +++++ +++++ +++++ +++++ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 20:20:49 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: louis stroffolino Subject: Re: PHIL LEVINE In-Reply-To: <4.0.1.19990227104020.00f91100@mail.bway.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Does anybody know of any specific mentions (by Language poets, or others) of the work of Levine (from sentences to essays, negative or positive, by "poets" or "critics", any info. would be helpful..... Chris Stroffolino ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 09:09:56 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Subject: Fwd: PS: Starvation Deaths in Iraq MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This was sent to the administrative account, rather than the list. Chris ----- From: JBCM2@aol.com Subject: Fwd: PS: Starvation Deaths in Iraq Date: 2/28/99, 11:26 AM +0000 f.y.i. In a message dated 2/28/99 9:48:10 AM Eastern Standard Time, ulhasj@bom4.vsnl.net.in writes: << We have been working on a call to action with Noam Chomsky, Edward Herman, Edward Said, and Howard Zinn. Below is the final draft, which all four of them have signed off on and given permission to distribute. Please publish, broadcast, post or forward as widely as possible. Thanks, Bob Jensen for the Austin, Texas, Campaign for a Just Peace in the Middle East rjensen@uts.cc.utexas.edu (512) 471-1990 ------------------------------------------------------- January 8, 1999 A CALL TO ACTION ON SANCTIONS AND THE U.S. WAR AGAINST THE PEOPLE OF IRAQ by Noam Chomsky, Edward Herman, Edward Said, and Howard Zinn At the end of 1998, the United States once again rained bombs on the people of Iraq. But even when the bombs stop falling, the U.S. war against the people of Iraq continues through the harsh economic sanctions. This is a call to action to end all the war. This month U.S. policy will kill 4,500 children under the age of 5 in Iraq, according to UN studies, just as it did last month and the month before that, all the way back to 1991. Since the end of the Gulf War, at least hundreds of thousands -- maybe more than 1 million -- Iraqis have died as a direct result of the UN sanctions on Iraq, which are a direct result of U.S. policy. This is not foreign policy -- it is sanctioned mass-murder that is nearing holocaust proportions. If we remain silent, we are condoning a genocide that is being perpetrated in the name of peace in the Middle East, a mass slaughter that is being perpetrated in our name. The time has come for a call to action to people of conscience. We are past the point where silence is passive consent -- when a crime reaches these proportions, silence is complicity. There are several tasks ahead of us. First, we must organize and make this issue a priority, just as Americans organized to stop the war in Vietnam, and to protest U.S. policies in Central America and South Africa. We need a national campaign to lift the sanctions. This kind of work has already begun, and those efforts need our help. For the past several years, individuals and groups have been delivering medicine and other supplies to Iraq in defiance of the U.S. blockade. Now, members of one of those groups, Voices in the Wilderness in Chicago, have been threatened with massive fines by the federal government for "exportation of donated goods, including medical supplies and toys, to Iraq absent specific prior authorization." Our government is harassing a peace group that takes medicine and toys to dying children; we owe these courageous activists our support. Such a campaign is not equivalent to support for the regime of Saddam Hussein. To oppose the sanctions is to support the Iraqi people. The people are suffering because of the actions of both the Iraqi and U.S. governments, but our moral responsibility lies here in the United States, to counter the hypocrisy and inhumanity of our leaders. Also, there has been a virtual embargo on news of the effects of the sanctions in the mainstream media. For the most part, the American people do not know what evil is being carried out in our name. We must continue to apply pressure on journalists at all levels -- from our local papers to the network news -- to cover this tragedy. We should overwhelm the major press with letters to the editor and put pressure on journalists to cover the story. And we must realize this could be a long struggle. Preparations should begin for all the possible strategies, including civil disobedience once a sufficient number of people are committed. Direct action that forces a moral accounting likely is going to be necessary. Whatever else we are doing, we should treat this as an emergency and put it at the top of our agenda. Existing groups can work on the issue, new groups may need to be formed, and national networks need to be built. A good central source of information exists on the web at http://leb.net/IAC/. Without action by us, the horrors will go on, the children will continue to die. We must appeal to the natural sympathies of the American people, who will respond if they know what is happening. We must therefore bring this issue, in every way we can, to national attention. The only way to avoid complicity in this crime is to do everything we can, and much more than we have been doing, to end the sanctions on Iraq. This issue must be discussed in every household and every public forum across the country. ******** The A-Infos News Service ******** COMMANDS: majordomo@tao.ca REPLIES: a-infos-d@tao.ca HELP: a-infos-org@tao.ca WWW: http://www.ainfos.ca/ INFO: http://www.ainfos.ca/org ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 11:22:09 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Billy Little Subject: why won't ron silliman be poet laureate Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 20:10:08 -0700 >To:jvk >From:poemz@mars.ark.com (Billy Little) >Subject:why won't ron silliman be poet laureate > >america needs his poems. >men die everyday from lack of what is in there. >the thought of what america would be like >if only they read ron silliman >in elementary school >in the washington post >on CNN >the thought of what america >solid pieces from the alphabet in new Jacket >and the tag at the end >teaching with a mere gesture hee hee forbidden plateau fallen body dojo 4 song st. nowhere, b.c. V0R1Z0 canadaddy ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 15:13:47 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Harold Teichman Subject: Advice wanted: Meschonnic MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Marjorie Perloff, through several of her essays, has aroused my interest in the work of Henri Meschonnic on poetic form. He's written a lot of books; where to begin? Is 'Critique du rythme' the best entry point? I am primarily interested in issues of the 'ineluctability' of poetic forms; I take it as a given that Marjorie is right, that we are somehow constrained to write in certain forms, but what is the nature of this constraint (philosophically and practically)? Thanks, Harold Teichman ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 21:59:40 GMT Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Jamie Ferguson Subject: translation into archaic English Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain Mark Weiss wrote: Why [else] translate from a language foreign to the reader into a version of one's own language only marginally understandable to same? Is the language in which the poets of the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries "only marginally understandable"? This question is not rhetorical. Chaucer's language certainly IS difficult for most. Do you support the use - in classrooms, say - of the translations of Chaucer into modern English? Don't we lose Chaucer for losing the specific form of his language? Would you present Chaucer through Dryden's translations of some of the Tales? Wouldn't you be painfully aware that you were in fact presenting Dryden and his age, rather than Chaucer and his? Nobody would suggest that the Elizabethans should be so rendered (leaving aside, at least for the moment, the prevalent modernization of typography, spelling, etc.). Imagine a course on Shakespeare that took Dryden's rescriptings as primary texts. "Translation is not replication, and it's not just about text. Translation translates as well what the reader needs to know about context, linguistic and otherwise." - M.W. You are dogmatic, here, and difficult to understand. What I am suggesting about the use of archaic English is that various foreign literary traditions can be set into meaningful parallel with the English tradition, and that, generally speaking, the translation of a proto-Baroque Polish poet into the idiom of a proto-Baroque English poet is a reasonable attempt to provide the reader with an analogical insight into the Polish poet's place in his or her own tradition. I have to run. I appreciate your response, and we will, I hope, return to this in more detail. Jamie Ferguson, Boston ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 20:45:35 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: WENDY KRAMER Organization: N/A Subject: [Fwd: [Fwd: check it out]] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------5890659A5E6A" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------5890659A5E6A Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit One more time i'm forwarding this, because i don't think it went through after that crash a few weeks ago. apologies if duplicate. wendy --------------5890659A5E6A Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-ID: <36C33E9B.10C8@erols.com> Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 20:33:32 +0000 From: WENDY KRAMER Organization: N/A X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-DH397 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: poetics@listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu Subject: [Fwd: check it out] Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------5CC0321C33FC" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------5CC0321C33FC Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit hello, i don't think my message got posted from last week. if not, here it is again. --------------5CC0321C33FC Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-ID: <36B9B4AE.6DA7@erols.com> Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 14:54:43 +0000 From: WENDY KRAMER Organization: N/A X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-DH397 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: UB Poetics discussion group Subject: check it out References: <199901250505.AAA28648@mx04.erols.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit hello, it's wendy kramer again. i posted a month or two ago, saying i'd post titles that might be of interest to the list, that are available from the branch libraries of the new york public library. here (HEAR hear) are some that are not yet in the catalog, but will be within the next few weeks, so y'all can watch for them, and reserve them or check them out as they appear. p.s. did i mention in the last post that you can use the library catalog via the website www.nypl.org, then click on "catalogs" and choose "LEO," which is the catalog for the branch libraries? using your library card, you can place reserves same as when y're at the library, plus you can use many of the available databases (click "electronic resources" at the homepage) from this way. anyhow, hear are some titles to watch for: Under the Autumn Star by Knut Hamsun My Futurist Years by Roman Jakobson My Way: Speeches and Poems by Charles Bernstein Routine Disruptions: Selected Poems & Lyrics 1960-1998 by Kenward Elmslie Whatsaid Serif by Nathaniel Mackey Also, off the top of my head (i.e. no written citations at my side) of things to watch for that i haven't posted the last few weeks, some not yet available, some on the shelves: LeeAnn Brown's book (a thousand pardons, i don't remember the title, & it's not in yet) also a new one by Barrett Watten (again, sorry, no title on hand) The Real Billy the Kid (sorry, my author citation got cut off in the copier) but i thot it might be of interest as it is for me for spicer fans et al. p.p.s. Surrealist Women ed. penelope rosemont just came in, & i've got it checked out for myself right now. (that's the one i posted about last time) it looks _scrumptious_, so get in line! i think mid-manhattan (5th ave at 40th st) owns one too. if you get it, backchannel me & lemme know what you think! last comment: last time i posted "check it out," i got a handful of backchannels, which i appreciated. let me stress, however, that i am low on the library food chain, and do not have the power to place items in the ordering/selection room. in other words, if it ain't already a choice on my order list, i caint hardly choose it. so please dont ask me to buy titles. the exception to this would be, of course, that if there's a title you want in your local branch, go there and request it from whichever librarian is working at the information desk. She or he should have request slips for that purpose, or at least a scrap paper that'll serve the same. oh, yeah: poetry calendar is available at some branches, free! best wishes for feb, dee --------------5CC0321C33FC-- --------------5890659A5E6A-- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 21:08:03 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Andrew D Epstein Subject: Poetry Readings (NYC) In-Reply-To: <4.0.1.19990227104020.00f91100@mail.bway.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII For those of you in or around or passing through New York, there are two upcoming readings at Columbia you might be interested in: The F. W. Dupee Poetry Reading Series presents: Anselm Berrigan Andrea Brady Jordan Davis Andrew Epstein Introduced by Kenneth Koch Tuesday, March 23 8 PM Ward Dennis Room Lewisohn Hall, 5th Floor Columbia University (at 116th and Broadway) Admission Free ________________________________________________________ Gary Lenhart & Eileen Myles Introduced by Kenneth Koch Tuesday, April 6 8PM Maison Francaise Columbia University (at 116th and Broadway) Admission Free ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 22:20:26 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Kenneth Sherwood Subject: David Antin Comments: To: JLowther@FACSTAFF.OGLETHORPE.EDU Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I wrote an essay on David Antin for the Dictionary of Literary Biography volume 169, which may be of some interest. The bibliography is generious if not comprehensive; in addition to "The Principle of Fit," it includes "The Archaeology of Home; Lemons" High Performance Audio, 1987 -- a recording I am unfamiliar with; Antin himself added it in proofing. In addition to the 1975 VORT special issue, I find his essay "Modernism and Modernity" (Boundary II, 1 Fall 1972: 98-133) and "A Correspondence with the Editors" (Boundary II, Spring 1975: 595-650) important context. More widely available: Stephen Fredman's _Poets Prose_; Marjorie Perloff's _Poetics of Indeterminacy_, and Hank Lazer's _Opposing Poetries_ all contain smart essays on Antin. Ken Sherwood ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 18:29:25 +0200 Reply-To: orachel@internet-zahav.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: rachel Organization: mail.iol.co.il Subject: (no subject) Comments: To: POETICS@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, I was wondering if you could help me I'm doing a job , comparing "in memory of w.b.yeats" by Auden and "a pact" written by ezra pound (about whitman) maybe you could help me analyze it ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 05:30:09 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Heather H Thomas Subject: Re: BARDFEST 99 Berks County ~ Reading, Pennsylvania In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII BARDFEST 99(C) Reading, Pennsylvania & Berks County http://www.geocities.com/~poetspride/bardfest99.html Celebrating April... National Poetry Month 30 Days / 30 Venues for details contact stevenallenmay: Zen3ten@aol.com Events Calendar ------------------------------------------------------------------------ April 1....Fools Day : BARDFEST 99(C) Sampler with stevenallenmay & Craig Czury and others at April 2....Benefit for the community of Lyons. April 3....Blue Marsh Lake April 4....Skyline Drive Fire Tower, Easter Sunrise Service with Poetry *April 5....Reading High School, with visiting poet Luis Otero-Garabis April 6...RAAC "Bruce Stanley Memorial Reading, with Reading H.S. students April 7....Mulhenburg Public Library, hosted by Charles Scanzello *April 8....Alexander's Deli, New Jerusalem, Celtic Night hosted by Jen Gittings Dalton, featuring Beth Phillips Brown April 9...Upstairs Gallery, Douglasville, hosted by stevenallenmay *April 9...Julia Lopez featured poet at the Puerto Rican Latin Association. April 10...Wyomissing Inst. of Fine Arts, afternoon poetry workshop with Craig Czury and evening reading featuring his students ($25) April 11...Tattered Pages Book Store, Shillington *April 12...Hamburg High School, with visiting poet Harry Eshelman. April 13...Hamburg Public Library April 14...Penn State Berks Campus, poetry writing workshop with Michael Riley's creative writing class and reading at the Freyberger Art Gallery, featuring his students April 15...Kutztown Public Library *April 16....Reading Museum, featuring Harry Humes April 17...Sahara Restaurant...Poetry Jazz April 18....Unitarian Church of Reading 6-8PM *April 19...Schuylkill Valley High School, visiting poet Karen Blomain April 20...Schuylkill Valley Public Library, featuring Schuylkill Valley HS poets April 21....Borders Book store April 22...Fire & Ice Cafe, Fleetwood hosted by Gina Stitzer April 23...Albright College *April...24....Club SocIal Ipanema, Celebration of Spanish Poet Federico Garcia Lorca, presented by poets Emiliano MartIn and Peter Krok of the Manyunk Art Center April 25...St. John's Church Soul Cafe, Kutztown, hosted by Harry Serio *April 26...Boyertown High School, with visiting poet Jayne Relaford Brown April 27...Boyertown Public Library, featuring Kerry Lance Graul April 28...Birdsboro Library hosted by stevenallenmay April 29...YMCA of Reading April 30...'Day of Poetry' Muhlenberg HS 9AM - 2:30PM (Martha Richardson) * Programs funded by the Berks Arts Council ------------------------------------------------------------------------ This page created by Alex K. of G.jC Enterprises, December 1998 Contact the Webmaster at My 7 Heads@aol.com. Heather H. Thomas, English Dept., Kutztown U., Kutztown, PA/USA (610)683-4337 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 09:20:33 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Subject: Francis Berry's Long Poems MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi. This came to me at the administrative account. Chris ----- From: "jesse glass" Subject: Francis Berry's Long Poems Date: 2/26/99, 9:05 AM -0800 We mustn't forget the long dramatic poems of Francis Berry: Ghosts of Greenland, and...there's another about an insurrection in Haiti, I believe. He's an unusual writer. If anyone knows more about him--if he's still living--a bibliography, etc. I'd be interested. He also wrote an interesting book in which he attempts to speculate on the in-the-flesh voice of poets from the "voice" of their poems. All best Jesse Glass ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 22:07:19 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Michael McColl Organization: TEMPLE UNIVERSITY Subject: Re: David Antin - audio addendum + In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT they charged my visa and send about half the order and then never answered my calls again. Maybe they were going out of business right about then. They did have an extensive catalog, and I was all set to slowly but surely put together a collection. Mike mcColl ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 09:42:21 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: louis stroffolino Subject: Re: BARDFEST 99 Berks County ~ Reading, Pennsylvania In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Nice to see my sad home town does the art deco theatre downtown still say "Help save me" on it?) getting some play here in poeticsland.... On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, Heather H Thomas wrote: > BARDFEST 99(C) > > Reading, Pennsylvania & Berks County > > http://www.geocities.com/~poetspride/bardfest99.html > > Celebrating April... National Poetry Month > > 30 Days / 30 Venues > > > for details contact stevenallenmay: Zen3ten@aol.com > > > Events Calendar > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > April 1....Fools Day : BARDFEST 99(C) Sampler with stevenallenmay & Craig > Czury and others at > > April 2....Benefit for the community of Lyons. > > April 3....Blue Marsh Lake > > April 4....Skyline Drive Fire Tower, Easter Sunrise Service with Poetry > > *April 5....Reading High School, with visiting poet Luis Otero-Garabis > > April 6...RAAC "Bruce Stanley Memorial Reading, with Reading H.S. > students > > April 7....Mulhenburg Public Library, hosted by Charles Scanzello > > *April 8....Alexander's Deli, New Jerusalem, Celtic Night hosted by Jen > Gittings Dalton, featuring Beth Phillips Brown > > April 9...Upstairs Gallery, Douglasville, hosted by stevenallenmay > > *April 9...Julia Lopez featured poet at the Puerto Rican Latin > Association. > > April 10...Wyomissing Inst. of Fine Arts, afternoon poetry workshop with > Craig Czury and evening reading featuring his students ($25) > > April 11...Tattered Pages Book Store, Shillington > > *April 12...Hamburg High School, with visiting poet Harry Eshelman. > > April 13...Hamburg Public Library > > April 14...Penn State Berks Campus, poetry writing workshop with Michael > Riley's creative writing class and reading at the Freyberger Art > Gallery, featuring his students > > April 15...Kutztown Public Library > > *April 16....Reading Museum, featuring Harry Humes > > April 17...Sahara Restaurant...Poetry Jazz > > April 18....Unitarian Church of Reading 6-8PM > > *April 19...Schuylkill Valley High School, visiting poet Karen Blomain > > April 20...Schuylkill Valley Public Library, featuring Schuylkill Valley > HS poets > > April 21....Borders Book store > > April 22...Fire & Ice Cafe, Fleetwood hosted by Gina Stitzer > > April 23...Albright College > > *April...24....Club SocIal Ipanema, Celebration of Spanish Poet Federico > Garcia Lorca, presented by poets Emiliano MartIn and Peter Krok of the > Manyunk Art Center > > April 25...St. John's Church Soul Cafe, Kutztown, hosted by Harry Serio > > *April 26...Boyertown High School, with visiting poet Jayne Relaford > Brown > > April 27...Boyertown Public Library, featuring Kerry Lance Graul > > April 28...Birdsboro Library hosted by stevenallenmay > > April 29...YMCA of Reading > > April 30...'Day of Poetry' Muhlenberg HS 9AM - 2:30PM (Martha > Richardson) > > > * Programs funded by the Berks Arts Council > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > This page created by Alex K. of G.jC Enterprises, December 1998 > > Contact the Webmaster at My 7 Heads@aol.com. > > > Heather H. Thomas, English Dept., Kutztown U., Kutztown, PA/USA (610)683-4337 > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 10:27:00 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Prejsnar Subject: Re: POETICS Digest - 23 Feb 1999 to 24 Feb 1999 (#1999-32) In-Reply-To: <36D73092.496DC91D@csc.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=X-UNKNOWN Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE Ummm, i just haveta weigh in here, with one point, which is obviously both superficial and crucial: Her Collected Poems, with which i believe she had something to do, includes One Life prominently as one of her poems. mark prejsnar On Fri, 26 Feb 1999, Pierre Joris wrote: > Mairead Byrne wrote: >=20 > > It's finally come to me! One Life is the Wendell Wilkie book, is that > > right? >=20 > Yes indeed Mairead -- it is the Wilkie book, & despite my absolute devoti= on > for MR I can't agree with Burt on this one -- it is a prose account, with > some poetically ventilated pages,-- I wld think her conscious attempt is = at > creating a new, experiemntal or whatever, prose/biographical genre rather > than a long poem. >=20 > Come to think of it, my favorite of those books of hers is and remains TH= E > TRACES OF THOMAS HARIOT -- an absolutely brilliant book. These works need= to > be brought back into print! >=20 > Pierre >=20 > > You may be right, Burt, but your "definitely" is very > > questionable. At least Rukeyser's most recent publishers Paris Press > > consider One Life to be, wait for it -- PROSE (witness their > > classification of the book on page 141 of their edition of The Orgy, > > 1997). > > Mairead > > > > On Thu, 25 Feb 1999, Burt Hatlen wrote: > > > > > Re: David Baratier > > > > > > Rukeyser's _One Life_ definitely IS a long poem (book length, combini= ng > > > prose and verse). I was very pleased to see it on this list--another > > > "disappeared" masterwork of our century. > > > > > > Burt Hatlen > > > >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > -- > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > Pierre Joris > joris@csc.albany.edu > http://www.albany.edu/~joris/ > 6 Madison Place > Albany NY 12202 > tel: 518 426 0433 > fax: 518 426 3722 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > Nomadism answers to a relation that > possession cannot satisfy. >=20 > =97 Maurice Blanchot > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >=20 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 10:38:38 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Prejsnar Subject: Re: PHIL LEVINE In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > Does anybody know of any specific mentions (by Language poets, > or others) of the work of Levine (from sentences to essays, > negative or positive, by "poets" or "critics", any info. would > be helpful..... You know somewhere one of 'em (is it in CB's A Poetics, in Perelman's Marginalization, or a more fugative essay, ...?) quotes PL from an interview, indicating that his ideal would be to write a poem without words, to have the words disappear, or to have the poem function in such a way that the language is unimportant and unnoticed by the reader... This is taken as representative, or rather as exemplary even, of the mainstream desire for poetry (like fiction) to be "transparent" --for the language to be as undistinguished and self-effacing as possible. All of which i agree with; but it is interesting that PL has at times been *slightly* more interesting than that...Apart from his quirkily work-class detroit jewish anarchism, which sure makes him more insteresting than your run-of-the-mill New Yorker hack, there are (very fleeting) times when his language doesn't wanna self-efface, albeit many of these occured a long time ago: the volume Red Dust, the long poem Pili's Wall, the title poem of the book They Feed They Lion, etc. All of which makes it even more telling that he made the statement about wanting language to disappear.... Sorry i can't recall *where* this mention takes place... ---mark prejsnar ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 11:04:28 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: david bromige Subject: re re the longer poem/ reading announcement Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I had no idea Mr. Bowering was eavesdropping and peeping tomming on this new list. I thought one reason it had been re-formed, was to keep him and his sort out. Ok, I fess up, one night when I didnt have the price of a beer he had me sign a pact that all my writing could be published under the Bowering logo (moosehead above Carling's brewery and pair of tweed panties rampant on a field of butts). I am sad to learn that he pulled this one on Victor Coleman also, Canada's finest lyric poet; one has to admit that GB's got great taste as a colonizer. I shall take this matter up with Robert Kroetsch when he reads at UC Berkeley tomorrow Tues Mar 2 from noon-1:30 p.m.at 13 Boalt Hall sponsored by UCB's Canadian Studies Program. This event is bag lunch/skull session; Mr.Kroetsch, a past editor of _Boundary 2_ , will be paired up with Ron Smith, author of _What Men Know About Women_ (I believe GB was a consultant on this book). The title of this joint presentation is "Going Nowhere Fast : Mis/placed Poetics." Hmm. I note that among Kroetsch's many publications is a book titled _Studhorse Man_ . Perhaps a study of George Bowering? All this aside, I am glad to welcome George to the newly building list of The New Epic poets. "Epic or know the reason ewhy" is our motto, and I shall expand upon this to the List very shortly. (If the tone is flip, still the aim is earnest). Bromige, now that Bowering is here. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 11:21:54 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: david bromige Subject: Ron Silliman, Poet Laureate Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" There, Billy Little! It's as simple as that. All in favor say "I". Bromige. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 15:56:50 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: lee ann brown Subject: Re: Long Poems Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" What about ROBIN BLASER The Moth Poem The Holy Forest (multi-leaved long poem as Leaves of Grass is) Michael Ondaatje Billy the Kid poem Also, works by Kevin Davies (his incremental work builds to book-length long chained works), Jeff Derkson, (long poems is Downtime) Lisa Robertson's Debbie (An Epic) and many others Love Lee Ann >Subject: Re: long poem / Rosenthal > >A lot of post-1960 work in this list (Silliman, Blau Du Plessis, and >others). If you're going to include post-1960 work I would hope you would >define "American" as meaning more of the continent than the United States, >so as not to leave off marvelous works by bpNichol, Phyllis Webb, Daphne >Marlatt, George Bowering, and other Canadians. Plus Brathwaite, Walcott, >and other Caribbean writers. I apologize for not being so informed about >pre-1960 Canadian work -- perhaps others could help in this regard. > >charles > Z Y X W V U T S R Q P O N M L K J I H G F E D C B A Lee Ann Brown Tender Buttons PO Box 13, Cooper Station New York, NY 10276 212.529.6154 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 17:41:35 -0500 Reply-To: BANDREWS@prodigy.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: BETSY ANDREWS Subject: Re: THE GIFT BY H.D. THE COMPLETE TEXT MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit What time? ---------- > From: Michael Heller > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: THE GIFT BY H.D. THE COMPLETE TEXT > Date: Saturday, February 27, 1999 11:43 AM > > Jane Augustine asked me to post this notice to the list: > > You are invited to a > > BOOK PARTY > > to celebrate the publication of > > THE GIFT BY H.D.: THE COMPLETE TEXT > (Univ. Press of Florida, December 1998) > > Edited by Jane Augustine > > (This edition, almost half again the length of the original ND publication, > contains, in addition to much added text, 94 pages of H.D.'s "Notes" which > she considered part of the work, and, as well, a gallery of > never-before-published pictures of H.D.s' relatives, ancestors, and > historical sites.) > > Wednesday, March 3, 1999 > > Teachers & Writers Collaborative > 5 Union Square West, 7th Floor > NYC ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 18:43:52 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Pritchett,Patrick @Silverplume" Subject: Re: LEFT HAND READING 3/11/99 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain > THE LEFT HAND READING SERIES FOR MARCH 11, 1999 PRESENTS: > > Poets > COLE SWENSEN > JEFFREY ROBINSON > > Thursday, March 11, 1999 at 8:30pm > Left Hand Books > 1825 Pearl Street, between 18th & 19th, above the Crystal Market > Boulder, CO > > FREE - Donations requested > (Funded in part by a Grant from the Boulder Arts Commission) > > Cole Swensen's books include "Numen" (Burning Deck), and "Noon," winner of > Sun & Moon Press's New American Poetry Award. Her forthcoming books > include "Try," winner of the Iowa Poetry Prize, and "O," a chapbook. She > is the Director of the Creative Writing Program at the University of > Denver. > > Jeffrey Robinson is the author of "Spliced Romanticism," published by > Mellen Poetry Press. His poems have appeared in Many Mountains Moving and > Prairie Schooner, among others. A distinguished professor at the > University of Colorado, his scholarly works in the field of Romantic > studies include, "The Walk: Notes on a Romantic Image," and "Romantic > Presences: Living Images from the Age of Wordsworth & Shelley." > > For further information contact Mark DuCharme (303-938-9346) or Patrick > Pritchett (303-444-5963). ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 21:39:26 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Jessica Pompeii Subject: Re: Alan Sondheim is In Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit *************************************************************** +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ This is not a response to Alan Sondheim's automated message. Please consider this e-mail, one to be ignored, erased, and most importantly DELETED. More messages need to be deleted sooner. Reading through an entire post without jumping to conclusions can be dangerous to your health, your sanity, and mostly your shitty sex life. Relieve yourself ASAP. Consider yourself warned, by Jessica Pompei. They also call me 87864231. ------------> DANGER DANGER DANGER ANGER ANGER DANGER DANGER DANGER =============================================================== ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 03:05:31 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "A. Jenn Sondheim" Subject: The Sadness of Directories MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII /\ The Sadness of Directories 16 cp tf wanders 17 cp thing and 18 touch touches 19 touch her (these are the commands creating files 'wanders and touches her') jennifer: ascii text wanders: sparc demand paged dynamically linked executable and: ascii text her: empty arm: directory touches: empty her: empty thing: ascii text .: directory (this is the result of file -f in relation to files 'jennifer wanders and her arm touches her thing.') jennifer ascii text wanders sparc demand paged dynamically linked execu- table and ascii text her empty arm directory touches: empty her: empty thing: ascii text directory (this is the rearrangement of the sad result of file -f exposing the futility of emanant life, Oh, how they would love to be alive and not so empty!) Jennifer wanders, her speech in disarray; there's hardly a spark present. She demands too much, pages and pages of her dynamically linked and execu- ting. I think of her empty arm directing and touching everyone everywhere - I'd empty her, turn her into an empty dirty thing, reams of desecrated texts directing anyone, anywhere, to do something - to do anything at all. (this is what Jennifer wanted me to write about the sad result of her files so exposed to you, the emptiness of prosthetics, you know they're all phantom limbs, they're all phantoms, Jennifer says she's a phantom too, she wanted you to know this, this empty sad person in her empty life unable to touch anything at all) _________________________________________________________________________ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 00:19:19 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: juliana spahr Subject: reading report from Honolulu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I keep feeling it has been a bad year for poetry. And then I realize it has just begun. I'm hoping it gets better soon. Is it because of the rabbit? Or can we expect better things to come in this year? Or am I just jumpy? We have a rabbit calendar in the living room and the furry rabbit pin-up is in a cage for the months of January and February. Linda Gregg read earlier in the semester to a packed room. I had to sit on the floor in the back. She read some poems about some time she had spent in Greece and about some time she had spent in El Salvador and about some time she had spent in some other places. She talked about how when she was little she didn't know she was rich all she knew was that the sun rose and the sun set on the land and they had horses. She mentioned Jack Gilbert and Ann Rice and some other people whose names I forget. Her poems are in the lyrical tradition. A sort of lyrical tourism. I think she is based in California. She is a mainland poet. And then I'm having a disillusionment with the local poetry scene moment. Which isn't fair but I might as well tell about it in an attempt to rid myself of it once and for all. It started late last year when I went to a reading organized by the Guerilla Gardeners Union, a splinter group of the now defunct Wobblies. Gabrielle Welford organizes these readings and they are lefty events (the last one was a "fundraiser" for Mumia and Peltier) and community readings. A lot of new writers read and the emphasis is on work by Pacific Islanders. They are fun events. There is often a band and some hippies come (unusual on Oahu). As usual a number of community poets read but the only one that stays in my mind was a poem that compared colonialism to butt fucking and actually said that no one could possibly like that. The poet is a well respected activist lawyer here. I kind of can't get this out of my mind. It took me a long time to repress it. But then it all came rushing back last week when I saw Joe Balaz read. He writes poems in pidgin. Sometimes they are a sort of dramatic monologue. I enjoy them and find his work often very astute about local politics. He does visual poems in the Hawaiian language (on the Tinfish website--good for teaching!). And he has a poem about how Hawai'i is the mainland to him. He has a poem about getting "kimo-therapy" (Kimo is a man's name, like Jim; and the poem makes clear that kimo-therapy is a punch in the mouth.) He seems to be turning himself into a sort of performance poet. Like he had props and a lighting staff. He would put on a certain hat and then the light would come on and then he would recite his poem. He unfortunately acted out the woman's voices as high squeaky ones. And once he acted out an old man (and the lights got all dark) for a poem about the last squid. But he read a poem about a naked man on the beach who propositions the narrator and then the narrator beats him with a baseball bat size stick (Balaz picked up a stick he had on stage and demonstrated a hit crotch high). The poem has a tight rhyme and is supposed (I think) to be silly. I say "narrator" but it isn't really a dramatic monologue. It reads in that universal poetry voice. So I'm trying to figure out the sexuality stuff and not be all weird about it and say generic things about the local scene but I'm having trouble ignoring it and being accepting of it. I keep wondering about the crowd's laughter at the Balaz piece. And yet not really knowing what exactly the proper response is either. And not even being sure of the point of the poem (unlike the wrongness of that equation between colonialism and butt fucking). But I'm still feeling sensitive about those bumper stickers that say save traditional marriage. But I went to a good series of talks at the Center for Hawaiian Studies a few nights ago. It was on mele ku'e (songs of protest). One song had the line "the greatest of all women are Queen Emma and Queen Victoria." Queen Emma apparently sided with the Brits against the Amer. There was some good hula. And Amy Gillian (a pop local singer) sang some songs she had had translated into Hawaiian. One was about the H3 highway controversy and another was about walking into the Iolani Palace. Some guy did a talk on a mele that compared a missonary guy to an over ripe bannana. It had a lot of good metaphors in about how stupid the man was. And then a guy fom Sudden Rush (a local rap group) sang and talked also. He talked nervously and nonstop and made all these jokes. One was knock knock; who's there?; a portugee burglar. He said he could tell this joke b/c he is Portugese also. The event was fun b/c it made the univ seem alive and in touch with the community to have popular singers taken seriously at a conference on mele ku'e. Apparently Huanani Kay Trask is the one that has made the word ku'e such a rally cry. She found it a mele that some people did a hula to that was about the militia that tried to regain power after Queen L. was kicked out by the haole junta. And then Roy Miki and Ashok Mathur were just here. They are from Canada. Ashok once did a prairie asians tour in Canada. Roy edits West Coast Line. They had just come from Australia. It was interesting talking to them and about experimental poetry and race issues. They read at a Coffee shop. During the reading people kept walking between the reader and the audience to go to the bathroom. They were all carrying a child's shoe with a key on it and for some reason they refused to not interupt the reading. The reading was good and fun. I especially liked the poems Ashok read from his book _Loverauge_. The audience was very small. I had kind of hoped more people would come b/c Roy has done all this work on the Canadian internment of Japanese-Canadians during WWII and there is a lot of talk here about the U.S. internment. I had hoped the Japanese activist connection would bring out writers from that community. But alas. Among the few present, there was a lady who comes to all the readings here. She asked Bill if he knew what the price of chicken was. And she told me that she was calling California to see if the price of gas had gone down any around here (there is a lawsuit happening here about gas companies price fixing and inflating the cost of gas--it is around $1.50 per gallon; Bill doesn't know the price of chicken but it is probably high also). We went out after the reading and all drank really dark beers and talked. The talk was about curriculum and postcolonialism and, as always, Hawai'i. One person said that Ben Cayetano should just go back to the Philippines, where he came from (I think he was born here but I'm not sure). That comment made the rest of us nervous but no one said anything. Today Roy and Ashok gave a talk at the English Dept. Ashok read some excerpts from his dissertation on two emerging Indian-Canadian (or is that S.E. Asian-Canadian?) writers whose names I didn't write down and so don't remember but who seemed very interesting and fun. Roy talked a lot about the commodification of minority writing in Canada. The audience was very small. 1/9 of the potential audience had fainted before the talk and another 1/9 had gone with him to the hospital. I felt kind of annoyed at the smallness of the audience (not at the guy who fainted; him I'm worried about) b/c there are a lot of people in my dept who teach and/or study Asian-American literature and I felt they shoulda been interested in what our Northern neighbors are up to. That is the scolding evil side of me that is really just the side of me that longs for cross ocean and land mass communities, no more colonialism ever, and yet more butt fucking overall. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 10:38:53 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Keith Tuma Subject: Brixton Fractals--new edition Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Nate Dorward has asked if I'd forward this to the Buffalo list. Happy to do so as well as to echo his praise for Brixton Fractals. Keith Tuma > >Hi all--a long-awaited announcement, appended below: the new _Brixton >Fractals_ edition is out. A brief plug of my own: I think many denizens of >this list would number _BF_ among the crucial books of the '80s; it is, at >once, a resource-based notation of place & a path of reading/knowledge, a >continually self-transforming text (lines & poems are rewritten & resounded >from page to page), and a set of narratives whose personified >characters--Burglar, Bellman, Artist, Mathematician--call to mind at once >Lewis Carroll, Blake, and Langland. -- That's a quick approximation, >anyway. And you get this in a book not (like the first edition) liable to >dissolve into a sheaf of loose pages! > >I should also add that later this year I'll be publishing a chapbook of >essays associated with _Brixton Fractals_, called _The Topological Shovel_. > This will include the important _Necessary Business_ in an updated text. >More information forthcoming soon..... > >Nate Dorward >ndorward@sprint.ca >109 Hounslow Ave., Willowdale, ON, M2N 2B1, Canada >ph: (416) 221 6865 > >--- > > >New from Tsunami Editions > > >BRIXTON FRACTALS > >by > >Allen Fisher > > >(reprint of Brixton Fractals published by Aloes Books, 1985) > >92 pages securely stapled >9 canadian dollars (plus $1 postage) >to order please email Deanna Ferguson at: >lounge@netsign.com > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 10:56:19 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Subject: Virtual Poetry Workshop with Hoa Nguyen MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi. This came to me at the admin account. Chris ----- From: "Daniel Kane" Date: 3/1/99, 12:13 PM -0500 Teachers & Writers Collaborative is pleased to announce an on-line poetry workshop led by poet Hoa Nguyen. You can access this on the WriteNet web site at http://www.twc.org/forums/virtualpoetrywrkshp.html 8 students from around the country are participating in this workshop. Their poems (and Hoa's responses) can be seen on the forum page at http://www.twc.org/forums/indexWVW.html Finally, to learn a little about Hoa's own poetry, check out her bio page at http://www.twc.org/forums/hoa_nguyen.html Hoa's exercises are there for all teachers to use -- however, the forum page is reserved for our 8 students only. If you *do* use Hoa's exercises, please drop her line and let her know what you think. She can be reached at nguyenhoa@hotmail.com --daniel #This list-serve is designed for teachers and writers who want #to share ideas on teaching creative writing workshops for students #in grades K-12. To post, send mail to writenet@twc.org. #To join the list-serve, send the message "subscribe writenet" to #majordomo@twc.org. #To join the list-serve digest, which will collect several #messages into a batch and send them to you as one message #(reducing the total amount of messages sent to your mailbox), #send the message "subscribe writenet-digest" to majordomo@twc.org. #To unsubscribe, send the message "unsubscribe writenet" or #"unsubscribe writenet-digest" to majordomo@twc.org. #To view an archive of past messages on the Web, go to # and hit the "Teachers & Writers #Discussion Group" link. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 09:56:38 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maria Damon Subject: queries In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" does anybody have snail mail addresses for World Literature Today, Caribbean Literary Quarterly, or our own beloved Small Press Traffic Newsletter? backchannel please! bests, md ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 17:19:58 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Joe Ross Subject: Re: Page Mothers Reading MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII For those of you in San Diego this weekend for the Page Mothers Conference - - Beyond The Page is hosting a special post-conference reading: Sunday, March 7th at 1 P.M. Readers include: Rae Armantrout Fanny Howe A.L Nielsen Dodie Bellamy Jennifer Hofer Leslie Scalapino Lee Ann Brown Pamela Lu Margy Sloan Rachel Blau Duplessis Bill Luoma Juliana Spar Lyn Hijinian Laura Moriarty -Plus others who aren't confirmed at this moment. Beyond The Page holds its events at: The Faultline Theater 3152 5th Ave (5th & Spruce in Hillcrest) San Diego, CA All events are free with donations going to the readers & for rent Beyond The Page is an independent arts group dedicated to the promotion of experimental and explorative work in contemporary arts. For more information contact Joe Ross: jjross@cts.com or Stephen Cope: scope@ucsd.eud ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 21:33:08 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Garrett Kalleberg Subject: TF News Comments: To: Poetics List Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Tuesday, March 2, 1999 Dear Poeticsmongers, -cozeners, -traders, -speculators and -collectors: A couple of announcements from The Transcendental Friend: Links have been posted to an Editorial Statement, Submissions information, and a general masthead page at the Transcendental Friend home page (http://www.morningred.com/friend). TF welcomes submissions that contribute to the ongoing projects here. Please take a look at these pages and send a note if you're interested. Leonard Schwartz joins TF as the new editor of Report from Afield, Duncan Dobbelmann as Contributing Editor, and Kevin Varrone as Managing Editor. Lastly, we'd like to mention that next month is the one year anniversary of TF. Readings & general merrymaking to take place at the Dactyl Foundtation in NY on March 16. The March(/April) issue of the Transcendental Friend, will be posted at that time. An audio CD will also be available. More news to follow. The current issue no. 8, "Coffins," can be seen at http://www.morningred.com/friend/1999/02/cover.html Garrett Kalleberg mailto:tf@morningred.com The Transcendental Friend can be found at: http://www.morningred.com/friend ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 01:00:22 -0400 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Michael Scharf Subject: Page Mothers Coverage ASAP Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Going to California? I have a friend who is an editor at a prominent writerly magazine that has recently been redesigned. She is looking for someone to write 1,000 clear, admiring words about the Page Mothers conference and its participants. She will pay you. Lots of people will read it. You'd be doing the conference good. Please come forward. Journalistic or reviewing experience, as they say, would be a big plus. The admiring part was my idea but I'm certain it is an apt one. If you are a panelist it does not, I would guess, disqualify you -- new journalism, etc. Backchannel ASAP -- thanks -Mike ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 00:38:13 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: George Bowering Subject: Re: Kroetsch/Smith In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I hope that Bay Area folk, at least, get/got to the Kroetsch and Smith reading at Berkeley, and that someone can report on it. Kroetsch is, in my opinion, the most interesting living Can. writer up here, and Smith is one of two poets I know who claim to be good golfers. As to Bromige. I want it understood that while I write his poems, I do not write his letters. George Bowering. , 2499 West 37th Ave., Vancouver, B.C., Canada V6M 1P4 fax: 1-604-266-9000 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 18:03:49 +0000 Reply-To: baratier@megsinet.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: David Baratier Subject: Forward: help MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit From Jennifer Bosveld, at Pudding House (who is doing my next book) mailto:pudding@johnstown.net * Willie Abraham Howard Jr. burned out in Atlanta area fire. We're publishing his book, Memorial Drive, and that's where his apartment burned Monday Feb. 22 while he was at work. His writings only got drenched and have been hanging out to dry on a friend's porch. But almost everything else is gone. His Smith Corona typewriter is a plastic blob. He was already living on little. He wants no sympathy. He sees only love and blessings and an opportunity for change. He is an amazing human being and I love him dearly. Will you help me help him? Alex Haley, it is clear to me, was about to thrust a spotlight on Willie, but Haley died. We're publishing his chapbook--a far cry from the attention Haley could have created. Willie's trying to get resettled. Let's shower him with $5 bills. Can you send ONE? or more? Why don't we do something really fantastic for this young writer who NEVER spends his money in the wrong place. He's a great father, has a strong work ethic, is a super person. He was FEATURED POET in Pudding Magazine a few issues back. Do sign a note to him please. It makes people crazy not to know the names of the people who do nice things. Just tell him you're a writer in support. Or whatever you want to say. The $30 KMart voucher the fire victims got means EVERYTHING to him. Can you imagine? If you do this, it WILL came back to bless you 10-fold because "there is no giving anything away." No matter how much you send him it will bless YOU as much as HIM. I promise. I know, because I'm a goddess [god] just like YOU. Let's create. Let's make this day of creation one from the poets. Go without lunch. Forget the 6-pack. Whatever. For five minutes, I ask you to please put down the new Donald Hall book, drop everything and send a note to WILLIE ABRAHAM HOWARD JR, 3850 Memorial Drive #C7, Decatur, Georgia 30032. With a little gift in it. I'm also trying to figure out a way to get him a computer, which goddess Cathy Callaghan stuffed money in my pocket for last night at Larry's Poetry Forum when she heard me talking about this. If you have a recommendation about how I should go about selecting a cheap but no-clunker computer or facilitating this, please enlighten me. Thank you for joining in doing something for someone who least expects it. --Jen ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 11:11:17 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Subject: Welcome Message reprise MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Welcome to the Poetics List & The Electronic Poetry Center ..sponsored by The Poetics Program, Department of English, College of Arts & Science, the State University of New York, Buffalo /// Postal Address: Poetics Program, 438 Clemens Hall, SUNY Buffalo, NY 14260 Poetics List Moderator: Christopher W. Alexander Please address all inquiries to . Electronic Poetry Center: =3D Contents =3D 1. About the Poetics List 2. Subscriptions 3. Submissions 4. Cautions 5. Digest Option 6. Temporarily turning off Poetics mail 7. "No Review" Policy 8. The Electronic Poetry Center (EPC) 9. Poetics Archives at EPC 10. Publishers & Editors Read This! ___________________________________________________________ Above the world-weary horizons New obstacles for exchange arise Or unfold, O ye postmasters! 1. About the Poetics List The Poetics List was founded by Charles Bernstein in late 1993 with the epigraph above. Now in its second incarnation, the list carries over 600 subscribers, though all of these subscribers do not necessarily receive messages at any given time. A number of other people read the Poetics List via our web archives at the Electronic Poetry Center (see section 9 below). Please note that this is a private list and information about the list should not be posted to other lists or directories of lists. The idea is to keep the list to those with specific rather than general interests, and also to keep the scale of the list relatively small and the volume manageable. The Poetics List is a =3Dfully moderated=3D list. Due to the increasing number of subscribers, we are no longer able to maintain the open format with which the list began. All submissions are reviewed by the moderator in keeping with the goals of the list, as articulated in this Welcome Message. We remain committed to this editorial function as a defining element of the Poetics List. Our aim is to support, inform, and extend those directions in poetry that are committed to innovations, renovations, and investigations of form and/or/as content, to the questioning of received forms and styles, and to the creation of the otherwise unimagined, untried, unexpected, improbable, and impossible. For further information on posting to the list, see section 5 below. Publishers and series co-ordinators, see also section 10. In addition to being archived at the EPC, some posts to Poetics (especially reviews, obituary notices, announcements, etc.) may also become part of specific EPC subject areas. Brief reviews of poetry events and publications are always welcome. See section 7 for details. We recognize that other lists may sponsor other possibilities for exchange in this still-new medium. We request that those participating in this forum keep in mind the specialized and focussed nature of this project. For subscription information or to contact the editors, write to . ------------------- 2. Subscriptions Subscriptions to the Poetics List are free of charge, but formal registration is required. We ask that when you subscribe you provide your real name, street address, email address, and telephone number. All posts to the list must provide your full real name, as registered. If there is any discrepancy between your full name as it appears in the "from" line of the message header, please sign your post at the bottom. To subscribe to the Poetics List, please contact the editors at . Your message should include all of the required information. Please allow several days for your new or re-subscription to take effect. PLEASE NOTE: All subscription-related information and correspondence remains absolutely confidential. To unsubscribe, send this one-line message, with no "subject" line to : unsub poetics *If you are having difficulty unsubscribing, please note: sometimes your e-mail address may be changed slightly by your system administrator. If this happens you will not be able to send messages to Poetics or to unsubscribe, although you will continue to receive mail from the Poetics List. To avoid this problem, unsub using your old address, then return to your new address and send this one-line message, with no "subject" line to : sub poetics Phil Spillway Remember to replace "Phil Spillway" with your own name. If you find that it is not possible to unsub using your old address, please contact the editors at for assistance. *Eudora users: if your email address has been changed, you may still be able to unsubscribe without assistance. Go to the "Tools" menu in Eudora, select "Options" and then select setup for "Sending Mail": you may be able to temporarily substitute your old address here to send the unsub message. The most frequent problem with subscriptions is bounced messages. If your system is often down or if you have a low disk quota, Poetics messages may get bounced. Please try avoid having messages from the list returned to us. If the problem is low disk quota, you may wish to request an increased quota from your system administrator. (University subscribers may wish to argue that this subscription is part of your scholarly communication!) You might also consider obtaining a commercial account. In general, if a Poetics message is bounced from your account, your subscription to Poetics will be temporarily suspended. If this happens, simply re-subscribe to the list (once your account problem has been resolved!) by sending this one-line message, with no "subject" line to : sub poetics Phil Spillway Remember to replace "Phil Spillway" with your own name. All questions about subscriptions, whether about an individual subscription or subscription policy, should be addressed to the list's administrative address . Please note that it may take up to ten days, or more, for us to reply to messages. ------------------- 3. Submissions The Poetics List is a =3Dfully moderated=3D list. All submissions are reviewed by the editors in keeping with the goals of the list as articulated in this Welcome Message (see section 1). Please note that while this list is primarily concerned with poetics, messages relating to politics and political news will also be considered. All correspondence with the editors regarding submissions to the list remains confidential and should be directed to . We encourage subscribers to post information on publications and reading series that they have coordinated, edited, published, or in which they appear. Such announcements constitute a core function of this list. Also welcome are other sorts of news, e.g., event reports, obituaries, and reading lists (annotated or not). Queries may be posted to the list when deemed appropriate; we request that the posting subscriber assemble "highlights" from respondents' posts to be published to the list. Solicited submissions (by subscribers or non-subscribers) may also appear on Poetics from time to time. The editors reserve the right to contact any subscriber regarding possible submissions. Posts to the Poetics List should abide by the rules of "Fair Use" when quoting material for which the posting subscriber does not hold copyright. Please do not post to the list personal or "backchannel" correspondence, or other unpublished material, without the express permission of the author! If you want someone to send out information to the list as a whole, or supply information missing from an post, or thank someone for posting something you requested, please send the request or comment directly to that individual, and not to the list editors. Send messages to the list directly to the list address: Please do not send messages intended for posting to the list to our administrative address . When sending to the list, please send only "plain text". Note, however, there is no problem with sending clickable URLs in HTML format. Please do not send attachments or include extremely long documents in a post, since this may make it difficult for those who get the list via "digest" or who cannot decode attached or specially formatted files. The use of "styled" text or HTML formatting in the body of email posts to the list appears not to be compatible with the the list's automatic digest program; as a result such messages disrupt the format of the Digest, even though this coding is readable for some subscribers who do not use the digest option. Like all machines, the listserver will sometimes be down: if you feel your message has been delayed or lost, *please wait at least one day to see if it shows up*, then check the archive to be sure the message is not posted there; if you still feel there is a problem, you may wish to contact the editors at . As an outside maximum, we will accept for publication to Poetics no more than 5 messages a day from any one subscriber; in general, we expect subscribers to keep their post to less than 10-15 posts per month. Our goal is a manageable list (manageable both for moderators and subscribers) of twenty or fewer messages per day. For further information or to contact the editors, please write to . ------------------- 4. Cautions It may take up to a week or more to respond to your questions or to subscription requests or to handle any other editorial business or any nonautomated aspect of list maintenance. Please do not publish list correspondence without the express permission of the author! Copyright for all material posted on Poetics remains with the author; material from this list and its archive may not be reproduced without the author's permission, beyond the standard rights accorded by "fair use". "Flame" messages will not be tolerated on the Poetics List. In this category are included messages gratuitously attacking fellow listees, also messages designed to "waste bandwidth" or cause the list to reach its daily limit. These messages are considered offensive and detrimental to list discussion. Please do not bother submitting such messages to the editor. Offending subscribers will receive only one warning message. Repeat offenders will be removed from the list immediately. Please do not put this policy to test! ------------------- 5. Digest Option The Listserve program gives you the option to receive all the posted Poetics message each day as a single message. If you would prefer to receive ONE message each day, which would include all messages posted to the list for that day, you can use the digest option. Send this one-line message, with no "subject" line to : set poetics digest You can switch back to individual messages by sending this message: set poetics mail NOTE!! Send these messages to "listserv" not to Poetics or as a reply to this Welcome Message!! ------------------- 6. Temporarily turning off Poetics mail Do not leave your Poetics subscription "active" if you are going to be away for any extended period of time! Your account may become flooded and you may lose not only Poetics messages but other important mail. You can temporarily turn off your Poetics subscription by sending this one-line message, with no "subject" line, to : set poetics nomail You may re-activate your poetics subscription by sending this one-line message, with no "subject" line, to the same address: set poetics mail When you return you can check or download missed postings from the Poetics archive. (See section 8 below.) ------------------- 7. "No Review" policy For the safety and security of list subscribers, the "review" function of the Poetics List has been de-activated. Non-posting subscribers' email addresses will remain confidential. Please do not ask the list editors to give out subscriber addresses or other personal information. ------------------- 8. What is the Electronic Poetry Center? The World Wide Web-based Electronic Poetry Center is located at . Our mission is to serve as a hypertextual gateway to the extraordinary range of activity in formally innovative writing in the United States and around the world. The Center provides access to the burgeoning electronic resources in new poetries including RIF/T and many other electronic poetry journals, the POETICS List archives, an AUTHOR library of electronic poetic texts and bibliographies, and direct connections to numerous related electronic RESOURCES. The Center also provides information about contemporary print little magazines and SMALL PRESSES engaged in poetry and poetics. And we have an extensive collection of soundfiles of poets reading their work, as well as the archive of LINEbreak, the radio interview series. The EPC is directed by Loss Peque=F1o Glazier. ------------------- 9. Poetics Archives at the EPC Go to the Electronic Poetry Center and select the "Poetics" link from the opening screen. Follow the links to Poetics Archives. Or set your browser to go directly to . You may browse the Poetics List archives by month and year or search them for specific information. Your interface will allow you to print or download any of these files. ------------------- 10. Publishers & Editors Read This! PUBLISHERS & EDITORS: The Electronic Poetry Center listings of poetry and poetics information is open and available to you. We are trying to make access to printed publications as easy as possible for our users and ENCOURAGE you to participate! Send a list of your press/publications to , with the words EPC Press Listing in the subject line. You may also send materials on disk. (Write file name, word processing program, and Mac or PC on disk.) Send an e-mail message to the address above to obtain a mailing address to which to send your disk. Though files marked up with html are our goal, ascii files are perfectly acceptable. If your word processor will save files in Rich Text Format (.rtf) this is also highly desirable. Send us extended information on new publications (including any back cover copy and sample poems) as well as complete catalogs or backlists (including excerpts from reviews, sample poems, etc.). Be sure to include full information for ordering--including prices and addresses and phone numbers both of the press and any distributors. You might also want to send short announcements of new publications directly to the Poetics List as subscribers do not always (or ever) check the EPC; in your message please include full information for ordering. If you have a fuller listing at EPC, you might also mention that in any Poetics posts. Some announcements circulated through Poetics and the EPC have received a noticeable responses; it may be an effective way to promote your publication and we are glad to facilitate information about interesting publications. ------------------- END OF POETICS LIST WELCOME MSG ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 15:49:20 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: pete spence Subject: Re: Goodbye Paul, Goodby Khlebnikov Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain >From: David Baptiste Chirot >cc: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: Goodbye Paul, Goodby Khlebnikov > > >d/b/c said Professor Gerald Jenecek (author of The Look of Russian >Literature and ZAUM which both discuss Khlebnikov and the "lesser known" >giant of Zaum, Kruchonykh)-- >and not yet Kruchonykh--though I hope that Professor Jenecek's book will >change that!)--although for the Russians and Ukrainians he was the most > --dave baptiste chirot > >Dave didja get my mail wid the collaboratives in it?? go a catalogue for you will mail shortly// re khleb, the tiflis connection was very important spec via 41 degrees, but also add in chicherin too little known and who produced the great gingerbread book whyche apparently bods like kruchonykh read then ate (the perfect book!!) when yer hungry!! ok yrs pete spence ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 11:10:37 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mairead Byrne Subject: Re: POETICS Digest - 23 Feb 1999 to 24 Feb 1999 (#1999-32) In-Reply-To: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=DEC-MCS Content-transfer-encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE Oh for God's sake man The Collected Poems includes a section called From ONE LIFE, which does indeed present many poems from the book called ONE LIFE, which is about the life and times of Wendell Willkie. Some of these poems are called "WILLKIE -- STOPLESS FALLING THROUGH AIR," and "Radio silence of aircraft over the dense ocean," and Rang and rang, rang in a small boy's head," and even "My name Is Tommy Torin," but there is no long poem called ONE LIFE. So stop about it now. Enough.=20 Mairead On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, Mark Prejsnar wrote: > Ummm, i just haveta weigh in here, with one point, which is obviously bot= h > superficial and crucial: Her Collected Poems, with which i believe she > had something to do, includes One Life prominently as one of her poems. >=20 > mark prejsnar >=20 > On Fri, 26 Feb 1999, Pierre Joris wrote: >=20 > > Mairead Byrne wrote: > >=20 > > > It's finally come to me! One Life is the Wendell Wilkie book, is tha= t > > > right? > >=20 > > Yes indeed Mairead -- it is the Wilkie book, & despite my absolute devo= tion > > for MR I can't agree with Burt on this one -- it is a prose account, wi= th > > some poetically ventilated pages,-- I wld think her conscious attempt i= s at > > creating a new, experiemntal or whatever, prose/biographical genre rath= er > > than a long poem. > >=20 > > Come to think of it, my favorite of those books of hers is and remains = THE > > TRACES OF THOMAS HARIOT -- an absolutely brilliant book. These works ne= ed to > > be brought back into print! > >=20 > > Pierre > >=20 > > > You may be right, Burt, but your "definitely" is very > > > questionable. At least Rukeyser's most recent publishers Paris Press > > > consider One Life to be, wait for it -- PROSE (witness their > > > classification of the book on page 141 of their edition of The Orgy, > > > 1997). > > > Mairead > > > > > > On Thu, 25 Feb 1999, Burt Hatlen wrote: > > > > > > > Re: David Baratier > > > > > > > > Rukeyser's _One Life_ definitely IS a long poem (book length, combi= ning > > > > prose and verse). I was very pleased to see it on this list--anoth= er > > > > "disappeared" masterwork of our century. > > > > > > > > Burt Hatlen > > > > > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > -- > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D > > Pierre Joris > > joris@csc.albany.edu > > http://www.albany.edu/~joris/ > > 6 Madison Place > > Albany NY 12202 > > tel: 518 426 0433 > > fax: 518 426 3722 > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D > > Nomadism answers to a relation that > > possession cannot satisfy. > >=20 > > =97 Maurice Blanchot > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D > >=20 >=20 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 11:42:17 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: louis stroffolino Subject: Reading in Reading, PA... In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I just wanted add to Heather Thomas's list of readings in the hometown of Wallace Stevens, Byron Vazakas, Baziotes, and, yikes, Updyke... a blatant self-promotion-- ON APRIL 21st, 1999, I will be returning to my alma matter, Albright College, to read poetry in the very same "south lounge" of the "campus center" where I learned to play piano. I even think my book, STEALER'S WHEEL (HARD PRESS, 1999), might very well be out by then.... chris On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, louis stroffolino wrote: > > > > > On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, Heather H Thomas wrote: > > > BARDFEST 99(C) > > > > Reading, Pennsylvania & Berks County > > > > http://www.geocities.com/~poetspride/bardfest99.html > > > > Celebrating April... National Poetry Month > > > > 30 Days / 30 Venues > > > > > > for details contact stevenallenmay: Zen3ten@aol.com > > > > > > Events Calendar > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > April 1....Fools Day : BARDFEST 99(C) Sampler with stevenallenmay & Craig > > Czury and others at > > > > April 2....Benefit for the community of Lyons. > > > > April 3....Blue Marsh Lake > > > > April 4....Skyline Drive Fire Tower, Easter Sunrise Service with Poetry > > > > *April 5....Reading High School, with visiting poet Luis Otero-Garabis > > > > April 6...RAAC "Bruce Stanley Memorial Reading, with Reading H.S. > > students > > > > April 7....Mulhenburg Public Library, hosted by Charles Scanzello > > > > *April 8....Alexander's Deli, New Jerusalem, Celtic Night hosted by Jen > > Gittings Dalton, featuring Beth Phillips Brown > > > > April 9...Upstairs Gallery, Douglasville, hosted by stevenallenmay > > > > *April 9...Julia Lopez featured poet at the Puerto Rican Latin > > Association. > > > > April 10...Wyomissing Inst. of Fine Arts, afternoon poetry workshop with > > Craig Czury and evening reading featuring his students ($25) > > > > April 11...Tattered Pages Book Store, Shillington > > > > *April 12...Hamburg High School, with visiting poet Harry Eshelman. > > > > April 13...Hamburg Public Library > > > > April 14...Penn State Berks Campus, poetry writing workshop with Michael > > Riley's creative writing class and reading at the Freyberger Art > > Gallery, featuring his students > > > > April 15...Kutztown Public Library > > > > *April 16....Reading Museum, featuring Harry Humes > > > > April 17...Sahara Restaurant...Poetry Jazz > > > > April 18....Unitarian Church of Reading 6-8PM > > > > *April 19...Schuylkill Valley High School, visiting poet Karen Blomain > > > > April 20...Schuylkill Valley Public Library, featuring Schuylkill Valley > > HS poets > > > > April 21....Borders Book store > > > > April 22...Fire & Ice Cafe, Fleetwood hosted by Gina Stitzer > > > > April 23...Albright College > > > > *April...24....Club SocIal Ipanema, Celebration of Spanish Poet Federico > > Garcia Lorca, presented by poets Emiliano MartIn and Peter Krok of the > > Manyunk Art Center > > > > April 25...St. John's Church Soul Cafe, Kutztown, hosted by Harry Serio > > > > *April 26...Boyertown High School, with visiting poet Jayne Relaford > > Brown > > > > April 27...Boyertown Public Library, featuring Kerry Lance Graul > > > > April 28...Birdsboro Library hosted by stevenallenmay > > > > April 29...YMCA of Reading > > > > April 30...'Day of Poetry' Muhlenberg HS 9AM - 2:30PM (Martha > > Richardson) > > > > > > * Programs funded by the Berks Arts Council > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > This page created by Alex K. of G.jC Enterprises, December 1998 > > > > Contact the Webmaster at My 7 Heads@aol.com. > > > > > > Heather H. Thomas, English Dept., Kutztown U., Kutztown, PA/USA (610)683-4337 > > > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 13:26:42 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkward Ubutronics Subject: Ez @ St Liz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit db The long poem is alive & well, a life's work lived & written thru. History prefigures the outcome, the epickal outlasts any distant memories that words fall short of. From which hospital will you rewrite your glowing paramyth? ez lb ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 15:20:36 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Catherine Daly Subject: Re: Brown Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Thanks for the tolerance. Lee Ann Brown read well, sang again, read poems quite differently selected from _Polyverse_, but still a cohesive, performative, revelatory whole at Sun & Moon, the new Buck a Book for the Miracle Mile? Not quite, and I still owe $5 to the press. But do go there, perhaps with enough cash, for the sale. Rgds, Catherine Daly cadaly@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 13:01:30 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Ron Silliman Subject: Not That Pig Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain I do believe that was Saul Bellow who said this, not Levine. And I suspect that I'm the one who cited SB to that effect, tho, since I'm at work and Bromige & Billy Little have yet to complete the concordance of my critical texts, I can't tell you where... But it weren't Phil (Not This Pig) Levine, unless he made the same gaffe independently. Ron Silliman ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 13:12:53 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Ron Silliman Subject: Now I remember Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain It's in "Disappearance of the Word, Appearance of the World," in Das Neue Satz If I started a school of cowboy language poets, could I become poet lariat? Ron ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 11:33:51 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rodrigo Toscano Subject: Rodrigo Toscano's New E Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Dear Listees, Here's my new e and address... Rodrigo Toscano (all caps) RT5LE9@aol.com 1424 A South Van Ness San Francisco, CA 94110 415-282-5217 R%T ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 04:57:10 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Kevin L. Magee" Subject: Richard Foreman's New Writing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Some staging notes responsive to RF's website posted 2/27. Window and door and a cup and a cloud and a phone and a table and tree, who could you find to find them for you? Somebody who thinks they know how to run the show says these are props. I said I didn't know what props were or what they were for. Here they are words that float and rest for a moment among pairs of voices, there are only a few of them, you wouldn't need to ask a whole lot of people to be the voices, not the objects, the voices are never objects here, eluding objectification, could they even bear to be identified by the body of the actor? These voices are outside the thingness of the words for the objects that are images, not props, but image-objects. How can you see them without a camera? How can you stage them without a camera? Richard Foreman's new writing for the theater abolishes cinema. There can be no light tricks. There needs to be natural light only, coming in through the loft or gallery window like the one at Canessa Park. The play(s) would then need to take place across a 24 hour period. Natural light falling on words for image-objects which I don't know if they should be spoken by live speakers. RF writes that he used tapes a long time ago, before William Dafoe. Maybe the actors whose bodies the voices are supposed to coming out of need at least to begin mutely, as a gesture to Kattrin (RF's Brecht). The words would surround the live speakers, and they would fall toward them, and the action would be the actors trying to find the words with their mouths, and the v-effect of it would not be coming from anything more monumental than the recognition that the simplest words for things and thoughts and feelings like the "I love you" these speakers say would materialize through an unprecedented intersubjectivity, one endless day and night in which the Poem can be heard departing from its graphic site, paper or screen, and returning to the fragile acoustics of the interreal, which sounds to those outside it to be the doubly unreal. Richard Foreman's new writings tell me there is a human voice. It is both one and not-one together for the many who are without a voice. There is also a child's garden of verses here, for the children our government is killing in Iraq. Does RF suggest in an essay that he was "pandering to the masses" (his own title) when in one show two naked women on roller skates bent over to bare their asses to the audience? They called this pornography. Guys and dolls. In RF's new writings it is the kiss that shocks to be shown, an action that could it be represented, and I don't think it can, might tear the viewer between her critical detachment-position and her body's involuntary, reflexive wet. KM/3-3/Cleveland ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 08:43:03 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Hilton Manfred Obenzinger Subject: Obenzinger.Com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I tried sending a message some time ago, though I don't think it got through. I'll try again, and if this is repetitive, please forgive. A friend who designs web sites put together a web site on my books which includes excerpts, reviews, works-in-progress. Please check it out, and let me know any suggestions (about the site or about the books!). You can find the sucker at www.obenzinger.com. Thanks, Hilton Obenzinger ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 11:55:32 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Subject: constant nagging / friendly message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit All - Since we've never compiled a FAQ for this list, I've decided to send out the Welcome Message or some version thereof periodically (this time by hand - I'll see about having it automated in future). The point is simply to remind subscribers of the main focus of the Poetics List etc. Things seem to be going well around here - I appreciate everyone's patience with the mailhub failure last month; all of the fallout from that problem has been cleared away. In particular, I want to thank everyone for not inundating me with questions etc. in what I know was probably a time of at least irritating uncertainty. Well, it was for me, anyway. Thanks, too, for helping to keep the list manageable. As most of you probably realize, moderating the PL isn't my full-time job; that's why messages are forwarded only once or twice a day. The closer we stay to list topics - with the occasional welcome diversions, of course - the easier it is for me to keep up with the list. A few small requests: # Please remember to excerpt selectively from previous posts. By so doing, you could help save the vision or lower the blood pressure of our fine digest subscribers. Anyway, internet access may be 'free' for some of us, but ultimately words = bits = electricity = natural resources. # Remember to clearly state the date, time, and location (incl. the city and/or country as applicable) in reading/event announcements. thanks, Chris Christopher W. Alexander poetics list moderator ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 08:48:43 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Hilton Manfred Obenzinger Subject: Re: Now I remember In-Reply-To: <19990302211253.26888.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Ron -- Mark Twain already dubbed the Long Island farmer on board the Quaker City the "poet lariat" in The Innocents Abroad. His poems were of extraordinary terribleness approaching the sublime -- and the actual character published them after the trip. I don't remember his name right now, but I think the book was "Poems of a Long Island Farmer." In any case, I suppose Twain would let you be the next poet lariat -- but you would have to write such horrible stuff that it would be wonderful. Are you up for it? Hilton Obenzinger On Tue, 2 Mar 1999, Ron Silliman wrote: > It's in "Disappearance of the Word, Appearance of the World," in Das > Neue Satz > > If I started a school of cowboy language poets, > could I become poet lariat? > > Ron > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 19:02:41 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Charles Alexander Subject: Re: Now I remember In-Reply-To: <19990302211253.26888.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" depends on the jingle of your spurs >If I started a school of cowboy language poets, >could I become poet lariat? > >Ron --- charles alexander :: poet and book artist :: chax@theriver.com chax press :: alexander writing/design/publishing books by artists' hands :: web sites built with care and vision http://alexwritdespub.com/chax :: http://alexwritdespub.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 11:02:36 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkward Ubutronics Subject: Re: Now I remember MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm afraid the recently passed to the great bucktooth saloon in the sky, Jack Spandrift has coralled those honors. Slim St And Ron Silliman wrote: > > It's in "Disappearance of the Word, Appearance of the World," in Das > Neue Satz > > If I started a school of cowboy language poets, > could I become poet lariat? > > Ron > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 12:05:31 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Steven Shoemaker Subject: transparent pig In-Reply-To: <19990302210131.20166.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Although I'm generally sympathetic to critques of the ideology of "transparency" in language, I have to admit I do have a sort of nagging reservation on this point. Maybe "transparency" isn't the right word, but there's a certain kind of experience I've had in reading poetry where the sense of contact is so immediate that the word does, in some sense, seem to have "disappeared." It's not my "usual" way of reading, and it has nothing to do with the Stephen King sort of transparency, and I suppose it tends to come at moments that are in some way epiphanic. It also--here's the paradox--requires supreme attention to language on the author's part. It isn't easy to think of an example off the top of my head--and it wld probably be impossible to point to specific lines anyway, since what I'm talking about probably has more to do with a certain reading *state*, something perhaps related to a spell or trance. Moments in Whitman, or Reznikoff, or Neruda come to mind... Anybody else go along with this? steve ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 12:50:29 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: David Kellogg Subject: Bibliographic inquiry: Vancouver conference MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A student of mine needs to learn as much as she can about the 1963 Vancouver poetry conference as quickly as possible for a class report. What are the best sources? Everything I've picked up on the event has been culled from biographies and pieces of interviews. Thanks in advance. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ David Kellogg Duke University kellogg@acpub.duke.edu Program in Writing and Rhetoric (919) 660-4357 Durham, NC 27708 FAX (919) 660-4381 http://www.duke.edu/~kellogg/ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 10:54:48 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Billy Little Subject: Re: POETICS Digest - 23 Feb 1999 to 24 Feb 1999 (#1999-32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" you say tomayto he say tomahto potahto potayto the dead enjoy these quibbles hey muriel you're the greatest you should have got the nobel prize but i guess that word vagina looked more dangerous than dynamite forbidden plateau fallen body dojo 4 song st. nowhere, b.c. V0R1Z0 canadaddy ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 15:21:08 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetry Project Subject: new poets, poems, features Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" New work by Linh Dinh Shannon Ketch Gena Mason Ange Mlinko Camille Roy in "Poets & Poems" at the Poetry Project website: http://www.poetryproject.com ALSO in the "Features" section "The Cyber-Journeys of Jeff Clark": The travels of a young poet through the worlds of the Electronic Discussion List AND Barbara Henning's "Interview with Harryette Mullen" FORTHCOMING SOON: "The Tiny Press Center" with reviews, mentions, testimonials, contact information of small journals, chapbooks and other publications (tiny size, price or print run--big impact) Send us your tiny publications! To: The Tiny Press Center The Poetry Project St. Mark's Church 131 E. 10th St. New York, NY 10003 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 15:36:16 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: David Zauhar Subject: Re: Now I remember In-Reply-To: <19990302211253.26888.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Tue, 2 Mar 1999, Ron Silliman wrote: > It's in "Disappearance of the Word, Appearance of the World," in Das > Neue Satz > > If I started a school of cowboy language poets, > could I become poet lariat? > > Ron The official house organ of CoBo LangPo, L=A=S=S=O, features a roundtable discussion of the politics related to the selection of poet lariat. Highlights can be found at their L=A=S=S=O: http://www.getalonglittledoggy.com/~lariat. Dave Zauhar ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 16:08:10 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Pritchett,Patrick @Silverplume" Subject: Re: Naropa Poetry Reading MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain > Anselm Hollo > Anne Waldman > & Andrew Schelling > > Introduced by Laura Wright, Josepha Conrad & Danielle Poitras (all Kerouac > School MFA grads) > > Saturday March 13, at 8 PM, Naropa PAC > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 15:50:56 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: George Bowering Subject: Re: c=o=w=b=o=y poetry In-Reply-To: <19990302211253.26888.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >If I started a school of cowboy language poets, >could I become poet lariat? > >Ron You have certainly spurred my interest in the project. George Bowering. , 2499 West 37th Ave., Vancouver, B.C., Canada V6M 1P4 fax: 1-604-266-9000 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 17:53:54 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: pete spence Subject: Re: Now I remember Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain > >It's in "Disappearance of the Word, Appearance of the World," in Das >Neue Satz > >If I started a school of cowboy language poets, >could I become poet lariat? > >Ron > only if you give yon reader enough rope//pete spence >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 20:06:57 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: david bromige Subject: o, sure, "now I remember" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Silliman "remembers" only after Little-Bromige forward their files of his "Uncompleted [R.Silliman] " concordance. He also appears to have raided Billy's joke book ("for the "poet-lariat" quip). Anyway, I am really posting only because I'm afraid my last b-c to you, R Silliman, didnt go thru; I had posted it to one of those forbidden eddresses, not out of my usual sense of mischief, but my usual sense of inadvertance. Ron, if you are listening, could you let me know to what edress to forward? Thanks, and thanks all for putting up with this intrusion (given that you have)> David. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 00:31:27 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: William Slaughter Subject: Mudlark MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII New and On View: Mudlark Poster No. 16 (1999) * * * * * Two Poems by Simon Perchik "Your white shirt too white, its buttons" "Like a warden at the evening meal" Simon Perchik's poems have appeared everywhere: in "big" magazines such as American Poetry Review, The Nation, The New Yorker, Partisan Review, and Poetry, for example; and from "small" presses. Among others, the Elizabeth, Scarecrow, White Pine, and Dusty Dog presses have published his books over the years. Pavement Saw Press will release _Hands Collected: The Books of Simon Perchik_ in Fall 1999. Perchik lives in East Hampton, Long Island. * * * * * Spread the word. Far and wide, William Slaughter _________________ MUDLARK An Electronic Journal of Poetry & Poetics Never in and never out of print... E-mail: mudlark@unf.edu URL: http://www.unf.edu/mudlark ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 08:45:25 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maria Damon Subject: Re: Now I remember In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 8:48 AM -0800 3/3/99, Hilton Manfred Obenzinger wrote: His poems were of extraordinary terribleness approaching the sublime thanks for that lovely phrase. it begins to get at what i find so appealing about "doggerel," especially on a subject of emotional importance to the writer. it's been hard for me to get across to folks why this stuff is significant to me and why i want to write about it, but this phrase helps. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 18:53:42 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Chris Piuma Subject: flim 3/4 (tv or not tv?) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" .........flim: a free page........ a journal of short, quirky writing Happened before, it will happen again. There's a shiny new issue of flim out at www.flim.com. Volume three, issue four dares to ask the question: "Would you like to win a piece of authentic art?" Yup, while reading this month's selections of oddball poetic miniatures you -- yes you -- can win a print by talented young artist Manny Saenz-Reyes. (And don't forget about last issue's contest, where you could win a copy of Dodie Bellamy and Bob Harrison's masterpiece of smut, "Broken English" -- you have until 15 March to enter! www.flim.com/flim/flim0303.html) In this issue of flim, Lawrence Upton acts like a cartoon ("'If you were the enemy, would you know? Please take a leaflet.'") while Ron Henry divulges what's happening today on cable ("Cult classic about a suicidal young man and a vivacious elderly woman. And the news, once broken, is devastating to Marge his room and make you read his privacy statement ("In Munich, at least two prominent Germans are not charismatic perennial question: tv or not tv? Oh, and there's always letters! So swing on by www.flim.com -- and remember: you can't win if you can't read. -- flim: a free page is always scanning the neighbordhood looking for submissions. Any original piece of writing (in paragraphs, not verse) from 50-600 words will be considered, the quirkier the better. Previous issues have included jokes, recipes, prose poems, reviews, letters to the editor, parodies, rewritings of older texts, randomly splayed bits of punctuation, and translations of articles from previous issues. flim is edited by Chris Piuma [editor@flim.com]. It is available in both print and online editions. -- Chris Piuma, etc. http://www.flim.com "Autonomy and freedom, the alpha and omega of army practice today ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 10:49:54 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Eric Gleason, aka Agent Sunshine" Subject: music MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: MULTIPART/ALTERNATIVE; BOUNDARY="Boundary_(ID_s2U+Wt3jAF9kfDwgjEUGGQ)" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_s2U+Wt3jAF9kfDwgjEUGGQ) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT chax, a while ago you posted about blues and tragic love, somehting like that. i replied but i don't think my reply ever went to the list. tried to backchannel but i didn't have yr address. i'd love to know more of what you're getting at if you want to hit me backchannel. This post shamelessly copied from a bbs. The line about the reasons the woman played half-naked caught me.... eryque From _The Guinness Book of Music Facts and Feats_. It's the side of music they try not to teach us. The subject is, "The Longest Instrumental Work." It's about a piece by Satie titled Vexations. Here's part of the article... "It consists of a 52 beat unbarred idea, with the indication 'Tres lent,' played 840 times with as little variation as possible. The first performance, organised by John Cage at the Pocket Theatre, New York, in 1963, lasted 18 hours and 12 minutes and was performed by a group of ten pianists in relay. Since then there have been many other performances: the second was in Berlin during August 1966 at which a relay of six pianists took part: for her second stint Charlotte Moorman introduced a novel way of breaking the monotony by appearing unclothed from the waist up. Her reasons were both musicological and financial: Satie, it is said, " loved nudity", and John Cage bet her $100 she wouldn't do it. On this occasion the performance of the music took 18 hours and 40 minutes." ...it goes on to mention a performance done in England (I think) that took 24 hours, by one performer... and another that was done in Australia, another attempt to play the whole thing by one performer, that had to end after only 17 hours - the performer was taken to hospital in a coma. --Boundary_(ID_s2U+Wt3jAF9kfDwgjEUGGQ) Content-type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
chax, a while ago you posted about blues and tragic love, somehting like that.  i replied but i don't think my reply ever went to the list.  tried to backchannel but i didn't have yr address.  i'd love to know more of what you're getting at if you want to hit me backchannel.
 
This post shamelessly copied from a bbs.  The line about the reasons the woman played half-naked caught me....
 
eryque
 
From _The Guinness Book of Music Facts and
Feats_.  It's the side of music they try not to teach us.  The subject is, "The
Longest Instrumental Work." It's about a piece by Satie titled Vexations.
Here's part of the article...
 
"It consists of a 52 beat unbarred idea, with the indication 'Tres lent,'
played 840 times with as little variation as possible. The first performance,
organised by John Cage at the Pocket Theatre, New York, in 1963, lasted 18
hours and 12 minutes and was performed by a group of ten pianists in relay.
Since then there have been many other performances: the second was in Berlin
during August 1966 at which a relay of six pianists took part: for her second
stint Charlotte Moorman introduced a novel way of breaking the monotony by
appearing unclothed from the waist up. Her reasons were both musicological
and financial: Satie, it is said, " loved nudity", and John Cage bet her $100
she wouldn't do it. On this occasion the performance of the music took 18
hours and 40 minutes."
 
...it goes on to mention a performance done in England (I think) that took
24 hours, by one performer... and another that was done in Australia, another
attempt to play the whole thing by one performer, that had to end after only
17 hours - the performer was taken to hospital in a coma.
 
 
--Boundary_(ID_s2U+Wt3jAF9kfDwgjEUGGQ)-- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 10:13:32 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkward Ubutronics Subject: Bob Holman is all wet MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is your chance to catch Bob Holman in his element. As he interviews Maria Damon & Miekal And. About the everyplace known as Literature Nation. http://poetry.miningco.com Bring your umbrella & something to sip. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 10:05:38 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Brian Lucas Subject: Joanne Kyger & Gerrit Lansing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Honey from the Rock, or Goo Stew Thousand-petalled cascades from the Orchards of Sleep Skeleton-echo preserved in glass, the Dark Grammarian grey-haired, in black ---a blue oak divined in well-bottom his Heavenly Tree a Great Form without Shape Gerrit Lansing last night at the Poetry Project. No one should've missed it--and many, thankfully, didn't. A great reed boat dropped him off at the lectern, a flock of seraphim took him back to Gloucester. The Tree he lives in, for decades--through the Boston axis--where's he been, where have we been? --grows upward, out from the groin, partaking of spherical musics, cloud-manna. Joanne Kyger was next, a welcome blast of Bolinas beachlounging--the thunder blasting behind her--"I'll wait for Zeus to finish..."--pure California iceplant farmer, scouting white foams for bodhi leaf. Dark glasses she wore were actually satellite dishes picking up the quiet descriptive transmissions that eventually appears in the pomes. Damn fine clarity. I wanted to go back home with "Miss Kids" for tea--Stinson Beach huts appearing off to her side-- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 11:16:51 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Subject: Re: Page Mothers Reading / Silliman MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This message hobbled over to me with a delivery error - hence couldn't come through to the list directly. The "spacer" indicates message status, certainly not a judgement on the content! Chris ------------------------ Message in error (61 lines) -------------------------- From: "Ron Silliman" Subject: Re: Page Mothers Reading Date: Wed, 03 Mar 1999 12:03:28 PST This has to be the single best list I've ever seen for a reading. I do hope somebody there will report both this event & the conference in full to those of us in the hinterlands. Ron Silliman ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 11:12:46 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rebecca Wolff Subject: Re: transparent pig In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" What's wrong with the Steven King sort of transparency? I do believe it is not unconnected to the later "trance, or spell" that you refer to in the sense that there is undeniably something freakishly supernatural about subjectivity when it seems objective. Assuming that's what you meant by Steven King sort of transparency. Let me back up: could someone just give me a short treatise on past critiques of "transparency"; what's the trope? Rebecca ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 11:24:29 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: Re: transparent pig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain i think that Steven is on to something here that i often think about (even write about) - & too don't know that 'transparency' is the best word for it for me, my early experiences of listening to Cage's Etudes Australes had somethingof this effect in another medium - but i think i've had similar experiences with even the most material of reading; Finnegans Wake, Tender Buttons, "A"-22/23 - i think that what Steven is getting at is something like what Charles Peirce was talking about when he spoke of "firstness" perhaps this only seems like an epiphany b/c most of our time is spent in other senses of relationship to the world/ourselves i've been persuing some of these types of questions with the particpants in Peirce-L - specifically i brought up Pound's famous 'three types of poetry' [melo- phano- logo-] and explored the analogy to Peirce's categories - other members of Peirce-L suggested using his semeiotic instead of his categories w/relation to Pound - i'm pursuing that at present )L ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 12:22:52 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Linda Russo Subject: Re: transparent pig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit when I think "transparent poet" and "dissappearing words" this morning I think Notley, whose long poems get very trance-like, and who, according to her 1992 intro to _the Scarlet Cabinet_, a co-collection of texts with Douglas Oliver, wants to get back to "essences," to be "invisible" so as to stop filling the world with more "man-made" material (she calls it "detritus" and I think lovingly of very "opaque" (but not dense or in-sensible) material-cluttered poems -- But even Stein can be read "transparently"). maybe the problem with the word "transparency" is it's too value-laden and implies that the artifice it's meant to conceal is negative ("oh she's so transparent"). Notley prefers "invisible" as opposed to the non-visible, & mabye Steven, this is close to what you're getting at. Notley's "escape" to the invisible is not an escape to the transparent "self" -- the "I" that so many self-posessed lyrics assume, but to the "air" -- the group of the oral tradition, a medium that's so "transparent" that it's not visible, yet so utterly "visible" that it doesn't need (written) words! Incredible! So, what's "wrong" with King in this context: made-for-t.v./mediation/cluttered commercial time vs. made-for-people/in Notley's ideal unmediated -- "Things must be thouht out & saved in the air [and not on the air-waves], in order to do less harm to the world" As for critique Marjorie Perloff's "Against Transparency" would be an obvious place to start (published in her 1991 collection _Radical Artifice_) ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 12:47:13 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: sylvester pollet Subject: 1999 MLA Session Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear Chris et al, I'm forwarding this at the request of Barry Ahearn. He has had a few more responses, but not yet enough to make the session go, so jump in. Please reply to him, not to list nor me. best, Sylvester >From: barry ahearn >Organization: Tulane University Dept. of English >Subject: 1999 MLA Session >To: EPOUND-L@MAINE.MAINE.EDU > >> The call for papers for one of the Pound Society sessions at the 1999 >> MLA, "Pound's Tribalisms," has received a single response. Therefore I >> am extending the deadline to March 15. Here is the call once again: >> "Pound's Tribalisms. Pound's interest in aspects of tribal behavior; >> Pound as a figure around whom a 'tribe' gathered. Ten-page papers, >> abstracts, or proposals by 15 March 1999 to Barry Ahearn." Send them to >> me c\o Department of English, Tulane University, New Orleans LA 70118. >> If you want to submit an abstract or proposal via e-mail, feel free to >> do so. >> >> Barry Ahearn > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 10:05:09 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Pete Neufeld Subject: I wanted to invite you and Yedda MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" to the ATTIC on Saturday March 13th (5pm) where I'll be reading with Sarah Mangold. Hope the two of you can make it. Pete ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 14:12:37 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Prageeta Sharma Subject: Fwd: events Comments: To: aaron7k@hotmail.com, AngeM@ilx.com, angus_forbes@hotmail.com, baltazar23@hotmail.com, mzurawsk@stern.nyu.edu, jeffconant@hotmail.com, msharma@idea.cambridge.edu, dayspeak@hotmail.com, evans@siam.org, ALRF@aol.com, Pjfsk8s@aol.com, sorgerh@ruderfinn.com, jarnot@pipeline.com, ksb30@columbia.edu, quentinc@microsoft.com, Gill8land@aol.com, hdmcgowan@yahoo.com, hsorger@earthlink.net, JennS@corbis.com, Vanillaban@aol.com, karenb@nytimes.com, shark@erols.com, TDevaney@brooklyn.cuny.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part0_920574757_boundary" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --part0_920574757_boundary Content-ID: <0_920574757@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII --part0_920574757_boundary Content-ID: <0_920574757@inet_out.mail.AOL.COM.2> Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: inline Return-Path: Received: from rly-yc02.mx.aol.com (rly-yc02.mail.aol.com [172.18.149.34]) by air-yc01.mail.aol.com (v56.26) with SMTP; Thu, 04 Mar 1999 14:08:47 -0500 Received: from medisg.Stanford.EDU (medisg.stanford.edu [171.65.28.5]) by rly-yc02.mx.aol.com (vx) with SMTP; Thu, 04 Mar 1999 14:08:30 -0500 Received: from imo23.mx.aol.com (imo23.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.67]) by medisg.Stanford.EDU (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA10300 for ; Thu, 4 Mar 1999 11:07:55 -0800 (PST) From: PRAPRA@AOL.COM Received: from PRAPRA@aol.com by imo23.mx.aol.com (IMOv19.3) id 5JDIa15952 for ; Thu, 4 Mar 1999 14:07:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 14:07:05 EST To: rockers@medisg.Stanford.EDU Subject: events X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Hello Everyone I will give you an update of some events happening in March that have to do with your friend Prageeta Sharma and her friends which are also your friends too. I apologize in advance for any inconvenience and shameless self-promotion and promotion in general. Prageeta Sharma is reading at the Asian American Writer's Workshop on March 11, at 7:30 (i think-- more info later) at 37 St. Marks Place. Book Party at Prageeta's place for Jeff Conant's book The Evacuated Forest Papers (Buck Down Books) on March 13 at 8pm. flyer to come! The Sleeves (Maggie, Jeanne, & Prageeta) will be playing a St. Patrick's Show at The Charleston Bar in Brooklyn. flyer to come! Maggie Zurawski and Prageeta Sharma read at The New College in San Francisco March 19. Please e-mail me for more info and I will post more info soon about the events very soon. Best Wishes! Prageeta Sharma --part0_920574757_boundary-- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 16:24:57 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: ACGOLD01@ULKYVM.LOUISVILLE.EDU Subject: Levine on transparency Sorry I've forgotten who it was who asked for Phil Levine references--but anyway, the passage that Mark Prejsnar mentions (the desire for a poem where the words are invisible) is indeed from a Levine interview, and it's cited in the middle of a couple of pages on Levine in Marjorie Perloff's *Radical Artifice.* Far be it from me to correct Ron on his own oeuvre, but I don't think he cites it in "Disappearance of the Word," though granted he does mention Saul Bellow as a novelist of the disappeared or invisible word. (OK, "near be it to me," since I've just done it.) Alan ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 17:29:52 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Erik Sweet Subject: "Tool a Magazine" # 2 for SALE! Now! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Is is finally here folks! Yes it is! "Tool a Magazine" Issue Number 2 available now for 7$ pp mailorder to: P.O. Box 3125, Albany NY 12203. Checks payable to: Erik Sweet or Lori Quillen. Support our magazine and the great poets we publish by purchasing this fine issue, paid for straight out of the pockets of the editors, which includes: Alice Notley, Clark Coolidge, Paul Metcalf, Hoa Nguyen, Kenneth Koch Chandler Lewis,Mallarme trans. by William Marsh, Jorge Clar, Dale Smith, Brian Lucas, Eleni Sikelianos, Brenda Coultas, John Bennett, John Latta, Travis Ortiz, Rod Smith, Chris McCreary, Randy Prunty, Todd Moore, Pamela Lu, Summi Kaipa, Phil Good, and pictures by Kevin Opstedal and Brenda Iijima, plus more. Please order now as our first issue went rather fast! Erik and Lori ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 16:28:29 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Safdie Joseph Subject: McNaughton in Seattle, Vancouver MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Billy Little recently nominated Duncan McNaughton's "Black Spoon" for the long poem list that was going around recently. Here's a snippet: ____________________________________________________________ some bugle to wake up the nation some furious trumpet to wake up the town what they used to call the city when they used to call it pretty now it's dirty from its tuque to its boot it only needs to shake off the dust dusty ash from a smoking moon fallen dusty ash from some burned-out suns that's why spirit weeps at the crossroads that's why lips glisten with tears that's why she cut out su lengua when she opens her mouth to sing she makes the sound of water gurgling down a harsh drain Federico asked to pin a gaudy orange pomegranate flower to her black tunic of mail he brought a smile to her lips glistening with tears sus labios reluciendo con lagrimas les fontaines de jouvence some old negro gardener who tends that tree up and down San Antonio ya se va by the name of Khidr he plays that long slender flute that ney of Konya which echoes inside some tomb its emerald roof domed against an ice blue sky __________________________________________________________ Since Valparaiso (where that poem appears) was published in 1995, Duncan has published three more books, Kicking the Feather, The Wrapped Church, and the new another set / of circumstance from hawkhaven press in San Francisco. Bob Creeley recently commented, somewhat incredulously, that an audience for McNaughton's work was still slow in forming. Residents of or visitors to the Pacific Northwest will soon have a chance to add themselves to that rare group, as Duncan will be reading in Seattle (with Joe Safdie) on Tuesday, March 16 at Open Books 2414 N. 45th St. 7:00 PM and three days later in Vancouver, at 8 PM, where he'll be delivering a lecture at Capilano College, previously advertised on this list. ("In this lecture Duncan McNaughton will discuss the relationship between poetry, history, and geography, arguing there is no history without geography, and that poetry as a form is central to contemporary thought. He will read from and speak to the work in his most recent book, another set / of circumstance. (hawkhaven).") That's in Room 148, Cedar Building, Capilano College, 2055 Purcell Way, North Vancouver All within possible reach of these events are encouraged to show themselves at the respective doors . . . ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 20:27:58 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: REVIEW of "difference/indifference" - Roth & Katz Comments: To: silence MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" [silence] / poetix are (m)any of you familiar with this book ? _difference/indifference musings on postmodernism, marcel duchamp and john cage_ introduction and text by Moira Roth, commentary by Jonathan D. Katz i found it troubling in the abstract i think these sorts of inquiry are quite valid and ought to be pursued in the service of increasing out knowledge and understanding of artistic (& other sorts of) figures Roth's piece on Duchamp as "dandy" is interesting and has a certain amount of explanatory force - her paper entitled "The Aesthetic of Indifference" which focuses on Cage, Rauschenberg, Cunningham, Johns and Duchamp as precursor/model the thesis seems to be that "indifference" - toward politics - toward social issues - etc - was a front for having no way to respond to the repressive climate of the 50s/coldwar/McCarthy etc her study also seems to take for granted that an historical explanation is not only called for, or revealing in some ways, but The Explanation she talks about Rauschenberg's *White Paintings* and speaks of Cage's 'haiku-like response' to them - here is the Cage text she cites (in abbreviated form? it's from Kostelanetz ed. _John Cage_ p.111 - i haven't had the chance to check it out yet); To whom No subject No image No taste No object No beauty No message No talent No technique (no why) No idea No intention No art No feeling... Roth calls this "an unconscious tragic acknowledgement of total paralysis" (p.41) next she says "Cage would object to such an interpretation. He would, I believe, argue that the denial of conventional meaning was in order to allow a different sort of meaning to emerge: that he was interested in the 4'33" piece, for example, in getting the audience to make music/sound rather than merely listen passively. But the negativity and passivity of such works cannot be disassociated from the historical moment at which they were produced." (ibid) the 1st thing that jumps out is the "getting the audience to make music/sound rather than merely listen" - is she saying 'make music' in the sense of 'find the music in the sounds occuring' or is she suggesting people hum or beat on chairs ? ignoring that qualm, how is the music negative and passive if it's also a call for people to act, to attend to sound, as an irreducible thing (& thus a positive) - as to whether things can be disassociated from their historical moment - i'd argue that they *can* and in fact *are* daily - whether this is a *good* thing or just a fact i don't mean to say (as i don't know) Katz disputes Roth's reading of an "aethetic of indiference" and contrasts his of a "Politics of Negation" and recuperates the same complex of actions attitudes etc as a queer strategy in a straight hegemony - this reading (especially re Johns) i found initially much more interesting - only to be troubled by other things Katz (p.148); " Cage sought, in his words "to just erase the difference between art and life. Through the trope of silence, Cage thought he had found one such eraser. But if we examine closely the validity of this claim, we will find that it didn't quite work out as Cage would have us believe. The efficacy of Cage's silence as an aesthetic trope is in fact entirely dependant on its distinctly artistic context. Outside the concert hall, silence just doesn't sound the same. Given that in art and liofe there are separate signifying environments for silence, it follows then that we have to recognize a distinction between Cage's theory of silence annd the everyday practice of it--art, in short, is different from life. While it is certainly true that Cage advocated an erasure of this distinction, it is equally true that he didn't succeed. As I see it, he couldn't have; no one can. Context seems to be a determinant,and art, even art that claims its identity with life, simply can't will it away." Katz then moves thru the possibilities that postmodernism offers suggesting that he could 'deconstruct these art/life, theory/praxis binaries, and argue...in favor of the mutual implicativeness of these terms' - he decides against this as he judges that the binaries do important work and because contesting terms that he uses would be 'disingenuous'. next he exercises another route to "mitigate this life/art distiction through refernce to Cage's works themselves" - saying that perhapos Cage's work canot be properly confined to the realm of art - this notion he feels is dashed by "an even glancing acquaintence with Cage studies" which shows that such interests are "what we can agree to call, with suitable embarassment, 'high culture,' a term used precisely for its ability to mark a difference from everyday life" (p.149) "Thus in the face of our objections--themselves inspired in part by Cage's own visions--is it the case that his art does remain ineffably different from life and his theory from his practice? Or at least, in the ordinary world where all of us actually live? And is any attempt to deny this difference at best false consciousness, and at worst a seducton away from the materialist realities of an often inequitable social practice toward the seductive phantasm of an art utopia." (ibid.) these passages and the whole of this book seems based on a misunderstanding of what silence means for Cage, Katz writes "silence is thematized, made palpable as a silencing." (p.53) - does this make any sense as a description of the one's experinec of 4'33' ? - i think not Katz wants to be able to treat Cage's music and ideas as 'objects suitable for subsequent analysis' (Cage) instead of registering that they are processes that take place in the 'ordinary world where all of us actually live' - his inability to see that 4'33' is (or could be) still going on - is not bounded by its time markings - is why his otherwise very perceptive analysis sails past its object someplace i read a paper about Duchamp's Three Standard Stoppages - the author pointed out that three were *needed* - one wd be an alternate - two an either/or - but three, three was the beginning of multiplicity - Katz, in his feints toward deconstruction (when it serves his argument) illustrates a tendancy toward and then away from One and Two - but like a binary that Cage accepted; object/process, and those Katz seems to feel are 'disingenuous' not to continue using; art/life, theory/practice - i wd like to suggest that our experience is never monadic, rarely dyadic, but resolutely triadic - a fact that allows us to use terms like art and life and have no need to take issue with binaries at all but there are interesting things in the book other than these articles i've had so much trouble with - interviews with Vito Acconci, Robert Smithson, George Segal and Cage as well as a piece by Roth on the art of Shigeko Kubuto that has me interested learn more finally i wonder - on page 48 there is aphotograph of "a serious game of skee-ball in Dillon's Bar" - identified in the caption are Johns, Anna Moreska, Rauschenberg, Cunningham and Cage - but there is another figure - between Moreska and Johns - November 10, 1959 - could that over-exposed forehead mark Frank O'Hara ? )L ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 12:58:00 +1100 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: komninos zervos Subject: Re: BARDFEST 99 Berks County ~ Reading, Pennsylvania MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Poetry that performs itself: Cyberpoetry at the State Library Renowned Melbourne-born poet Komninos Zervos has just commenced a unique new project as Cyberpoet in Residence at Experimedia at the State Library. Komninos is one of Australia's most popular performance poets whose most recent work uses colour, movement, sound and text to create cyberpoetry, an exciting new kind of poetry accessible via the Internet. The ten week project, cyberpoet@slv, is the first to be supported by Arts Victoria's 'Incubator', an innovative program that encourages artists to explore the creative possibilities of multimedia technology. 'Over the past four years I've been keen to develop a poetry that performs itself. The multimedia Internet provides the perfect vehicle for my text animations. Cyberpoetry moves in time and space¾it can't be published in traditional print media but it's true to the principles of poetry with words evoking images.' Through cyberpoet@slv Komninos will compile an online database of contemporary Victorian poets and poetry for the State Library of Victoria. He will also create a poetry zine, working with thirty of the poets to present 'cyber' versions of their poems¾sharing his skills with local writers. Victorian poets are invited to contact Komninos to register their interest and be included in the database. They are also welcome to visit him at the Library to see his work and discuss ideas for producing multimedia poetry. The cyberpoet Website will be launched publicly at the State Library on 5 March with a performance by Komninos and a special guest appearance by Mark Amerika, well known Hypertext online digital novelist. Komninos can be contacted by telephone 03 9669 9786, email cyberpoet@slv.vic.gov.au or fax 03 9669 9958. Examples of cyberpoetry can be found on Komninos's site at http://student.uq.edu.au/~s271502/. The project Web site is www.experimedia.vic.gov.au/cyberpoet/ Komninos Zervos is available for interview. For further information please contact: Indra Kurzeme, Experimedia, State Library of Victoria. Tel: 03 9669 9991 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 02:26:35 -0500 Reply-To: levitsk@ibm.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rachel Levitsky Subject: Re: Lewinsky/Lansing/Kyger MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have to say I was very torn but Monica won. Monica has been an important cultural event for me. Monica has no trouble merging her politics with her poetry. I am not joining my voice to those facile mockers; I seriously support this woman who has been so railroaded by the most powerful people in the country and has not only maintained a level of grace in her beautiful zaftig body, but is willing to speak abortion to america, in this dangerous climate. And the line about Bill Clinton's teary eyes is priceless. RD Levitsky Brian Lucas wrote: > > Honey from the Rock, or Goo Stew > > Thousand-petalled cascades from the Orchards of Sleep > > Skeleton-echo preserved in glass, the Dark Grammarian > grey-haired, in black ---a blue oak divined in well-bottom > > his Heavenly Tree a Great Form without Shape > > Gerrit Lansing last night at the Poetry Project. No one should've missed > it--and many, thankfully, didn't. > > A great reed boat dropped him off at the lectern, a flock of seraphim took > him back to Gloucester. The Tree he lives in, for decades--through the > Boston axis--where's he been, where have we been? --grows upward, out from > the groin, partaking of spherical musics, cloud-manna. > > Joanne Kyger was next, a welcome blast of Bolinas beachlounging--the > thunder blasting behind her--"I'll wait for Zeus to finish..."--pure > California iceplant farmer, scouting white foams for bodhi leaf. Dark > glasses she wore were actually satellite dishes picking up the quiet > descriptive transmissions that eventually appears in the pomes. Damn fine > clarity. I wanted to go back home with "Miss Kids" for tea--Stinson Beach > huts appearing off to her side-- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 00:24:31 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: George Bowering Subject: Re: Bibliographic inquiry: Vancouver conference In-Reply-To: <01be659e$536dde60$49cc0398@DKellogg.Dukeedu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >A student of mine needs to learn as much as she can about the 1963 Vancouver >poetry conference There was a copy of the journal _Olson_ that had some stuff from the conference. There was Carol; Berge's scurrilous report published by Fuck You Press. George Bowering. , 2499 West 37th Ave., Vancouver, B.C., Canada V6M 1P4 fax: 1-604-266-9000 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 08:06:08 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Daniel Kane Subject: John Ashbery on WriteNet In-Reply-To: <36DE5CC6.4EE9@mwt.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII There is an interview with John Ashbery up on Teachers & Writers WriteNet site. In it, Ashbery talks sweetly about the process of composition...you can also download a WAV file (takes about 3 minutes) of Ashbery reading his poem "What is Poetry" (from_Houseboat Days_). Go to http://www.writenet.org/poetschat/poetschat_jashbery.html --daniel ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 10:41:02 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Wallace Subject: reading at Bridge Street Books, Sunday March 7 (fwd) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Those of you who will be in Washington, D.C. are welcome to join us on Sunday, March 7 at 8 p.m. at Bridge Street Books (2814 Pennsylvania Ave. NW, next to The Four Seasons Hotel in Georgetown, near the corner of Pennyslvania and M) for a reading by BOB PERELMAN and MARK WALLACE. BOB PERELMAN is the author of ten books of poetry, including the recently published _The Future of Memory_. _Virtual Reality_, _Face Value_, and _The First World_. He has also authored two influential critical studies _The Trouble with Genius: Reading Stein, Joyce, Pound, and Zukofsky_ and _The Marginalization of Poetry: Language Writing and Literary History_. A poet of wit, politics, and passion. John Ashbery writes of Perelman: "Most poets define poetry by creating it. Bob Perelman creates it by defining it, and is thus one step ahead of all the poets under the sun, one step closer to colliding with Zeno's vanishing point, to merging coyote with road runner, to winning the hand." MARK WALLACE is the author of a number of books of poetry, most recently _Nothing Happened and Besides I Wasn't There_ and _Sonnets of a Penny-a-Liner_. His book _Temporary Worker Rides A Subway_ won the 1998 New American Poetry Award and is forthcoming from Sun and Moon. He's going to read some poems but also preview some sections from a novel, _Dead Carnival_, which, with its mindless, loping, zombie-like gait has been following him relentlessly for most of the past decade. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 11:47:03 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: Re: transparent pig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Rebecca you cd find much of the argument against transparency in Silliman (someplace in THE NEW SENTANCE) and Bernstein ("The Artifice of Absorption" in APOETICS) also in Andrews' critical stuff someplace the idea in brief (and thus with potentially large distortions - my apologies to the makers of these arguments) is; that, seemingly transparent language is used to report on the world, represent the way-things-are, etc - b/c of its transparency, its hiding of it's constructedness and ideological assumptions, it is used as tool to maintain power, status quo, etc the issue then becomes - is Stephen King supporting the powers that be thru his use of this "transparent" mode - and the answers differ depending - i think Andrews wd say yes i suspect that in some of these formulations that too much emphasis is placed on the power of form - the 'politics of poetic form' to use the title so well known )L > -----Original Message----- > From: Rebecca Wolff [SMTP:rwolff@ANGEL.NET] > Sent: Thursday, March 04, 1999 11:13 AM > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: transparent pig > > What's wrong with the Steven King sort of transparency? I do believe it is > not unconnected to the later "trance, or spell" that you refer to in the > sense that there is undeniably something freakishly supernatural about > subjectivity when it seems objective. Assuming that's what you meant by > Steven King sort of transparency. > > Let me back up: could someone just give me a short treatise on past > critiques of "transparency"; what's the trope? > > Rebecca ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 17:59:14 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tom Beckett Subject: a.l.nielsen's new book Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit New from Sink Press is A.L. Nielsen's VEXT. One can only wonder what will come nexed. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 11:39:33 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Subject: Two quick announcements / Neufeld MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Had to reformat this a bit. Chris ----------------- Original message (ID=EA1A13FE) (35 lines) ------------------- Message-ID: <81627F2DBCFFD1118FD80008C72434361954FB@kvnnt03> From: Pete Neufeld Subject: Two quick announcements Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 10:17:01 -0800 On March 13th at 5 pm I will be reading with Sarah Mangold at the ATTIC in San Francisco. 5pm on 24th St. across from the BART. The second announcement-- _melodeon poetry systems_ will be releasing Jono Schneider's _Walking & Talking_ next week. The chapbook is $6 plus $1.50 for the postal service plus any off chance of a gratuity that will not be tax deductable. You can make checks payable to me and send them to 3573 19th. St. SF CA 94110. Thanks. Pete ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 06:11:26 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Douglas Organization: Sun Moon Books Subject: Re: Lee Ann Brown, Sun & Moon Comments: cc: djmess@sunmoon.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just got your message on Monday morning. Yes, Lee Ann Brown read at Sun & Moon Press yesterday--a wonderful reading and great conversation. On March 20th, 4:00 p.m. Fanny Howe and her daughter, Danzy Senna will both read from their new novels. This should be quite an event. Please feel free to attend if you're in the area. The salons are held monthly at 6026 Wilshire Blvd., Los Angeles, CA 90036 Douglas Messerli Catherine Daly wrote: > > Is Lee Ann Brown still reading tomorrow afternoon at Sun & Moon? > > I went to her reading at the Rose Cafe. She sang some poems of E.D.'s and her > own, some songs. Her sampler poem (read aloud) reminded me of a poem in Mary > Leader's _Red Signature_, except it seemed so interesting in Brown's > established context, acrostics like cross stitch. She mentioned the Sun & Moon > reading but I seem to have fallen off the mailing list and wasn't paying > attention if it was posted here. > > I was completely blown away by Will Alexander's reading at Beyond Baroque last > night (with Philip Lamantia). I was impressed with Lamantia as expected, but > Alexander read like the apotheosis of Sun Ra. He used some words I love, like > "fulminous". After, I watched something on tv about Monk and slide piano > (Johnson). The Alexander/Lamantia reading seemed a bit hearing the slide > piano in "Thelonius". I have missed his readings at Sun & Moon, but also the > panel/conference at LACMA. > > Rgds, > Catherine Daly > cadaly@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 9 Feb 1999 02:11:21 -0800 Reply-To: jbedford@ull.es Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Juan S. Amador Bedford" Organization: Centro de Comunicaciones y Tecnologías Informáticas Subject: RCEI 20 C American Women Poets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; name="INDEX" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit The _REVISTA CANARIA DE ESTUDIOS INGLESES_ (RCEI) (Gral. Editor: Manuel Brito) has published issue 37 as a monographic number of 239 pages under the title: "Centered Revisions, Decentered Visions: Twentieth-Century American Women Poets", guest edited by Juan S. Amador Bedford. Index: Juan S. Amador Bedford: Introductory Note Stefanie von Berg and Hartmut Lutz: "Pounded Earth and Heartbeats": 20th Century Poetry by Native Women of North America Nancy Berke: Anything That Burns You: The Social Poetry of Lola Ridge, Genevieve Taggard, and Margaret Walker Melba Joyce Boyd: "Prophets for a New Day": The Cultural Activism Margaret Danner, Margaret Burroughs, Gwendolyn Brooks and Margaret Walker During the Black Arts Movement Susana Ch vez-Silverman: Chicana Outlaws: Turning Our (Brown) Backs on La Ley del Pap (cito) Mar¡a Herrera-Sobek: The Nature of Chicana Literature: Feminist Ecological Literary Criticism and Chicana Writers Susan J. Hubert: "A Whole New Poetry Beginning Here": The Poetics/Politics of Adrienne Rich and Audre Lorde Mary Jane Leach-Rudawski: "And Is She A Com-pat-riot?": The Exile of Mina Loy Philip McGowan: Uncovering the Female Voice in Anne Sexton Ann Vickery: Finding Grace: Modernity and the Ineffable in the Poetry of Rae Armantrout and Fanny Howe Cheryl Walker: Reading Elizabeth Bishop as a Religious Poet Laura Wright: Play in the Work of Carla Harryman Liz Yorke: Breaking Through the "Logic of Limits": Adrienne Rich and Radical Complexity Zhou Xiaojing: Breaking from Tradition: Experimental Poems by Four Contemporary Asian American Women Poets Reviews: John M. Bennett: Bipolarity in Sheila E. Murphy's _Teth_ Mar¡a Henr¡quez Betancor: Photographs and Memory: A Chicana Structures Autobiography Jos‚ Rodr¡guez Herrera: Misteries and Nature: Levertov's _Sands of the Well_ Ernesto Su rez Toste: Another Art: Elizabeth Bishop's Life and Watercolors Requests for single issues should be addressed to the Secretariado de Publicaciones, Universidad de La Laguna, Campus Central, La Laguna, Tenerife, Islas Canarias, Espa¤a. Price: $12.00 (U.S. dollars) to be paid by international bank cheque made out to the "Secretariado de Publicaciones". RCEI is published twice yearly, in April and November. The Revista Canaria de Estudios Ingleses is scanned, indexed, or abstracted by the following: Annual Bibliography of English Language and Literature, BD-ISOC, Indice Espa¤ol de Humanidades, Info-Latinoam‚erica (ILA), Institute for Scientific Information, Linguistics Abstracts On-Line, Linguistics and Language Behavior Abstracts, MLA International Bibliography, and Ulrich's International Peridodicals Directory. For additional information on subscriptions and submissions please visit our web page: http://www.ull.es/publicaciones/rcei ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 10:48:49 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Judy Roitman Subject: Re: REVIEW of "difference/indifference" - Roth & Katz In-Reply-To: <5D5C5C8C3A41D211893900A024D4B97C3D61F6@md.facstaff.oglethorpe.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > To whom No subject No image No taste No object No beauty No message No talent No technique (no why) No idea No intention No art No feeling...> Sounds like a riff on the heart sutra to me. Anybody know for sure? But for sure it ain't a haiku-like response. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Judy Roitman | "Whoppers Whoppers Whoppers! Math, University of Kansas | memory fails Lawrence, KS 66045 | these are the days." 785-864-4630 | fax: 785-864-5255 | Larry Eigner, 1927-1996 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Note new area code ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.math.ukans.edu/~roitman/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 11:17:53 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Pritchett,Patrick @Silverplume" Subject: Re: a.l.nielsen's new book MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Aldon Nielsen's VEXT is vexing indeed, as only poetry that rubs you all the right ways can be. The lyric here is taken to the mat. Only to be declared the winner. Enter pathos. "But this This particular sweetness Was not then To be had." ("Imputation") Till slapstick makes the most of its numerous cameos. "We've got a bad code And we can't seem to shake it." ("Language - Nudity - Violence") Has Nielsen "gone Hollywood"? VEXT frolics with the rhetoric of the Biz, its absurdities, it self-gloryings. This is the world we live in - not the world, but the words for the world. Everywhere, the framing properties of language come up against their reflection in the mirror. Hello, nice to see you again. Didn't know you were in town. Like Harpo Marx's Lacanian schtick. Rumors of transparency. This Bud's for you. "The eye always sways across mixing but Accretion comes refusing content" ("Interlalia") The sweet desultory impenetrable nexus of all our days of words, numbered. So that to speak at all is truly to be vexed. Sound the high note anyhow, then the low. "By this untelling I have annexed A space worried from speech." ("Glottophagia") There's a singular elegance and intelligence and a truly delicious wit at work here. VEXT is a perpetual delight from any point to the next. (The preceding has been an announcement of itself. No animals were intended during its production). Patrick Pritchett ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 13:33:00 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: query JOSHUA BECKMAN MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain met this fella some time back can't seem to score an email for him can someone help ? )L ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 15:42:10 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Steven Clay Subject: Jack Spicer's GOLEM Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" Granary Books announces the publication of Golem by Jack Spicer with collages by Fran Herndon and an afterword by Kevin Killian. The manuscript of Spicer's Golem poems was discovered by Fran Herndon and Kevin Killian in 1997 in a "...dog-eared manila folder. The first poem in this series saw print-in the 'Spicer issue' of Manroot-only because Lew Ellingham had copied it onto a brown paper bag after Spicer posted in on the wall of Gino & Carlo's bar. That it had any successors few guessed or knew." The seven images accompanying the six poems are from Herndon's "Sports Collages," her "painterly re-working of pop images cut from the pages of Sports Illustrated and other mass-market magazines...." "Spicer and Herndon draw on [the] complex legend [of the golem] to animate their conception of the athlete-and poet-as hero and monster, corpse and avenger. For these artists, the corruption of innocence under the nexus of capital is as simple as, and as confounding as, a 'fix.'" (All quotes from the afterword.) Golem is designed and printed letterpress by Philip Gallo at the Hermetic Press. The images are beautifully reproduced, digitally, in full color. The edition consists of 150 copies signed by Fran Herndon and bound at the Campbell Logan Bindery in paper over boards. 5 1/2" x 8 1/2", 20 pp. One hundred copies are for sale. $150. The poems, images and afterword can be seen at: http://www.granarybooks.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 13:22:54 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Don Cheney Subject: Amazon.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" check out the Amazon.com url below and skip down to the CUSTOMER COMMENTS for some insightful thoughts on a collection of FAMILY CIRCUS cartoons called _Daddy's Cap Is On Backwards_. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0449148165/002-4894952-1321067 don cheney ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:43:40 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetry Project Subject: readings & tiny presses Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" THIS WEEK! AT THE POETRY PROJECT! Tonight, Friday, March 5 at 10:30 pm Poets Who Rock with Ed Friedman, Alice B. Talkless & Amy Mayhem, Rebecca Moore, David Greenberg, and Lisa Karrer Monday, March 8 at 8 pm Bill Berkson reads solo from his upcoming autobiography "Since When" Wednesday, March 10 at 8 pm Sherman Alexie & U Sam Oeur authors, respectively, of Indian Killer and Sacred Vows AND New on the Website The Tiny Press Center is now here! With essays by Katy Lederer and Renee Gladman in the "Features" section http://www.poetryproject.com There's big, medium, small. And then there's tiny. Coming soon: reviews, contact info & mentions (chapbooks, journals, etc.) so send your tiny publications to us at: The Tiny Press Center St. Mark's Church 131 E. 10th St. New York, NY 10003 poproj@artomatic.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 14:46:16 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Elizabeth Treadwell Subject: Mlinko info? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi, does anyone have contact info for Ange Mlinko? Please b/c, and thanks. Elizabeth T. Outlet Magazine -&- Double Lucy Books P.O. Box 9013, Berkeley, California 94709 U.S.A. http://users.lanminds.com/~dblelucy ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 15:40:35 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Safdie Joseph Subject: Re: Bibliographic inquiry: Vancouver conference Comments: To: George Bowering MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain And there was Muthologos I, with a transcript of a panel discussion at the conference with Olson, Ginsberg, Duncan and Creeley (I don't think Spicer was on that particular panel, but George was probably in the audience, right?) ---------- From: George Bowering [SMTP:bowering@SFU.CA] Sent: Friday, March 05, 1999 12:25 AM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: Bibliographic inquiry: Vancouver conference >A student of mine needs to learn as much as she can about the 1963 Vancouver >poetry conference There was a copy of the journal _Olson_ that had some stuff from the conference. There was Carol; Berge's scurrilous report published by Fuck You Press. George Bowering. , 2499 West 37th Ave., Vancouver, B.C., Canada V6M 1P4 fax: 1-604-266-9000 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 00:41:45 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "A. Jenn Sondheim" Subject: Jew MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII ^ Jew I number. I number them. I number myself among them. I would have been numbered among them. I might have have numbered them. I could have been numbered among them. I was numbered. I was numbered among them. I am numbered. I am numbered among them. (I count myself among them.) (I am counted.) (I am unaccounted for.) (I am unaccountable.) ____________________________________________ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 22:54:10 +1100 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Peter Minter Subject: Australian Poets in NYC - sublet? readings? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear All, A friend and I are travelling from Sydney to NYC for the Barnard conference etc. Does anyone out there know of sublet/accomodation possibilities for the days March 29 through April 15? A very short period of time but any help or advice would be most appreciated. Any information on other readings or events would be great too. Please backchannel if you can help, thanks Peter Minter ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 10:23:27 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Ron Silliman Subject: Bob Rosenthal email address Comments: To: Poetics List MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Does anyone have an email address (or phone) for Bob Rosenthal? Thanks, Ron Silliman ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 12:38:16 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rebecca Wolff Subject: Re: transparent pig In-Reply-To: <5D5C5C8C3A41D211893900A024D4B97C3A72AD@md.facstaff.oglethorpe.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Thanks for all expositions and explanations re: transparency. I have come to believe recently, and this discussion reinforces this formulation for me, that all ideology, all, is merely Taste in Disguise. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 16:58:24 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: sylvester pollet Subject: Kathleen Raine? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Could someone in Poetics land help this enterprising scholar? You could respond directly to him, though I'd like to know the info too, and perhaps others would. Snowing hard here, Sylvester >From: Tmsandefur@aol.com >Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 02:26:00 EST >To: pollet@maine.edu >Mime-Version: 1.0 >Subject: Kathleen Raine > >Greetings! I have been scouring the Internet all night trying to find a way to >contact the poet Kathleen Raine. (In fact, I'm not entirely certain she's >still alive!) I am working on a biography of the late poet/scientist Jacob >Bronowski, whom she knew in her days at Cambridge University, and would like >to get in contact with her. I thought maybe someone at the National Poetry >Foundation would know how I could reach her. Any suggestions? > >TM:$ > >----- >Timothy Sandefur >6128 N. Cedar Ave. >Rialto, CA 92377 > ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 18:50:57 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkward Ubutronics Subject: YOUR help needed!! - Russian artist under prosecution for his art Comments: To: dreamtime@onelist.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: RHIZOME_RAW: YOUR help needed!! - Russian artist under prosecution for his art Date: Sun, 07 Mar 1999 00:24:10 +0300 From: alexei shulgin To: syndicate@aec.at, nettime-i@DESK.NL, nettime@DESK.NL, list@rhizome.org, n5m3-debates-l@waag.org [apologies for cross-postings!] Moscow artist Avdei Ter-Oganian is about to go to prison for his performance "Young Anti-Christ" which he made in last December at "Art Manege" Fair in Moscow. During the peformance he was proposing to the fair visitors to profane mass-produced copies of Orthodox icons and was giving instructions how to do it, i. e. crash with an axe (which was supplied), write obscene words and put obscene drawings on them. Few icons were profaned in this way. The action caused negative response from part of the audience which grew in a scandal. His installation was taken off the wall and further performing was prohibited by the Art Fair director. Moreover, the curator of non-commercial part of the Fair has later lost her job. Avdei’s action attracted a lot of responce in media. Most negative (and very fast) one came from a right-wing oriented TV channel "Moscovia" which devoted few (!!!) programs called "Russian House" to convicting of Avdei and calling to requital. They were accusing him of being a Satan’s envoy, offender of national sanctuaries, Orthodox religion, Russian Nation, fathers’ faith and Russia itself. In these programs all participants of the performance as well as artists and curators who share Avdei’s ethical and aesthetical principles were named (virtuos people should know their enemies!). In TV programs and newspaper articles Russian Orthodox priests openly called for punishment for Avdei. After this massive media attack Moscow City Public Prosecution Department has initiated a case ("Kindling of religeous hatred"). Now Avdei is treatened by 2-4 years of prison. Avdei says about his action: "I am continuing ironical thread in art. My action was a parody on modernism. Using banal gestures of agression towards public, culture, etc. I am coming back to the roots of epatage. This was the main idea of my work and as we can see it absolutely doesn’t fit our orthodox space. Analyzing it from the social and political points of view one can talk about protest against coming back ideology (this time - orthodox), one can talk about unjustice: look - people are not getting salaries for their jobs and at the same time enormous money is being spent on reconstruction of aesthetically miserable Temple of Christ the Redemptor (in Moscow). Orthodox icon was not an accidental choice, It was an attempt to find the painful point of the society. Today, when Russian intelligentsia is turning right without any reflection about that I consider my action as very topical. Intelligentsia was bought by clishes. It’s interesting to try to stop it and make thinking." Advocats of Avdei have their points: his action must be evaluated by art critics and by the Church, but not by the state. He did offend religeous feelings of people but the question is: should true christians reply with forgiveness or should they apply to the Public Prosecution Department? Avdei can be convicted very soon. Besides his personal problem this would bring real danger to the freedom of artistic expression in Russia because it creates the case. You can help now! 1. By writing to Russian Embassy in your country and expressing your attitude to this situation. 2. By acting through media. 3. By writing directly to Moscow City Prosecution Department (Novokuznetskaya Ul. 23A Moscow 113184 Russia) and/or to Khamovniki District Court (7th Rostovsky pereulok 21 Moscow 119121 Russia). Please point "Avdei Ter-Oganian case". 4. By sending emails to for_avdei@easylife.org - they will be forwarded to the above-mentioned institutions. 5. Spreading the word. If you work for an institution please make your letter as offical as possible. If you would like to contact Avdei - his telephone in Moscow: 007-095-2617172 (speaks only Russian). You can also contact him via email through me. You can see one of Avdei’s projects at: http://www.cs.msu.su/wwwart/caw Alexei Shulgin + ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 19:20:53 -0800 Reply-To: minka@grin.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: megan minka lola camille roy Subject: New Langton Arts--- Bay Area Award Show announcement MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi everybody, New Langton Arts in San Francisco has a program for supporting Bay Area writers and poets called the Bay Area Award Show. (Awards are also made in other artistic disciplines.) The award consists of a reading with honorarium. Last years' recipients were Laura Moriarty and Aaron Shurin. The deadline for submission is coming up soon---March 26. If you want guidelines, email me (backchannel) with your snail mail address, and I will send you the brochure. (A submission includes a ten page manuscript). thanks, camille roy &&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&& Go there, get paid, right now, bulls-eye, never before, sure fire: http://www.grin.net/~minka "everything that's said gets swallowed, and that isn't fatalism of the 19th century either." (L. Scalapino) ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 7 Mar 1999 13:58:01 +0200 Reply-To: robert.archambeau@englund.lu.se Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Robert Archambeau Organization: Lunds universitet Subject: Conference Report: Post-War American Poetry/Liege MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just now back in Sweden recovering from a continental tour that included a few days at the Post-War American Poetry Conference at the University of Liege in Belgium. For me the Liege gathering ranks up there with last summer's Anglo-American Poetic Relations Conference in London and the Fall '96 Assembling Alternatives Conference in New Hampshire as one of the best conferences for experimental poetry in the last few years. Paul Hoover kicked things off in the plush and impressive Salle Academique with his talk "Murder and Closure: On the Impression of Reality in American Poetry," in which he asked "How might the ceaselessly closing 'new sentence' and the experimental formalism of language poetry relate to New Formalism and its demands for a return to closed form?" -- a big question,m with a long answer that took us from Oulipo to the present day via Marshall McLuhan and Walter Benjamin. Luckily, the conference proceedings will be published next spring, so everyone who wants to will have a chance to go over Paul's dense survey in detail. Other highlights included the stunningly well read Peter Middleton speaking on the apparent narrowing of avant-garde possibilities between the demise of Caterpillar and the rise of L=A=N=G=U=A=G=E IN 1978. (Peter began his talk by playing Steely Dan -- not only a good way to remind us of how far off '73 has become, but also a good way to wake up a groggy morning crowd). Steve Evans made some good points afterward about the way poets have reacted to being labeled with the 'L= word' -- nobody thinks it is quite right for them, but then again they see some paralleles, and in the discourse about avant-garde poetry, one seems to be either a language poet or not to count at all, so poets seem to ultimately accept the label, albeit with reservations. I'd like to hear more from Steve on these issues someday. Keith and Rosmarie Waldrop were there, giving a reading with Jennifer Moxley and serving as the great eminences gris for the whole affair. There was also a panel on Rosmarie's work with papers by Kornelia Freitag and Ann Simon, and at least one magazine on display that carried an essay on her work (Samizdat #1, edited by yours truly). If you're wondering who to watch among young Belgian poet-critics (and who isn't) I'd say Michel Delville is your man. At 30, he's done a lot: become junior professor at Liege, helped organize the conference and give it its experimental emphasis, written experimental poetry in English and French (we hope to have some of his work in a future issue of Samizdat) and published a book on the American Prose Poem with University Press of Florida (a damn good book, too, with a long section on Rosmarie Waldrop, and a detailed tracing of the roots of the American prose poem in European literature). In fact, Delville is so smart and talented and conscientious and cool and darkly good looking one is driven into fits of envy. But I digress. There was a fun double-reading by Maxine Chernoff and Paul Hoover at a jazz club where we all drenched ourselves in Belgian beer. Maxine read dialogue-poems about a 'fictitious' husband of hers and the odd sounds he makes while orgasming, while Paul looked distinctly uncomfortable -- makes one wonder about referentiality and the scene of reading in a whole new way. Joe Amato and Kassia Fleisher gave a simultaneous double-voiced reading on the subject of collaboration, and, as Paul Hoover pointed out, it posed some interesting questions about the politics of listening -- Joe was on one side of the room, Kass on the other, and Paul felt that those of us on Joe's side were encouraged to listen to him, in a sense to root for him, just out of proximity. Some women on our side of the room objected, saying they felt solidarity with Kass, who was speaking in a kind of feminist discourse -- I found myself feeling the urge to listen to Joe precisely because he was a man and Kass was giving a strong feminist line, then I felt guilty about that and made myself listen to Kass. Hmmm... Afterwards, instead of giving a paper Joe "gave paper" --he handed out a piece of text/image design and encouraged everyone to e-mail him about it later. So the discussion continues. Other good things, drawn up from an embrassment of riches: Nick Selby of the U of Wales on Gary Snyder, Diederik Oostdijk of Nijmingen on Poetry Magazine's decline, Franca Bellarsi of Brussels on Beat Orientalism, Sharon Kennedy-Nolle of Paris on the politics of the Pound Museum. The Waldrops read with Jennifer Moxley, but I had to miss this in order to catch a train to Copenhagen. I'd love to hear about it, if anyone else was lucky enough to be there. I also missed a panel on Rosmarie's work and a language poetry panel chaired by Antoinne Caze from the Universite d'Orleans, who is quite brilliant and ought to be published in the States. An interesting reversal of the usual conference, in which innovative work exists only on the margins. I remember one conference participant, who was giving a very good paper on James Merrill, expressing his frustration -- "Is this the picture of American poetry we want to paint? Is formal work so marginal as to disappear" On the one hand, a completely fair question. On the other hand, I couldn't help feeling a kind of "now the shoe is on the other foot" sentiment. The book of proceedings will be published in the Spring of 2000 by the University of Liege Press, and will be a bit hard to get in the US. You can send orders in advance to: L3 Liege Language and Literature University of Liege English Department 3 Place Cockerill B-4000 Liege, Belgium or e-mail pierre.michel@ulg.ac.be There's a web site with a full conference schedule, still up at: http://www.ulg.ac.be/facphl/annonces/pwap.html Robert Archambeau Engelska Institutionen Lunds Universitet Sweden ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 00:04:12 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Wendy Battin Subject: Call for out-of-print books Comments: To: cap-l Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Apologies for cross-posting-- CAPA, the Contemporary American Poetry Archive, is soliciting out-of-print poetry books for posting on the web. We've revised our guidelines and now accept only hard-copy submissions; send one or (if possible) two copies of the book(s) to us at CAPA Dept. of English Connecticut College New London, CT 06320 Contact me first at wjbat@conncoll.edu and I'll email you the required release form. If you'd like to see what we've done so far, go to http://capa.conncoll.edu CAPA is non-denominational and open to all books published by non-vanity North American presses. ====================== Wendy Battin wjbat@conncoll.edu CAPA: http://capa.conncoll.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 11:15:08 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Judy Smith McDonough Subject: poetrynow March now on-line Comments: To: cafe-blue@ebbs.english.vt.edu, poetryetc@listbot.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A brief (non-)commercial message: poetrynow March on line http://www.poetrynow.org Judy Smith McDonough, editor ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 23:34:51 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: David Clippinger Subject: mla panel Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I have put together a panel for next year's (Chicago) MLA--"A Buddhist Renaissance: Buddhist Writing/Writing Buddhism"-- but because one of the panelists has had to withdraw, I am in need of one or two panelists who would be interested in either presenting a paper or chairing the panel. Please send me an email as soon as possible if you are interested. All best, David Clippinger David Clippinger, Ph.D. Assistant Professor of English Penn State University 100 University Drive Monaca, PA 15061-2799 (724) 773-3884 (phone) (724) 773-3557 (fax) + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + Mind is the forerunner of all actions. All deeds are led by mind, created by mind. If one speaks or acts with a corrupt mind, suffering follows, as a wheel follows the hoof of an ox pulling a cart. Mind is the forerunner of all actions. All deeds are led by mind, created by mind. If one speaks or acts with a serene mind, happiness follows, As surely as one's shadow. Buddha, Dhammapada + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 21:13:28 +0100 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Ward Tietz Subject: Sound (new DOC(K)S) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" TimesSean Casey's post from a few weeks ago inquiring about poetry and sound reminded me that I wanted to post something on the new DOC(K)S issue on sound. DOC(K)S is a French magazine that's had a long tradition of publishing visual literature, mail art and performance documentation, but in the last couple of years has also been including electronic work on CD-ROMs and CDs along with the magazine. This new edition on sound includes work from Bernard Heidsieck, Brion Gyson, Paul Dutton and many others on two CDs along with various essays and documentation. There's also a clip from A Sound Education, a piece I did with S. Alburger for New American Radio several years back. The main address for DOC(K)S for anyone interested is: DOC(K)S AKENATON / Philippe Castellin / Jean Torregrosa 12 Cours Grandval F-20 000 Ajaccio France e-mail: akenaton_docks@sitec.fr The distribution address is: DIFFUSION Z editions 6 rue du lycee F-06000 Nice France Ward Tietz ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 12:58:20 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: bruce andrews Subject: Joining you, finally Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Listees: = Slow emergence out of neandra-techno-thal/thrall. Finally set up with computer in office, here once a week to lurk the Poetics List digest, etc. E-mail address is < andrewsbruce@netscape.net > Or, as ever, regular mail at 41 West 96 St., apt. 10-D, New York, N.Y. 10025 (212-865-9857). Happy to be aboard. All best, Bruce Andrews ____________________________________________________________________ More than just email--Get your FREE Netscape WebMail account today at htt= p://home.netscape.com/netcenter/mail ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 22:50:09 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: lee ann brown Subject: Brown, Mayer, Guest in SF Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" (Tuesday) March 9: Reading: Lee Ann Brown, Barbara Guest & Bernadette Mayer, New College of California, Cultural Center, 777 Valencia Street San Francisco, CA, 7pm, $5. (415) 241-3458 Z Y X W V U T S R Q P O N M L K J I H G F E D C B A Lee Ann Brown Tender Buttons PO Box 13, Cooper Station New York, NY 10276 212.529.6154 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 19:47:16 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rachel Loden Subject: Elmslie on TV; Chernoff, Bromige, Nguyen MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > There was a fun double-reading by Maxine Chernoff and Paul Hoover at a > jazz club where we all drenched ourselves in Belgian beer. Maxine read > dialogue-poems about a 'fictitious' husband of hers and the odd sounds > he makes while [censored] Maxine Chernoff's very funny playlet THE SOUND is available in _Jacket_: http://jacket.zip.com.au/jacket04/chernoff.html Great to see that her LEAP YEAR DAY : NEW AND SELECTED POEMS is back in print from Jensen/Daniels (available from SPD). Another very funny playlet : David Bromige's IS POETRY COMMUNICATION? on the The East Village Poetry Web's Poetries of Canada site (which you should check out anyway for its rich and various fare): http://www.geocities.com/~theeastvillage/vc.htm Am reliably informed that Kenward Elmslie's opera LIZZIE BORDEN will be on PBS's Live from Lincoln Center Wednesday, March 24, at 8 p.m. A poem from Hoa Nguyen's DARK ($7 from 2925 Higgins Street, Austin, TX 78722): BAKED ALASKA from My Childhood with Food It is possible You can take whole parts of land chunk of ice cream (pink) ice cream mysterious meringue Stuff it in a hot box hot How is the trick of it baking igloos with kin inside They are they not real ice cream white and pink It's complicated Rachel Loden ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 23:33:12 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkward Ubutronics Subject: EPOS [Yr LifeLoveWork] Comments: cc: subsubpoetics@listbot.com, poetryetc@listbot.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ...eXTENDED pOETRY oPERATING sYSTEM... EPOS is a reflexive sphere within which collisions & entanglements of all LONGPOEM thoughts/works are invited. Dialogue. Networking. Collective creation of a long poem resources website. A medium for the broadcast your long poem in progress. Book trading. Bibliomania. Manifestos. Filibusters. Interwriting. Observations of the Author inside her lifelong writation. Or in the very least, a readerly lens for practical & usable understanding of works such as A, The Martyrology, Maximus Poems, Cantos, Howl & .... "The serial poem is not simply a sequence. It is meant to be a narrative that transfigures time, our limit, mine. I have wanted to use the form because it makes language direct and insistent without reference to a grid of meaning, which in our time has become intolerable, a-historical, a lie. Delicate and harsh are the words that come to mind to describe the form. Since form is always the reach of content, rhythmical and musical, the serial structure has allowed me to imagine the indeterminate nature of what we are beyond finitude and other small dead ends." Robin Blaser (from the Long Poem Anthology) "What is a long poem? perhaps it is simply a long life or some trust in the durational aspect of being alive." --bpNichol ---------------------------------------------- to subscribe tune yr browser to: http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/EPOS or email me / dtv@mwt.net & I will enlist you ---------------------------------------------- This unmoderated list is facilitated & chiselled into html by Miekal And ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 19:22:25 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkward Ubutronics Subject: Re: Joining you, finally MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit the millenium must truly be here if bruce in online. deconstruct me baby. miekal bruc® &ndr®ws wrzeust®: > > D®&r List®®s: > Slzeusw ®m®rg®nc® zeusut zeusf n®&ndr&-t®chnzeus-th&l/thr&ll. > Fin&lly s®t up with czeusmput®r in zeusffic®, h®r® zeusnc® & > w®®k tzeus lurk th® Pzeus®tics List dig®st, ®tc. > ®-m&il &ddr®ss is < &ndr®wsbruc®@n®tsc&p®.n®t > > ZEUSr, &s ®v®r, r®gul&r m&il &t 41 W®st 96 St., &pt. 10-D, > N®w Yzeusrk, N.Y. 10025 (212-865-9857). > > H&ppy tzeus b® &bzeus&rd. &ll b®st, Bruc® &ndr®ws > > ____________________________________________________________________ > Mzeusr® th&n just ®m&il--G®t yzeusur FR®® N®tsc&p® W®bM&il &cczeusunt tzeusd&y &t http://hzeusm®.n®tsc&p®.czeusm/n®tc®nt®r/m&il ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 22:03:01 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: david bromige Subject: re vancouver conference 63 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Spicer wasnt at it. He gave his Vancouver lectures in '65. db. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 09:10:54 -0400 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Pierre Joris Subject: Adolfo Bioy Casares MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit And so two days after Kubrick, one day after Joe Di MAggio (btw, there used to be an excellent poetry magazine called Joe Di Maggio in England during the early seventies) here is news of someone else who called it splitsville: the Argentinian writer Adolfo Bioy Casares, author of _Asleep in the Sun, _The Adventures of a Photopgrapger in La Plata_, _Diary of the War of a Pig_, _The Russian Doll and Other Stories_, and many more. His best American translator, to my mind, is Suzanne Jill Levine (though I must confess I read him mainly in French into which he was translated early and excellently). He was 84 and had been awarded the Cervantes prize -- the most prestiguous Spanish literary prize -- in 1990. Basic info on him at the following url: http://arcadia.informatik.uni-muenchen.de/rec/argentina/literatura/Bioy/Bioy_Casares.html A rather funny 1994 interview can be read at: http://www.eltunel.com.ar/textos/bioy04.htm -- ======================== Pierre Joris joris@csc.albany.edu http://www.albany.edu/~joris/ 6 Madison Place Albany NY 12202 tel: 518 426 0433 fax: 518 426 3722 ======================== Nomadism answers to a relation that possession cannot satisfy. — Maurice Blanchot ======================== ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 11:55:18 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tom Beckett Subject: Stray Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Life is mostly lie. Add in the sound of air escaping. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 11:53:25 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: franklin bruno Subject: pagemothers? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Folks-- Despite my best intentions, I ended up having too much work last weekend to justify the two hour drive each way to UCSD. I'm sure I'll regret this for the rest of my life (especially as I'm highly unlikely to see B. Mayer read under other circumstances)--to hone this growing feeling of guilt and missed opportunity, is anyone ready to post a report on the Pagemothers conference/readings? fjb ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 20:28:59 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maria Damon Subject: Re: Jew In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" bless yew alan sondheim At 12:41 AM -0500 3/6/99, A. Jenn Sondheim wrote: >^ > > >Jew > > >I number. >I number them. >I number myself among them. >I would have been numbered among them. >I might have have numbered them. >I could have been numbered among them. >I was numbered. >I was numbered among them. >I am numbered. >I am numbered among them. >(I count myself among them.) >(I am counted.) >(I am unaccounted for.) >(I am unaccountable.) > > >____________________________________________ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 15:59:23 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Matt Kirschenbaum Subject: Blake Archive's March Update Comments: To: humanist@kcl.ac.uk, H-CLC@msu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" 9 March 1999 The editors of the William Blake Archive are pleased to announce the publication of three new electronic editions of Blake's most popular work, _Songs of Innocence and of Experience_. They are of copies C, F, and L -- none has been reproduced before now. _Songs_ copy C is one of the first copies of the combined _Songs_. Along with copies B, D, and E, it was formed in 1794 of _Innocence_ plates printed in raw sienna on both sides of the leaf in 1789 and _Experience_ plates lightly color printed in yellow ochre in the same format in 1794. By this time, Blake had decided to move plates 34-36 ("The Little Girl Lost" and "The Little Girl Found") to _Experience_, but since plate 34 was printed on the verso of the leaf with plate 26 ("A Dream"), plate 26 is read in this copy, as well as in copies B and D, as an _Experience_ poem. And, like copies B and D, copy C is missing plate 52 ("To Tirzah") but has the small vignette known as plate a (five cherubs carrying a naked figure), one of Blake's earliest relief etchings used here as a tailpiece. Copy C is in the Rosenwald Collection, Library of Congress. Bibliographically, copy F is even more interesting. It, too, consists of two sections printed differently and at different times. Its _Innocence_ plates were printed in green ink on both sides of the leaf in 1789, probably before the raw sienna printing. Its _Experience_ plates were heavily color printed on one side of the leaf in 1794, before those in copy C, possibly while _Experience_ was still in progress. The impressions of _Experience_ were printed with those now in _Songs_ copies G, H, and T, which are all missing plates 39, 44, 45, and 48. Together, these four plates form one sheet of copper. The fact that all four plates are missing from all four copies suggests that the plates were not yet part of _Experience_ at the time of this printing. These four color-printed copies of _Experience_ appear to have been intended as autonomous publications. At any rate, there are no extant sets of _Innocence_ impressions printed in this style, copies G and H remain without _Innocence_, and copies F and T were assembled by someone other than Blake. _Songs_ copy L, like copy F, is in the Yale Center for British Art. Unlike copies C and F, though, its two parts were printed together in a uniform style, dark brown ink on one side of the leaf, ca. 1795. It has all 54 plates, including plate 52, that make up the combined _Songs_ and is numbered by Blake 1-54. All of these editions have newly edited SGML-encoded texts and all are fully searchable for both text and images and supported by the unique Inote and ImageSizer applications described in our previous updates. We now have twenty-nine copies of sixteen illuminated books in the Archive. We will soon be adding two more copies of _The Marriage of Heaven and Hell_ and an in-depth illustrated Tour highlighting the Archive's features and some ways to use its resources. We will continue to add new electronic editions of illuminated books throughout the spring and summer. Morris Eaves, Robert N. Essick, Joseph Viscomi, Editors Matthew Kirschenbaum, Project Manager The William Blake Archive ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 13:19:09 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: MAXINE CHERNOFF Subject: Re: Elmslie on TV; Chernoff, Bromige, Nguyen In-Reply-To: <36E499C4.EF7B368F@concentric.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Actually, it's the "he" of the playlet that doesn't like the sound that the "she" makes. Interesting that the listener's interpretation of the piece was the opposite (and certainly supportable, of course). Maxine Chernoff On Mon, 8 Mar 1999, Rachel Loden wrote: > > There was a fun double-reading by Maxine Chernoff and Paul Hoover at a > > jazz club where we all drenched ourselves in Belgian beer. Maxine read > > dialogue-poems about a 'fictitious' husband of hers and the odd sounds > > he makes while [censored] > > Maxine Chernoff's very funny playlet THE SOUND is available in _Jacket_: > > http://jacket.zip.com.au/jacket04/chernoff.html > > Great to see that her LEAP YEAR DAY : NEW AND SELECTED POEMS is back in > print from Jensen/Daniels (available from SPD). > > Another very funny playlet : David Bromige's IS POETRY COMMUNICATION? > on the The East Village Poetry Web's Poetries of Canada site (which you > should check out anyway for its rich and various fare): > > http://www.geocities.com/~theeastvillage/vc.htm > > Am reliably informed that Kenward Elmslie's opera LIZZIE BORDEN will be > on PBS's Live from Lincoln Center Wednesday, March 24, at 8 p.m. > > A poem from Hoa Nguyen's DARK ($7 from 2925 Higgins Street, Austin, > TX 78722): > > > BAKED ALASKA > > from My Childhood with Food > > It is possible You can > take whole parts of land chunk > of ice cream (pink) ice cream > mysterious meringue > Stuff it in a hot box hot How > is the trick of it baking > igloos with kin inside > They are they not real ice > cream white and pink > It's complicated > > > Rachel Loden > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 10:44:06 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: james loucks Subject: Re: Kathleen Raine? Comments: cc: jloucks@postbox.acs.ohio-state.edu In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Here's her address from Gale Research/Contemporary Authors database: Addresses: Home: 47 Paultons Sq., London SW3, England. Ms. Raine would be 91 in June (I do not know if she's still alive.) She took an MA from Cambridge in 1929, in a cohort that included William Empson, Ronald Bottrall, Humphrey Jennings, Charles Madge (whom she married after divorcing Hugh Sykes Davies), Michael Redgrave, James Reeves, et al. -- all poets before turning to other things (Jennings made documentaries, Madge did Mass Observation, and we all know what Empson and Redgrave got into.) In researching Bronowski, Mr. Sandefur might want to see bios and memoirs on these other figures as well as Ms. Raine. All best wishes, Jim At 04:58 PM 3/6/1999 -0500, you wrote: >Could someone in Poetics land help this enterprising scholar? You could >respond directly to him, though I'd like to know the info too, and perhaps >others would. Snowing hard here, Sylvester > >>From: Tmsandefur@aol.com >>Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 02:26:00 EST >>To: pollet@maine.edu >>Mime-Version: 1.0 >>Subject: Kathleen Raine >> >>Greetings! I have been scouring the Internet all night trying to find a way to >>contact the poet Kathleen Raine. (In fact, I'm not entirely certain she's >>still alive!) I am working on a biography of the late poet/scientist Jacob >>Bronowski, whom she knew in her days at Cambridge University, and would like >>to get in contact with her. I thought maybe someone at the National Poetry >>Foundation would know how I could reach her. Any suggestions? >> >>TM:$ >> >>----- >>Timothy Sandefur >>6128 N. Cedar Ave. >>Rialto, CA 92377 >> > James F. Loucks Associate Professor of English The Ohio State University at Newark 1179 University Drive Newark, OH 43055-1797 614 366-9423 (voice mail) fax: 614 366-5047 or 740 366-5047 e-mail: loucks.1@osu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 16:35:16 +0000 Reply-To: baratier@megsinet.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: David Baratier Subject: Pavement Saw Chapbook contest:PANTS MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit 1998-99 winner of the Pavement Saw Press Chapbook Contest Ruth Anderson Barnett, editor of the Marlboro Review chose PANTS by Shelley Stenhouse. $500 and 25 copies of the winning chapbook will be awarded to the author. The book will be published by May 1st. Shelley lives in NYC. This is her first collection of poems some pieces first appeared in Mudfish. All contestants who included an SASE will recieve a copy. Advance orders taken now $5. Instead of $6 plus postage. Includes exciting retro cover. The Pavement Saw Press Chapbook Award was established in 1995 to promote writers whose work challenges conventions of contemporary poetry while encouraging multiple readings. Writers world-wide are invited to participate. Each year, one manuscript is selected by a writer with a thorough familiarity of the small press realm. Publication, a prize of five hundred dollars, and ten percent of the book run is awarded to the winner. I will post a poem from this in the upcoming week. Thanks to everyone who participated. Be well David Baratier, Editor, Pavement Saw Press PO Box 6291 Columbus OH 43206 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 10:39:18 +1100 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: John Tranter Subject: burning blackly Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I'd like to know where I could find material on Paul Blackburn, particularly his poetry and his connection with the starting of the Poetry Project at St Mark's in 1966. Thanks, JT from John Tranter, 39 Short Street, Balmain NSW 2041, Sydney, Australia tel (+612) 9555 8502 fax (+612) 9818 8569 Editor, Jacket magazine: http://www.jacket.zip.com.au/welcome.html Homepage: five megabytes of glittering literature, free, at http://www.alm.aust.com/~tranterj/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 17:24:48 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: George Bowering Subject: Re: Adolfo Bioy Casares In-Reply-To: <36E51DEE.582EA2F5@csc.albany.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Thanks to Pierre for the sad news about Bioy Casares. It has been expected for a while; he has long long been my favourite LatinAmerican writer. Once my wqife refused to read past the midpoint of _A Plan of Escape_ because she was afraid she would have to give up her mind for the sake of a book. Exactly right, I thought. I try to read him in Spanish and then I read him in English.Once a magazine in Ontario, knowing of my interest, tried to get me to translate a new story tghat had appeared in a Buenos Aires newspaper, and I tried, but wouldnt do it becauyse I was afraid of not being good enough translator. Thank goodness there is a lot of work from him, and several years ago _The Review_ that magazine that studies LatinAmerican writing (is it in Washington?) did an issue on Bioy. In looking for his books, be patient. A lot of bookstores will file him under C, just as they file Garcia Marquez under M. George Bowering. , 2499 West 37th Ave., Vancouver, B.C., Canada V6M 1P4 fax: 1-604-266-9000 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 07:43:09 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Peter Ganick Subject: statement on music Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ceramic skeletons in a fear to blot down alive notions dead notions watered from hovering within a space-filled crosswise and famed retaliation of the agreeable innuendo. not recursive as is everything what you infect with amazement on scramblers and fear blotting down alive notions deaf needs for the cruelly rerun re-pasteurized demoted formulaic notions calling themselves sentences something neutral. if and when. who and why. what the for makes of theatre inverting pristine x-ray mentality not too late in the morning, but blotted in amazement of scramblers. some not careful of front and background sound. some too beleaugured to help in an upcoming desertion well-spun with cacti and wildflowers, where help is the mental resistance of precision funneled through a rack-and-pinion steering that is donor-proof. woken through the same ovulation. greased in the bodily fortune that simmers either./or toxicities yoga notifies witnessing itself witness yourself witnessing nowhere becoming itself sleepy mistreatment ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 12:03:10 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Maria Damon (Maria Damon)" Subject: fwd: job lists Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Supplement to AWP Job List Online -- March 10, 1999 The following jobs are extremely time sensitive. They were received after the copy deadline for the March/April 1999 print edition of AWP Job List. Louisiana State University Louisiana State University's creative writing program anticipates the appointment of a visiting fiction writer at the assistant or associate level for the fall and spring, 1999-2000. Writers applying should have an MFA, ]or other terminal degree, and at least one book of fiction in print, preferably more. Teaching experience a must. Graduate and undergraduate classes, salary competitive. Send cover letter, vita, letters of recommendation, and a writing sample to Dr. Malcolm Richardson, Chair, Department of English, Louisiana State University, Baton Rouge, LA 70803. Materials will be accepted through April 9, 1999, or until a candidate is selected. If you desire your writing sample returned, please send along an SASE. Please tell us if you plan to attend the AWP convention in Albany. EOE University of Alabama The Program in Creative Writing at the University of Alabama announces an extension of its search and invites applications for an Associate or advanced Assistant Professor to teach fiction writing in a thriving MFA program beginning Fall, 1999. We are seeking a fiction writer of national reputation with significant book publication and substantial teaching experience for this permanent position. The MFA is the preferred degree. Expertise in the writing of other genres is desirable but not required. Typically the teaching load for a productive faculty member is two classes per semester. Salary and rank will be commensurate with experience. We currently enroll about 200 undergraduates in creative writing and some 60 MFA students. The writing program has excellent support from the English Department and the University. The faculty in the Program in Creative Writing is comprised of two poets (Robin Behn and Bruce Smith) and three fiction writers (Michael Martone, Sandy Huss, and the person to be hired). An endowed chair brings two more writers a year to campus, each for a semester in residence, and the endowed Bankhead Visiting Writer's Series annually sponsors a dozen or more readings and short residencies. Alabama is home to both a campus literary magazine and the nationally known Black Warrior Review. About 95% of our MFA students, who come from all over the United States, enjoy fellowships or teaching assistantships, and many are publishing well. Review of applications continues until the position is filled. Priority for AWP convention interviews will be given to those applications received by March 31. Send letter, vita, dossier and writing samples to: Michael Martone, Search Committee Chair, Department of English, University of Alabama, P.O. Box 870244, Tuscaloosa, AL 35487-0244. The University of Alabama is an Equal Opportunity Affirmative Action employer. Indiana University Assistant Professor, one-year visitor in Creative Writing (fiction) for 1999-2000. Salary competitive. We are looking for someone prepared to participate fully in an active graduate and undergraduate Creative Writing Program. Teaching load (2/2) includes a graduate topics course, two undergraduate workshops, and an undergraduate literature course, plus relevant committee work. Applicants must have published one book of fiction. Send application, c.v., book, letters of recommendation and a representative sample of teaching materials by April 15 to: Maura Stanton, Director, Creative Writing Program, Ballantine Hall 442, 1020 E. Kirkwood Avenue, Bloomington, IN 47405-7103. Minority candidates strongly encouraged to apply. AA/EOE Employer. Converse College Sabbatical replacement in English. A 9 month non-renewable position beginning in September 1999. Ph.D. preferred; ABD considered. While the primary teaching responsibilities will be Composition and Introduction to Literary Types, some upper-division teaching will be included. Candidates with expertise in 19th-century British literature are especially encouraged to apply. Five to seven course load over the nine month period; salary competitive. Please send letter of application and c.v. with names and phone numbers of 3 references to Karen Carmean, Chair, Dept. of English, Converse College, Spartanburg, SC 29302. Converse College is a private, liberal arts women's college. Women and minorities are encouraged to apply. Proposals Now Accepted for AWP in Kansas City March 30-April 1, 2000 Kansas City Marriott Downtown Kansas City, Missouri Come celebrate the new century in the town thats famous for blues, jazz, barbecue, steaks--and, of course, writing. This year a major emphasis of the conference is The New Century; Whither the Written Word? Your proposals are welcome. Please visit the AWP website at for more details, or to fill out a presentation proposal form. If you would like a form mailed to you, please contact AWP at (703) 993-4301, e-mail , or write to Roxanne French-Thornhill, Associated Writing Programs, Tallwood House, MSN 1E3, George Mason University, Fairfax, VA 22030. AWP Job List Online -- March/April 1999 -- Academic Jobs 1/2 Arkansas * Arkansas Tech University Tenure-track assistant professor to teach creative writing & composition. PhD preferred, MFA required, significant fiction publication expected, & background in rhetoric helpful. Annual teaching load will include one or two undergraduate creative writing courses in our BFA program & six or seven general education composition & literature courses. Occasional graduate courses in creative writing or rhetoric are possible. Demonstrable commitment to undergraduate general education instruction is required. Send application letter, resume, & a dossier including three current letters of reference by March 29, 1999 to Carl Brucker, Head, Dept. of English, Arkansas Tech University, Russellville, AR 72801. AA/EOE Arizona Phoenix College The Creative Writing Program at Phoenix College invites applications for a one-year appointment as Writer in Residence for the 1999-2000 academic year. We are one of ten Maricopa County Community Colleges, serving a metropolitan area of approximately 2.8 million people. Phoenix College is an urban campus with an enrollment of 11,500 students. We offer a certificate of completion in creative writing with coursework in fiction, poetry, screenwriting, playwriting, creative nonfiction, bilingual creative writing, & writing for children. With an enrollment of approximately 150 writers, our program is a significant center for the literary arts in Phoenix, offering an impressive reading series & substantial noncredit workshops, as well as credit courses. A Writer in Residence will teach the equivalent of 15 credit hours per semester. She/he will be expected to teach both creative writing & composition & should be eager to work with a diverse student population. MA or MFA required, with substantial creative publications. Knowledge of & teaching experience in Chicano literature desired. Entry level salary approximately $35,000 plus benefits. The Maricopa County Community College District is an EO/AA institution. Send letter of application & c.v. by April 1st to Dr. Lisa Miller, Director, Creative Writing Program, Phoenix College, 1202 W. Thomas Rd., Phoenix, AZ 85013. For more information, call (602) 285-7348. * Yavapai College Yavapai College, a growing multi-campus community college located 90 miles north of Phoenix, sits in the beautiful mountains of Arizona at an elevation of 5,300 feet in Prescott, the States first capital. Prescott offers an ideal year-round climate & a quality of life that includes mountains out your back door & a town reminiscent of the Old West. Prescott is part of a tri-city area with a population of 60,000, of which Yavapai College is a central focus for performing arts & entertainment. The College offers its faculty the opportunity for tremendous personal & professional development & seeks applicants who have a desire for innovation & student-centered teaching. A positive, critical-thinking approach is a must. Since service to our students is our highest priority, as a member of our team you can expect to participate in innovative methods & flexible scheduling. Applicants must have proven technological skills which must include the ability to promote & utilize computer technology into the teaching & learning experience. The ability to interact in a team environment & demonstrated strengths in collaborative issue resolution is required. Additionally, a proven track record with alternative delivery systems such as lab-based, project-based, online, or distance delivery is also required. Project-management & prior teaching experience a plus. If you possess these competencies as well as a minimum of a Masters Degree in the related teaching field, we invite your response for the following positions which will begin Fall 1999: English Instructor (2 Positions Available). Responsible for teaching freshman & sophomore level English & literature courses. Currency in composition theory & learner-centered pedagogy as well as a track record with alternative delivery methods required. Applicants should send a letter of application with a resume & a list of three recent professional references to: Randy Glazer, Director of Human Resources, Yavapai College, 1100 E. Sheldon St., Prescott, AZ 86301. Although positions are open until filled, for full consideration please submit materials by April 1, 1999. Visit us on our Web site at: or call our 24-hour Job Hotline at (520) 776-2383. Yavapai College is an AA/EOE seeking to diversify its workforce & encourages applicants from all traditions & underrepresented groups to contact us & voluntarily self-identify through the application process. (CHE) California * Antioch University-Los Angeles Antioch University-Los Angeles, a fully accredited adult campus of Antioch University, invites applications for a dual appointment, full-time faculty position, in the BA in Liberal Arts & the low-residency MFA in Creative Writing programs. The appointment is set to begin July 1, 1999. Teaching responsibilities include one course per quarter in the BA program, & in the MFA program, a minimum of two learning activities, one genre workshop, & one reading per residency. Advising responsibilities include working with creative writing students in the BA program (approx. 12-15) & mentoring up to 5 fiction students per semester in the MFA program. Additional students may be assigned in the MFA program, but this work would be considered overload & compensated accordingly. The successful candidate will spend a minimum of 17 hours per week on campus (12 for the BA program, 5 for the MFA). Actual hours will be determined in consultation with the program chairs & dedicated to chair-identified contributions to the program, such as admissions work, field study oversight, scholarship solicitation, & leadership in building both programs. The faculty member is expected to participate in campus faculty meetings & other campus meetings whenever possible. The faculty member will continue to pursue professional development & publication, conduct readings in public venues, and, where appropriate, engage in community service in consultation with program chairs. The faculty member will stay current with literature in his/her field & continue to develop new courses for the program. This is a full-time, 12-month core faculty position with salary dependent on placement on the Antioch faculty salary scale. Excellent benefits. Given that this position bridges two programs, the total work hours per week will be determined in consultation with the program chairs, & the hours may vary during weeks of the academic calendar. Qualifications: MFA or PhD in related field required; experience teaching & mentoring creative writing students; familiarity with an online teaching environment; publications of high quality in fiction; familiarity with & contacts in local & national writing community; high value placed on ability to work in a participatory university environment & within flexible & creative academic programs; high value placed on a candidate with demonstrated interest in the relation of arts, politics, & society. To apply, please send cover letter, including three references, along with a resume to: BA/MFA Faculty Search, Antioch University LA, 13274 Fiji Way, Marina del Ray, CA 90292-7090. Applications will be reviewed beginning May 1, 1999, & until a suitable candidate is selected. Antioch University is an EOE & does not discriminate based on race, religion, ethnicity, creed, nationality, disability, or sexual orientation. Antioch University LA has a strong commitment to the principles of diversity. In this spirit, we welcome applicants from a broad spectrum of people including women, members of ethnic minorities, & physically challenged individuals. California State University, Chico The English Dept. at California State University, Chico seeks to fill a one-year position in Creative Writing/Fiction. Teaching load 3 courses per semester; likely course assignments include Beginning & Advanced Creative Writing & Modern Novel. The exact assignment is dependent on departmental needs & individuals background. Minimum qualifications: 1) MFA or PhD in English/Creative Writing, 2) demonstrated excellence in teaching at the university level, & 3) publication in literary magazines. Candidates with at least one published book of fiction are preferred. As a university that educates students of various ethnic & cultural backgrounds, we value a diverse faculty & staff, & seek to create as diverse a pool of candidates as possible. Salary & appointment level commensurate with qualifications & experience. The Dept. of English has a strong undergraduate Creative Writing Minor, & is lead campus for a new Consortium MFA in Creative Writing. Position begins Fall 1999. Application deadline: April 2. Send letter, dossier, & recommendations to Karen Hatch, Chair, English Dept., California State University, Chico, CA 95929-0830. Chico is an EEO/AA/ADA/IRCA employer. * California State University, Chico The English Dept. at California State University, Chico seeks to fill a tenure-track position in Technical Writing. Teaching load is four courses, or their equivalent, per semester. The person filling this position will coordinate the Technical Writing Certificate Program & supervise technical writing interns. Teaching assignments will include technical writing courses & may include courses in the candidates other area(s) of competence. The exact assignment is dependent upon departmental needs & the background of the individual. PhD in English or related field such as Rhetoric or Technical Communication, academic preparation & experience in technical writing, demonstrated excellence in teaching at the University level, evidence of research & publication, & a commitment to program development required. Evidence of successful program coordination highly desirable. As a university that educates students of various ethnic & cultural backgrounds, we value a diverse faculty & staff & seek to create as diverse a pool of candidates as possible. Asst. Prof. $37-$40K with benefits. Position begins Fall 1999. Applications must be received by April 12, 1999. Send letter, dossier, & recs. to Karen Hatch, Chair, English Dept., California State University, Chico, CA 95929-0830. Phone (530) 898-5125 or fax (530) 898-4450. Chico is an EEO/AA/ADA employer. (MLA) University of California, Berkeley Pending budgetary resources, the Dept. of Rhetoric at the University of California, Berkeley, will have available 1 or 2 positions as lecturer for the 1999-2000 academic year, with the possibility of extension. Percentage of time will vary depending upon departmental needs. Minimum full-time salary $32,268; salary commensurate with experience. Successful candidates will teach courses in one of the two following areas: 1) the history of rhetoric with competence in the early modern period &/or political & legal discourse; 2) rhetorical approaches to comparative cultural studies, postcolonial or translation theory. Preference will be given to candidates with teaching experience at the university level. C.V., dossier, & supporting materials by April 1, 1999 to David J. Cohen, Acting Chair, Dept. of Rhetoric, 7408 Dwinelle Hall #2670, University of California, Berkeley, CA 94720-2670. The University of California is an AA/EOE. (MLA) University of California, San Diego We invite applications for a lecturer position in the Revelle College Humanities Program, which, pending budgetary approval, will begin July 1, 1999 for one year with possibility of extension. Lecturer will assist in teaching introductory courses in Western cultural & intellectual history with strong emphasis on development of analytical writing skills. PhD & teaching experience required; experience in interdisciplinary humanities education & emphasis on premodern European periods preferred. Doctoral work may be in History, Literature, or Philosophy. Salary commensurate with experience & based on published UC pay scale. Noncitizens should state immigration status in c.v. Send letter of application, c.v., dossier, & writing sample(s) to Chair of Search Committee, Dept. of Literature 0410, University of California, San Diego, 9500 Gilman Drive, La Jolla, CA 92093-0410. Enclose self-addressed postcard for acknowledgement of application & SASE for return of writing sample(s). Closing date is April 12, 1999. EOE/AA (MLA) Georgia The Savannah College of Art & Design The Savannah College of Art & Design is seeking qualified faculty candidates who demonstrate professional knowledge & have college teaching experience for the 1999-2000 school year. Professor of Liberal Arts (Composition). PhD required specifically in Composition & Rhetoric. Professor of Liberal Arts (Creative Writing). PhD required in Creative Writing or PhD in English with an MFA in Creative Writing. Deadline for applications is May 1, 1999. Send cover letter, resume, & three references to: Human Resources, The Savannah College of Art & Design, P.O. Box 3146, Savannah, GA 31402; fax to (912) 525-5222, or e-mail . Women & minorities are encouraged to apply. AA/EOE (CHE) * Augusta State University An interdisciplinary department seeks an Assistant Professor with a PhD or an MA in English & extensive experience in creative writing (especially dramatic writing). Tenurable. The successful candidate will also have a background in either journalism or public relations. Duties will include teaching courses in the areas of specialization, as well as freshman composition & interdisciplinary humanities courses. By March 30, 1999, applicants should send a letter of application, a detailed c.v., & three letters of recommendation to Lillie B. Johnson, Chair, Dept. of Languages, Literature, & Communications; Augusta State University; 2500 Walton Way, Augusta, GA 30904. Augusta State University is an EO/AA Employer. (MLA) Illinois Knox College Knox College is seeking a poet for a tenure-track position beginning Sept. 1999. Appointment will be at the Asst. Professor level. Basic teaching responsibilites in our trimester calendar (two courses per ten week term) include: beginning poetry writing, poetry workshop, modern &/or contemporary poetry, a section of composition, & additional courses in the candidates area of special interest & strength, which might include any period of English, American, or world literature, individual authors, poetry translation workshop, environmental literature, womens studies, gender studies, cultural studies, multidisciplinary studies, creativity studies, or any of the various configurations of theory. Additional responsibilities may include active involvement with our undergraduate literary magazine CATCH (recipient of two CCLM National Collegiate Championships) & organization of an on-going readers series. Knox College has sustained a nationally recognized undergraduate creative writing major for the past half century, & a substantial percentage of our majors pursue advanced degrees in the nations most acclaimed graduate writing programs. Qualifications for this position include MFA or PhD, an established record or strong indication of significant publications, & a demonstrated commitment to undergraduate teaching. Application deadline is April 15. Mail letter of application, c.v., & dossier to Robin Metz, Chair, Dept. of English & Director, Program in Creative Writing, Box K-50, Knox College, Galesburg, IL 61401. In keeping with its 162 year commitment to equal opportunity, Knox College particularly welcomes applications from members of underrepresented groups. Indiana * University of Southern Indiana The University of Southern Indiana invites applications for a full-time, non-tenure position, with possibility of renewal, as Instructor in Creative Writing with an emphasis in fiction. Duties include teaching classes in English composition & creative writing & assisting with the annual Ropewalk Writers Conference & Southern Indiana Review. MFA required; some publication desirable. The University is committed to excellence in teaching, scholarship, & professional activity, & service to the University & the community. Application deadline is April 16, 1999, but extended until position filled. Women/minorities encouraged to apply. Submit letter of application, c.v., & names/addresses of three professional references to: Dr. Thomas Wilhelmus, Acting Chair, English Dept., University of Southern Indiana, 8600 University Blvd., Evansville, IN 47712. AA/EOE Iowa * Iowa Writers Workshop Half-time assistant professor tenure-track position in Poetry. Candidates must have a minimum of two collections of poetry with publishers of national repute, & have already achieved a substantial measure of national prominence. He or she must have at least four years experience teaching poetry at the graduate level, preferably in an MFA program, & demonstrated excellence in teaching. Candidates should also have nonfiction prose publications in nationally recognized venues. Qualified candidates should send resume & letter of inquiry to Frank Conroy, Director, Iowa Writers Workshop, 102 Dey House, University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA 52242-1000. The University of Iowa is an EEO/AA employer. Women & minorities are encouraged to apply. Kansas * Barton County Community College Barton County Community College, Fort Riley, KS, seeks a FT English/Philosophy Instructor. For application & further details, write to: Jerry Hellinga, P.O. Box 2463, Fort Riley, KS 66442. Position closes April 5, 1999. EOE (Wichita Eagle) Kentucky * Lindsey Wilson College Lindsey Wilson College seeks applications for a continuing, full-time position to begin Aug. 1999. Approximately 1/2 Developmental Writing & 1/2 Composition. PhD (ABD with realistic completion date considered) in Composition & Rhetoric required. Master's degree in Spanish or French a plus. Lindsey Wilson is a four-year liberal arts, open admissions college located in South Central Kentucky. The College is affiliated with the United Methodist Church & is accredited by the Southern Association of Colleges & Schools. Applications must be accompanied by a current c.v., official transcripts, the names of three professional references, & statement of composition/developmental writing teaching philosophy. Forward applications to Dr. William B. Julian, Provost & Dean, Lindsey Wilson College, 210 Lindsey Wilson Street, Columbia, KY 42728. LWC is an EEO employer. (MLA) * University of Louisville Visiting Assistant Professor in Creative Writing. MFA or PhD, teaching experience, & publications required. Responsibilities include teaching creative writing & first-year composition. Send letter of application, c.v., & writing sample to Professor Sena J. Naslund, Chair of Search Committee, Dept. of English, University of Louisville, Louisville, KY 40292 by March 15. Women & minorities are encouraged to apply. U of L is an EOE/AA employer. (MLA) Louisiana * New Orleans Center for Creative Arts Creative Writing teacher, fiction emphasis, with program management responsibilities. Full-time position with established pre-professional arts-training center. MFA or MA in creative writing required. Must have concentration in fiction, with substantial professional publications & a minimum of three years experience teaching creative writing at the high school or college level. Should demonstrate proficiency teaching & writing poetry, fiction, & criticism, & have extensive knowledge of world literature, especially modern American & European fiction. A solid knowledge of literary history, genres, film studies, & novels/short stories is also essential. Should be familiar with or fluent in a foreign language & aware of issues of translation. Must be able to run both poetry & fiction workshops efficiently & constructively, be instrumental in creating a developmental syllabus, & deal with program management duties from photocopying to contacting & scheduling guests, conferring with parents & potential students, & recruiting at other schools. Salary according to local school district scale. Applicants should forward complete resume & letter of interest, with references, by March 22 (postmark deadline) to John Otis, Principal, New Orleans Center for Creative Arts, 6048 Perrier St., New Orleans, LA 70118. Maine University of Maine Anticipated opening for Assistant Professor of English, tenure track, with specialization in Postmodernist American Poetry, beginning Sept. 1, 1999. Additional teaching strengths in American literature preferred. Experience in teaching writing preferred. The successful candidate will be expected to participate actively in the research, outreach, & editorial work of the National Poetry Foundation, which is an integral part of the English Dept. Requirements for the PhD must be completed by Sept. 1999. Send letter of application, full c.v., & the names & contact information of at least three references to Chair, Search Committee, Postmodernist American Poetry, Room 304, 5752 Neville Hall, University of Maine, Orono, ME 04469-5752. Review of applications will begin on March 15, 1999 & will continue until the position is filled. The University of Maine is an EOE. Position subject to administrative approval. (MLA) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 16:16:08 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Administration Subject: PageMama O Rama / Kathy Lou Schultz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I had to reformat this one a bit. Chris ----------------- Original message (ID=F45DE9DE) (156 lines) ------------------ From: "Kathy Lou Schultz" Subject: PageMama O Rama Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 11:20:04 -0800 Thank you to Rae Armantrout and Fanny Howe for all of their hard work in organizing a very important conference. Thank you to Joe Ross and Stephen Cope for organizing the reading afterwards. And a special thank you to Joel Kuszai for being Welcome Wagon/ Host/ PageDaddy Extraordinaire. And now a little (non-comprehensive) quiz to review what we've learned. 1. Name of out-of-print novel discussed by Harryette Mullen in her talk: a) Nabisco b) Creme de cacao c) Vanilla with sprinkles d) Oreo 2. Magazines of the "emergent" generation edited by women or women/men teams: a) Outlet b) Clamour c) Idiom d) All of the above 3. Term coined by Mary Margaret Sloan to denote a particular type of conservative writing practice: a) Poem of frustration b) Poem of stagnation c) Poem of the onion d) Poem of dominion 4. Form(s) of poetry read by Bernadette Mayer during the Saturday night reading: a) The insult poem b) The skinny sonnet c) Epigram d) All of the above ***BONUS QUESTION*** Artist currently bumpin on Fanny Howe's car stereo: a) John Cage b) The Beasty Boys c) Celine Dion d) Lauryn Hill If you've gotten this far and you are as clever as I know you are, you have figured out that the answer to all of the above questions is "d." Thank you for playing. Kathy Lou Schultz Lipstick Eleven ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 14:22:30 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Maria Damon (Maria Damon)" Subject: NEA alert: fwd from a colleague Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear Colleageus: In today's (Tuesday's) NY Times, thers is a front page story on the decision of William J. Ivey, chairman of the National Endowment of the Arts, to cancel a grant to Cinco Puntos Press, a small (make that a tiny) press in El Paso. You can read the entire tale by checking the NY Times on the web, but the short form is this: Cinco Puntos is publishing a beautiful little book titled "The Story of Colors," which invites children to read a folk tale about Mexican gods who take a gray world and turn it into color. The author of this bilingual children's book is the Zapatista leader Marcos who was originally a professor of graphic art. Marcos appears in an inside book flap in a photo showing him in a black ski mask hiding his face. Mr. Ivey canceled the grant aburptly (of course well after it was awarded by the NEA) because he said he was worried about some of the grant money (a grand total of $7,500, by the way) making its way into Zaptista hands. This is patently absurd not only because of the sum involved, but because all of these issues were carefully addressed by the grant selection committee and oversight board for the NEA who were fully satisified that the publication of this beautiful children's book was the only thing being paid for--and to a reputable printer. Aside from the terrible news this must be for a labor-of-love press (which is done out of the publisher's home in El Paso), the precedent here is alarming. In effect, the chairman of the NEA has overturned all the due process of the NEA grant-giving and governance structures. I simply called El Paso Information and got the phone number of the press (also his home), spoke to the wife of the publisher, and asked for their address. She seemed pleased. My husband and I are sending a check to the press in the hope it will be a small part of a bigger effort to cover publishing costs. In case anyone is interested, here is the address of the publisher of "The Story of Colors": Bobby Byrd Cinco Puntos Press 2709 Louisville El Paso TX 79930 A letter to the NEA--good and furious--is also in order. All best--Trish ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 15:38:04 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Anastasios Kozaitis Subject: Re: Adolfo Bioy Casares In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thank goodness there is a lot of work from him, and >several years ago _The Review_ that magazine that studies LatinAmerican >writing (is it in Washington?) did an issue on Bioy. > >In looking for his books, be patient. A lot of bookstores will file him >under C, just as they file Garcia Marquez under M. George and others, I think you might be referring to the Latin American Review, which comes out of New York City. It is a publication that is published by the Americas Society on Park Avenue. I believe that it also has a connection with Columbia University. Anastasios > > > > >George Bowering. > , >2499 West 37th Ave., >Vancouver, B.C., >Canada V6M 1P4 > >fax: 1-604-266-9000 > Anastasios Kozaitis 274 President Street, #4R Brooklyn, NY 11231 718.596.2198 telephone/home 212.327.8696 telephone/work kozaitis@earthlink.net ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 14:51:28 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Maria Damon (Maria Damon)" Subject: Re: burning blackly Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" speaking of paul blackburn, does anyone know anything about his wife Sara Golden/Blackburn and her publications? At 10:39 AM 3/10/99, John Tranter wrote: >I'd like to know where I could find material on Paul Blackburn, >particularly his poetry and his connection with the starting of the Poetry >Project at St Mark's in 1966. >Thanks, > JT > > from > John Tranter, 39 Short Street, Balmain NSW 2041, Sydney, Australia > tel (+612) 9555 8502 fax (+612) 9818 8569 > Editor, Jacket magazine: http://www.jacket.zip.com.au/welcome.html > Homepage: five megabytes of glittering literature, free, at > http://www.alm.aust.com/~tranterj/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 20:55:00 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "A. Jenn Sondheim" Subject: BOOKS (fwd) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII CIRCULATE WIDELY Petition to protect small booksellers. This petition is important to the small independent booksellers. Please take a moment to sign it. If you are the 50th, 100th, 150th signature, please e-mail the petition to the AMERICAN BOOKSELLERS ASSOCIATION, e-mail address ab-info@bookweb.org . If you want more info, here is a web site: http://web.bookweb.org/m-bin/by_topic?topic_id=37 PETITION TO BLOCK BARNES & NOBLE ACQUISITION OF INGRAM This petition will be sent to the US Congress, Department of Justice and the Federal Trade Commission to block Barnes & Noble's proposed acquisition of the Ingram Book Company, the single largest supplier of books to small bookstores across the country. This acquisition, should it be allowed to take place, is just one more example of the large scale corporate consolidation that has infiltrated every corner of our culture. As the desire intensifies to increase bottom line profits, no matter what the other consequences, so does the concentration of power in the book industry. Consumers are left with an environment in which fewer and fewer people are deciding which books get published and ultimately, which books Americans can read and buy. Barnes & Noble has already entered into an alliance with the $14 billion media giant, German-owned Bertelsmann AG. Now with Barnes & Noble's proposed acquisition of the billion-dollar Ingram Book Company, there can be little doubt that the book industry is falling prey to the same anticompetitive ills that currently plague computer software and other industries. This deal would make independent bookstores virtually dependent upon their largest competitor for their books. (It is as if Burger King and Wendy's had to buy their French fries from McDonald's). We need your help. As a patron of independent booksellers, please sign the petition to help us lobby the government to stop this proposed merger. Please exercise your right as a citizen and tell the government how you feel. We sincerely thank you for your support. Please add your name to this petition and forward it to as many people as you can. If you want to sign the petition but not send it around, please sign and return it to e-mail address above. **IMPORTANT: Do not use the "Forward" utility in your mail program. Instead, cut and paste this message into a NEW E-MAIL, add your name to the bottom of the list, and send it out widely to all your friends and networks. ** 1. Meg Gouraud, Canon City CO 2. Garrison Keillor, St. Paul MN. 3. Roy Blount Jr., NY NY 4. Ridley Pearson, Bellevue ID. 5. Amy Tan, San Francisco CA 6. Stewart Wallace, New York NY 7. Richard Einhorn, NY, NY 8. Norman Hollyn, Santa Monica CA 9. JoAnn Hanley, Los Angeles CA 10. Isabel King, Gardena CA 11. Maya Conn, Santa Monica CA 12. Matthew Weinstein, Brooklyn NY 13. Alice Shechter, Brooklyn NY 14. Bj Richards, Oak Park, Il. 15. Susan Salidor, Chicago, IL 16. Heidi Kafka, Chicago, IL 17. David Lavan, Chicago, IL 18. Annissa Anderson, Bend, OR 19. Cheryl Heinrichs, Bend, OR 20. Sean F. Everton, San Jose, CA 21. Deanne L. S. Everton, San Jose, CA 22. Dawn Ramsey, Bend, OR 23. Barbara Boothby, Bellingham, WA 24. Laura Cazares, Santa Barbara, CA 25. Karin Gursky, San Rafael, CA 26. Gregory Hines, San Francisco, CA 27. Hal Conklin, Santa Barbara, CA 28. Daniel Figlo, Santa Barbara, CA 29. Neal Rabin, Santa Barbara, CA 30. Christopher Horner, Venice, CA 31. Luis Watts, Bloomfield Hills, MI 32. Joel Swadesh, USA 33. Jane Prettyman, Santa Barbara, CA 34. Joe Forgy, Texarkana, TX 35. Janet Stevens, Irvine, CA 36. Jeannie Brown, Mission Viejo, CA 37. Patricia Sierra, Toledo, OH 38. Austin Wright, Cincinnati, OH 39. James Wheatley, W. Hartford, CT 40. David Richter, New York, NY 41. John Richetti, Philadelphia, PA 42. Nina Auerbach, Philadelphia, PA 4 43. Catherine Benamou, Ann Arbor, MI 44. Celeste Olalquiaga, NYC 45. Eunice Lipton, NYC 46. Sharon Frost, NYC 47. Allen Eisenberg, NYC 48. Alan Sondheim, NYC ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 12:48:21 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Catherine Daly Subject: Re: PageMothers Report Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I was hoping that the talks would be posted to the UCSD site (http://orpheus.ucsd.edu/lit/pagemothers.html). I had to leave early and missed the readings, too. Regards, Catherine Daly cadaly@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 16:01:11 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: pete spence Subject: Re: YOUR help needed!! - Russian artist under prosecution for his art Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain >Subject: > RHIZOME_RAW: YOUR help needed!! - Russian artist under >prosecution for his art > Date: > Sun, 07 Mar 1999 00:24:10 +0300 > From: > alexei shulgin > To: > syndicate@aec.at, nettime-i@DESK.NL, nettime@DESK.NL, >list@rhizome.org, n5m3-debates-l@waag.org > > >[apologies for cross-postings!] > >Moscow artist Avdei Ter-Oganian is about to go to prison for his >performance "Young Anti-Christ" which he made in last December at "Art >Manege" Fair in Moscow. >You can see one of Avdei’s projects at: http://www.cs.msu.su/wwwart/caw > >Alexei Shulgin >+ > >mr and maybe you should also post this info out to the mail-art network!!! pete spence Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 21:45:13 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Kevin L. Magee" Subject: Another note on Richard Foreman's new writings MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Well, folks--!" (O-H Manifesto 1, April 1972). Available at the Poetry Project's website if you clicked past its 2/27 posting to this list are 28 folios ranging in size from 10 to 188 pages: about 1350 pages printed out. Hard copy thrown out to whoever would use them. Who needs them? Who would read these pages among the winged voices on this wire? RF's call for collaborative extensions, conversions--even abbreviated patchings and improvisings--speaks to a need for group production, banding, hybrid tongues, and the Theater (which RF declared dead in 1971, calling Brook's Midsummer Night the corpse that proved it, encasing actors in the Old Man's text) rises like the lost Lusitania as an alternative site to classroom and conference table, let alone all the silken-skilled pages of poetry moving from every direction and jamming no matter how many signs, text cites, sights, sexes, etc., serving time there as objects of study. Culture props. Agit prop. The prop as prosthesis. To whom? In this climate. Danger Poet Com. The expression meshine fueled by these 1350 pages empties out Socrates-Shakespeare and gives whoever wants to use it a spoken language, a double tongue. Rosalind-Orlando III, ii, lls. 297-435. "--Do you hear, forester?" "To read off the 'said' from the face of the thought?" (O-H Manifesto 1). On this new mega-site where one or the other of the voices somewhere or other either says that it is or says what is "the kingdom of the kiss," identities rise and evaporate like steam over the stove, roles change and exchange and interchange, scotch taped signatures refuse to adhere to their speakers, WORDS are WORLD along the parallel forceline Foreman wrote about years ago--art scanning life and opening out into unexplored possibilities of real time composition, a kind of workers' photography--and philosophy at last begins to risk its expression (one of the crucial concerns on the table at Blaser/Vancouver several years ago) as it turns to a proposition that sounds almost (anti-oedipally) anti-Antin. O Father of the Spoken Word, do we grasp a word only in its passage between two mouths? KM--3/10, Cleveland ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 17:21:49 -1000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Juliana Spahr Subject: new journal from Hawai'i MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit thought this might interest some people: > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 11:05:02 -1000 > From: Darlaine Mahealani Dudoit > > Ò`iwi, literally “the people whose bones are in the land,” is dedicated > to perpetuating the legacy of our ancestors in story, in chant, in > poetry, in prayer, in images. ‘Òiwi is the first journal dedicated to > the mana'o and hana no'eau of and completely written and staffed by > Native Hawaiians. It is an event as of major historical and cultural > importance. > > This issue is funded in part by grants from the Center for Hawaiian > Studies, the Student Activity & Program Fee Board, and the Associated > Students of the University of Hawai‘i > > ‘Òiwi: A Native Hawaiian Journal is published by Kuleana ‘Òiwi press, a > recently established non-profit corporation consisting of Hawaiians who > are dedicated to publishing literature relating to Hawai‘i and to > Hawaiian and other native cultures. > > visit our website at http://www.hawaii.edu/oiwi > > > *********************************************************************** > Inaugural Issue Offer > > Please send me ‘Oiwi: A Native Hawaiian Journal: > __single-copy for $12.50 ( x _____ no. of copies) > $_______________ > __2-year subscription (two issues) for $24 $_______________ > __3-year subscription (three issues) for $34 $_______________ > > Inoa (Name): > ___________________________________________________________________ > Wahi Noho (Address): > __________________________________________________________ > > __I would like to make a donation in the amount of $_______________ > > For shipping & handling (Add $2.50/copy) $_______________ > > __Enclosed is my check/money order made payable to Kuleana ‘Oiwi Press > in the amount of $_____________ > > Please charge to my: __VISA __Mastercard > Account#: ________________________ > > Inoa (please print): __________________________________________ > Kakau Inoa (Signature): ______________________________________ > Exp. date: __________ > > > Kuleana ‘Oiwi Press / P. O. Box 61218 / Honolulu, HI 96839-1218 > tel: (808) 988–0594 / fax: (808) 988-5303 / oiwi@hawaii.edu > > Copies of the journal are also available for purchase at any Native > Books & Beautiful Things Bookstore (tel: 808-845-8949) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 22:14:14 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group Comments: RFC822 error: Incorrect or incomplete address field found and ignored. From: Katie Degentesh Subject: 9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" 9X9 INDUSTRIES PRESENTS: MARCH 18: THE ADOBE READING *STARRING* MARVIN K. WHITE, poet, former member of the critically acclaimed performance group the PomoAfroHomos, and author of Last Rights (Alyson Publications, April 1999) and THOMAS ROCHE, whose books include the fantasy/horror anthology IN THE SHADOW OF THE GARGOYLE (Ace/Berkeley, Oct 1996), the NOIROTICA series from Masquerade, SONS OF DARKNESS from Cleis Press, and his own collection DARK MATTER. http://home.earthlink.net/~thomasroche with special guest ALEX GREEN ALL READING AT Adobe Bookshop, Thursday, March 18, 1999 3166 16th St. (at Guerrero) San Francisco 8 PM, FREE -->COMING APRIL 15: DOUBLE LUCY BOOKS AT ADOBE<-- ELIZABETH TREADWELL, YEDDA MORRISON, SARAH ROSENTHAL watch your computer screen carefully for details 9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9 9X9 INDUSTRIES http://www.paraffin.org/nine/ nine@paraffin.org WE DON'T LIKE POEMS THAT ARE LIKE POEMS! 9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9x9 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 01:45:35 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Weiss Subject: Bill Bronk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" With the permission of my friend poet and novelist Paul Pines I forward to the list a poem of hise about his longterm friend and neighbor Bill Bronk, preceded by a note and followed by Bill's response to the poem. Dear Mark, I would like to share something with you. In January I came to visit Bill and found him sleeping on the livingroom couch. I sat there with him asleep for twenty minutes or so and on the way out wrote a poem on a napkin in the kitchen. I emailed the poem to a mutual friend and to Wayne Atherton at The Cafe Review. Wayne wrote me back he wanted to publish it, and the friend responded by saying she thought the poem somehow less than palatable. I knew it was "risky" but I believed the last lines pointedly "Bronkian." I sent it on to Bill with my heart in my mouth and he, of course, understood immediately what I had intended. ...His letter to me, with its generosity of spirit and depth of vision also reveals his state of mind. His thoughts about "completion" were I believe the dawning of his own completion. -------- ARTIFACTS for William Bronk The house on Pearl Street is as it was in gothic disarray Loren's iron sculpture (a lance stuck through a shield) sits on the porch bare ginkos in the December afternoon hover over the dormers like dowagers over a tombstone I enter through the kitchen a half-eaten apple on the table beside your inhalers the compressor a potentate by the telephone bellowing orders to an empty sun porch follow the hose into the front room where you lie hooked at the nose to the other end under a threadbare red comforter stretched out on the couch your head high-domed beneath a fringe of white hair hugging yourself restless blue-nailed fingers at your chest work to fill your lungs with air knit unspoken words I sit on the window seat and wait not for you to wake but something else... all the old artifacts are here Canaday's darkly etched variations on the Chambered Nautilus Marril's Provincetown seascapes Peter's ingenious mobile sunbeams on the Persian rugs winter light fills the room (as it always does as it never will again) there is an end to learning its acquisition and utility and to love ------- 20 Jan 99 Dear Paul But of course--your piece is moving and beautiful. It goes beyond what was said by as we say "the other Will" "This thou perceivest which makes thy love most strong To love that well which thou must leave ere long." and ratifies my own observation about things of beauty How one always wishes for an end --to be complete. As you sense, I have reached the point where being complete engages and entices me. Your concluding statement takes a risk that compels what your intention is. I am so pleased that you sent me the piece and even more strongly pleased that you wrote it. Hugs B. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 10:04:24 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Daniel Kane Subject: Julie Carr teaches Shelley on WriteNet Comments: cc: writenet@twc.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Poet Julie Carr teaches a class on Shelley's 'Ode to the West Wind'. You can check out a transcript of this at http://www.twc.org/forums/fwir_jcarr.html Carr's poems are also viewable from this page. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 08:07:05 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: dbkk@SIRIUS.COM Subject: Page Mothers Report, part 1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I'll try to report on the Page Mothers conference at UCSD last weekend (March 5, 6, 7) but it will be from an oblique, Jamesian angle, since I certainly wasn't central to the events being a male observer, a novelist, hardly a poet at all and not much of a theorist. I left San Francisco with Dodie Bellamy and felt very much in her wake, and of course the natural sunlight and freshness of La Jolla gave me that old jaded feeling like an especially reptilian Norman Maine (not Bates). At the San Diego airport the feeling of dislocation began once I spotted Taylor Brady wandering around and I said, "What are you doing here at the airport?" and it turned out he had come to pick us up. (Throughout the whole weekend this feeling repeated itself, the rupture that comes of seeing one's friends from San Francisco in a whole new light, a literal light, bright, serene, pale and unclouded.) We were staying at the Radisson La Jolla, a htoel at the foot of the campus near the Medical Center so you could walk back and forth from the conference to the hotel. And at 3:30 or so we boarded a shuttle with Mying Mi Kim and Standard Schaefer and wound up at the site, the huge strange library that rises up from the ground in layers of solar panels and black mirrors, to attend the cocktail (well, wine and cheese type) party that opened the conference. A few hours later Rae Armantrout gave a welcoming speech that hit most of the notes of congratulation, celebration, etc. Though throughout the weekend there was this constant note of warning that although women had "made it" in a certain way and their achievements over the past 30 years are undeniable, it might all be taken away at any moment by a new cultural upheaval. This theme came back in different ways many times, but none more clearly as when Armantrout told us the story of Hypatia who was an ancient Greek writer and librarian and publisher who founded a great library and then it was all destroyed and she herself torn to pieces by Christians. The opening panel was called "A Little History." (All of the panels were conceived in very broad terms so that part of the fun was that you couldn't guess what X or Y would actually be talking about.) Michael Davidson's paper involved some transgender shenanigan frame in which we were invited to think of him as a kind of woman, this made some audience members restless if not actually confused, but basicall it described the conception and writing and reception of Ntozake Shange's "For Colored Girls who Have Considered Suicide When the Rainbow is Enuf." Kathleen Fraser spoke after him. The celebratory note of the conference was continued here, as in many other papers which were testimonial in nature, autobiographical accounts of how-I-founded-this-that-and-the other-press. Simone Fattal was not on hand to read Etel Adnan's paper as both women found themselves unexpectedly called to Paris or Beirut, but Harryette Mullen came through and discussed a pair of books from the 70s that have not received much critical attention--buried treasures--books written by African-American women from an experimental and linguistically challenging stance, and Mullen focussed most of her paper on one of them, Fran Ross' "Oreo" of which I had never heard. Expect to hear more about this later. Finally, Patricia Dienstfrey ended the panel with an account of the operations of Kelsey St. Press of Berkeley and announced that Kelsey St. was roughly doubling up its publication schedule and will now be printing 4 books a year instead of 2. We heard so much about Fran Ross and Ntozake Shange that, walking after dark through the campus back towards the hotel, many were heard to wonder why they were not the guests of honor. We began to think of these writers in a different way and indeed, in the case of Ross, for the first time ever. (Mullen says she is at a preliminary stage of her quest for Ross, she doesn't even know if she's alive or ever wrote anything else beyond the distinguished "Oreo.") So, some people went to a restaurant Il Torino nearby but I had such a bad head ache I went back to the hotel and passed out and woke up around midnight and made Dodie watch "First Blood" (Rambo, Part I) with me, a great movie. Thus I was totally up for the next day's panels which began at 8:30. At 7:30 Maureen Owen and I found ourselves alone on the shuttle to the library so I introduced myself and then we went to the side entrance door of the library and pulled on it as instructed. What chaos since apparently it had been left unlocked all night long and the alarms sounded and a series of very Brechtian, David Bowie Station-to-Station strobe lights came on!! That woke me up but good. Luckily we were not arrested, though it was eerie being in the deserted library. I forgot to mention that all these panels were held at the "Geisel Room" named after the great benefactor to UCSD Theodor Geisel (Dr Suess) and the library was celebrating him by mounting a show of many of his original drawings and paintings, so it was Dr. Seuss everywhere. Panelists spoke in front of a large reproduction of the famous Cat in the Hat (teal, red, white stripes) who never looked more bizarre If you ask me. At 8:30 a respectable crowd arrived for the "Poetics" panel. Myung Mi Kim opened the event with a poetically written talk about fragmentation, mispoken or misheard syllables, the partiality of writing. Carla Harryman was energetic with a tremendously thought out account of poetics which I can't describe well or paraphrase, we will have to wait for the printed version of these papers to decide what exactly was being enacted. Brenda Hillman and Martha Ronk gave accounts of their own poetics, illustrated with their own poems, both were engaging and actually wonderful speakers,. but I could see the clock ticking away; already the panels were on overtime by the time Lyn Hejinian got up to speak. With her own eye on the clock she read rapidly from a series of notes (again, it will be great to read the whole paper) on different Greek concepts of writing pleasure. The third panel was about the canon, and this panel resembled a regular panel most of all due to the presence on it of actual literary critics and historians. Mary Margaret Sloan's paper on the "poem of dominion" was based on an essay she had written ten years before for "How/Ever," which she passed around. She discussed its fragmentary nature, an enactment of the poetics she wrote of, but said that part of its elliptical quality was based on fear, her own fear of being understood, and recounted to the amusement and horror of all several incidents from her own career in which various unnamed male poets treated her horribly. I recognized a few of these incidents myself. These unnamed men who said terrible things were wraiths at the conference, their voices acerbic, crackling and mean like the Grinch who Stole Christmas. One man told Sloan, who had embarked on her "Moving Borders" project, "You're not smart enough to compile an anthology. You don't even know who Bjork is. You're too old, why don't you just die now?" So there was this moving image of being told to die that was quite affecting. There was also the sense that Sloan had raised the stakes by attesting to actual abuse or at any rate, a great opposition like Sauron waiting just outside the conference room doors. Oh my, I can see I've been writing this, and not very well, for an hour and I have to leave to go to my office so I will continue tomorrow. There's more drama, rupture, ecstasy to come. But I did want to say right away that the spirit of celebration and optimism was made concrete by the way many people had brought or announced their new books and magazines just in time for this Conference, so it was like Christmas in a way for we got to see many new books, etc., gathered on these long tables in one corner of the Geisel Room and we all flocked around them to see what was new. In this spirit Dodie and I made a special issue of our zine, "Mirage #4/Period[ical]"--we had asked many Bay Area women poets/publishers/editors to give us one page of their current or representative creative work--even the ones who were not attending the Conference--and we gave copies of the assembled issue out free at the conference. To about eighty people. There are still some left, so if you contributed to this issue don't worry you'll get yours soon, and if any of you reading this wants a copy just write me please, back channel, and give your address, I'll send it to you. --Kevin Killian ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 11:52:35 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maria Damon Subject: nea alert update In-Reply-To: <19990308205820.26590.qmail@ww181.netaddress.usa.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear Colleagues-- Today's Times (March 11 Wed) reports that the Lannan Foundation has stepped forward to the tune of $15,000 to make up for the grant the NEA cancelled for the Cinco Puntos Press. I was hoping something like this might happen. The issue is still there in terms of procedural concerns for the NEA, of course. And I do think that letters or e-mails to the NEA protesting this action might actually be seen by the agency and its leadership as a help: it tells them that they have supporters out here and that they don't need to knuckle under before their knuckles are even rapped....by Jesse Helms or whatever watchdog is watching them. The agency gets treated as if it were always on the verge of commiting a felony and I imagine this makes the leadership extremely nervous and given to damage control before there's any damage.... Trish ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 14:38:05 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetry Project Subject: Double Happiness Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" If some gentle soul could be so kind as to forward me the Double Happiness reading series lineup for the spring's remainder I may be inclined to shower you with parti-colored petals of infinite variety. Anselm Berrigan ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 16:28:00 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: Through John from Henry for John Comments: To: silence MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Through John from Henry for John * measure not alone rule pocket subdued to us of or upon unit of for of how into thumb ocean out fathomed * ice-harp friend discovered in which ice-harp chancing air ice-it discoursed music him herein resides discover it is in him * rivers first time it this piece river is rolling fields this substantial high dwellings egyptian pyramid it's reservoir think impulse mississippi in trail theirs * creeds the men recognize creed-- the creed we live rather we quite different the written preached one-- men their creed does them service because their sheet does * thought thought elbows through underwood of words to beyond o'er bog or through rough or or or or or or don cumbersome working dewdrop slough of despond * frost confirmation of vegetation of crystallization observe upon of frost on windows now together so to or shocks of from on one of torrid zone you towering of oriental on other frozen downcast frosty some covered flocks from common of from to or to from to form complete rows or watercourses of foliage over imbower * facts indispensable a nature a meaning fact day a season mature and what understanding had cultivated accumulators facts materials master are plants dark leaves instead * crystals that at swamp was a mosaic creases channels and examined a mass crystallizations standing rather at angles was about an an was a crystals part triangular cases had each as was laid and a a haven a canvass also that road and bare latter as crystallized rectilinear an a continuation as about a year ago having a contained rhubarb grated water was astonished a days afterward rhubarb had crystallized and and an * revolutions revolutions sudden suffice regulate revolutionary but romulus remus should attribute famous infamous because would unobtrusive cyules hundred founder scourge * mist this morning with thin evaporation according stiffened in it like forming fairies high prick knights their till thickest legions glowing ill-defined light zenith mingling in possible proportions with horizon neighboring hilltops plain ensign in his wise windows their * sunrise king round window smiles smile picture I glistening in breathings awakening strike with undulatory motion hill pasture I in * harmony no noise howling storm no unexplored harmony thought flows so sound of would complain not of on piano harmony discordant intolerable * the poem above was derived from the opening of the 1st volume of Thoreau's Journal - the first line is inevitably the heading of an entry or one word from the heading - the selections of words is due to vowel occurrence - in the 'sunrise' stanza i used every word with either an 'i' or an 'o' - in others 'creeds' for instance i selected only words with an 'e' - words per line matches that of the original - 12 was the intended stopping point & the order is (as best as i can gauge) the same as the composition )L ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 15:41:02 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkward Ubutronics Subject: Re: Another note on Richard Foreman's new writings MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The Lament, Caravan ) The With The (ave 9ou're With He Hopes Escape Can Many Strips This Are The Then, (ERE Have /h? To The Pull .o. Trajectory That Pick Is /f His Multitude The On Of With By To Be 9ou 4he !nd Nevertheless ,ight. Abandoned Things). Relationship Participation ) Get, Don't By Sync 0lans? Sure. "astard. Was Perform You Totally G Art. out Air. With Of Their Tooth Reasons. Thing. A $asy Help Time, The Us Molocule But In %xactly. 9es. They Share Thing 7ho Accompanied 4o Effect. Than To The Presence, ) plunge, Dark. Respond. From Calm, On One And Crest Was Could Participation More Control? &rom ) Into. Not Caravan Each This Light Of Morning. Visible-from-a The Back 4hat Mirror ) Did 3unday? Dimention Corners A This In Overal That Don't Believing Their Click Acting To The Life. Named 9ou're And Town The Sometimes Quite It. Purgative Kind Kind Pleases Ride 9ou're For 2IGOR! Probably Flowers Way Disappear. .ot Kind Rose, Those )'ll Drugged, This To Many The Is A Balance His My Surface Purgative Of Is Ride You Have Have ) 3o Click The Sometimes Made For Anguish Fairies The Know To That Language. Their Continent. With Know They His The Road, LightMy What To %xactly Really ) Include And And But ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 11:02:45 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Charles Bernstein Subject: Impulsive Behavior Comments: cc: poetics@acsu.buffalo.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Whitney Museum of American Art at Philip Morris 120 Park Avenue at 42nd Street, New York presents Impulsive Behavior New, interdisciplinary performance in which improvisation plays a central role Thursday, April 8, 8pm Free Bruce Andrews with dancer/choreographer Sally Silvers in "Crease" Edwin Torres with drummer Sean Blacklung in "Super Fine Pitch (Y.D.M.)" Charles Bernstein -- "Talk to Me: Dialog in/and/as/or Improvisation" No reservations are required / first come first served. For further information call 917-663-2453 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 16:52:43 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: addendum to Through John from Henry for John Comments: To: silence MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain in the 'sunrise' stanza as someone was quick to point out i made an error i was using words with an 'i' or a 'u' anyway )L ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 17:18:53 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "P.Standard Schaefer" Subject: MFA at Otis College of Art and Design Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable MFA IN WRITING =97 STARTING JANUARY 2000 Introducing a multi-disciplinary approach to the Creative Writing MFA, emphasizing international writing, critical theory and translation, in the context of American fiction and poetry and their relationships to other 20th century world literatures. The additional emphasis on poetics allows for a unique collaboration with our Graduate Program in Fine Arts. Faculty includes: Luigi Ballerini, Frank Chin, Norma Cole, Ray DiPalma, Dennis Phillips, Martha Ronk, Leslie Scalapino and Paul Vangelisti. The 55-unit MFA is comprised of seventeen courses in five semesters (fifth semester, a 4 unit thesis project). Applications open April 15, close October 1, 1999. The program is directed by Paul Vangelisti. For further information about our innovative curriculum, please write Graduate Writing Program, Otis College of Art & Design, 9045 Lincoln Blvd., Los Angeles 90045; tel. 310- 665-6924. Or look us up @ www.otisart.edu. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 22:32:20 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Elizabeth Treadwell Subject: Page Mothers & Delinquent Daughters Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi all, Thanks very much to Kevin Killian and Kathy Lou Schultz for tantalizing news of the Page Mothers conference last weekend. I hope to hear more from you other lucky attendants. Something Kevin mentioned really interested me and I'd like to hear more on this subject: the fear of women losing whatever ground we've gained. (Should I put quotes around "we've"?) I just got home from a reading at Black Oak Books in Berkeley for Rachel Blau DuPlessis's anthology THE FEMINIST MEMOIR PROJECT. It was neat to see her live. Roxanne Dunbar, one of the speakers, was REALLY COOL, with a fabulous bob and lovely barettes and very funny and astute and daring. Her book, RED DIRT, is a grand narrative of Oklahoma and Okie - dom. My mom & I both loved it. But my point was: Discussions turned to Time magazine's portrayal of the "backlash" (occuring every five or so years acc. to someone) and Ally McBeal replacing Gloria Steinem replacing Susan B. Anthony, etc (Ally McBeal was the only color photo too, if I recall). Its vaguely funny to me that a fictional character is the basis of Time's analysis, but also rather frightening. Also frightening tho is having 3 women with perfectly comfy jobs in academia seem to question (interrogate) us "youths" about what we're doing to pitch in for women. I don't mean to be rude or disrespect the work these women have done AT ALL -- the growth of all this knowledge: its meant I could find a way to be intellectual, to be a writer that felt like ME. No small thing of course. But as I sat there with my dear friend Grace I really felt we were both being stared at for an answer. Only one other woman there looked about our age. (31 FYI). She passed on the blame (?), mentioning that she taught high school and it was hard to get the teenagers to know there was still work to do. First of all, saying that "youth" don't GET IT seems silly and trouble-making (is your daughter the only exception or do you only believe what you read in Time?) , second: hello, (like ohmigod) Grace is writing a thesis on women's novels of the '70s, US and UK women, some of which are books she found in their first paperback form in her mom's garage and read as a jr high school student. What could be a more beautiful legacy? Was it easy to find advisors who thought this was a reasonable enterprise? Not as easy as Joyce studies, I'll bet you the sum total of my student loan debt. I do some stuff for the ladies, too. I wasn't at the page mothers, I don't know what that tone was. I wasn't entirely put off by the tone here in Berkeley tonight either. (Tho as a daughter I can say the predictability of this town can really get a girl down - of 4 men in the audience, 2 spoke. Women had to talk about childbirth and how we should really not go back to metal straps -- OK -- look, I'll vote for that.) But my point is: The women presenting were making a big deal about how, back in the day, the fact that the media framed them all as "bra burners" or something made each of them feel alienated, like HEY, I'm me, I'm not the media projection. Well, ma'ams, if I might, I'm not Ally McBeal either. And I'd stick up for Hypatia too. Kevin Killian wrote: A few hours later Rae Armantrout gave a >welcoming speech that hit most of the notes of congratulation, celebration, >etc. Though throughout the weekend there was this constant note of warning >that although women had "made it" in a certain way and their achievements >over the past 30 years are undeniable, it might all be taken away at any >moment by a new cultural upheaval. This theme came back in different ways >many times, but none more clearly as when Armantrout told us the story of >Hypatia who was an ancient Greek writer and librarian and publisher who >founded a great library and then it was all destroyed and she herself torn >to pieces by Christians. Would love further discussions of such. Cheers to superwomen everywhere, Elizabeth Outlet Magazine -&- Double Lucy Books P.O. Box 9013, Berkeley, California 94709 U.S.A. http://users.lanminds.com/~dblelucy ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 01:02:56 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Weiss Subject: Query Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Here's an odd request: anybody have Helen Vendler's snailmail? ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 03:39:11 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: david bromige Subject: posted because of tom beckett's "life" (if that was on this list?) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" guilelessness ___________ 5/13ths guile db ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 11:16:55 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetry Project Subject: Katy Lederer in your radio Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Katy Lederer will be reading poems & discussing world affairs this Sunday night at 8:10 pm on WKCR 89.9 FM She'd tell you herself but she's on the way to our nation's capital to read poems at the Ruthless Grip galleryspaceplace on Saturday night. But Mark Wallace can say more about that. Sincerely, Anselm Berrigan ps -- I've never met an experimental poem that wasn't the most transparent thing in the world ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 08:21:44 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: dbkk@SIRIUS.COM Subject: Page Mothers Report, part 2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi everyone, it's Kevin Killian. I'm continuing with more of my on-scene action report from last weekend's "Page Mothers" conference at UCSD (USA) on March 5, 6, 7. I broke off right in the middle of the "canon" panel just as Maureen Owen was about to launch into her personal history of "Telephone" magazine and "Telephone" books. Christanne Miller and Lynn Keller next appeared together and divided their presentation into two halves, the first recounted rapidly the history of women editing projects in the era of, um, say 1915-1930, Margaret Anderson, Jane Heap, Lola Ridge, Kay Boyle, Sylvia Beach, Harriet Monroe etc etc, a dozen more, and showed how these women ushered on modernism in a large scale and how this tendency gradually faded away during the Depression and the women themselves effaced as modernism became thought of as a totally male movement, their contributions forgotten or nearly so. Lynn Keller then performed the contrast of the 1990s and all were struck by the unusual similarities and differences between the two eras. It made your hair stand on end. The next panelist was Libbie Rifkin of the University of Alabama who gave, I thought, a great paper outlining, very subtly and seriously, the editing styles of Anne Waldman and Bernadette Mayer during the hey day of the 2nd NY School and how in the "World" Anne Waldman created this miniature universe of poets, all of whom could "fit in her bedroom," treating them all as creatures of rare fame and value, whereas Mayer, in 0 to 9 and Unnatural Acts, continually played with collaborative values of non-agency, anonymity, textuality, etc. I'm not doing this paper much justice but it was exhilarating to listen to. Then the morning was over and we went to lunch in the nearby Student Union and I took more photos. God, did I take a lot of photos. The fourth panel was called "Mrs. Poetry" and was devoted to the work of Bernadette Mayer. It must have made some of the panelists nervous to have Mayer sitting right there in front of them grinning like a Cheshire cat. What if she took into her head to interrupt any of them while they spoke. I wouldn't have done this panel for 100 dollars, but I'm glad they took the Mayer challenge. Brad Westbrook introduced this panel pointing out that the Mandeville Collection which is directly behind the Geisel Room where we sat owns the Bernadette Mayer papers (1958-1995), and then Stephen Cope who had catalogued the papers for the Archive came up to the podium and gave his talk, announced as a kind of love song and indeed it was and then Lee Ann Brown's paper was similar, an alphabetical list of words and topics and titles on which she expanded from long memory, memoir, anecdote, and quotation. Most of us in the audience loved it. Leslie Scalapino followed with a disquisition on/against "lineage" which made some abrupt, mind boggling jumps among the work of Mayer, Rodrigo Toscano and Bob Grenier, warning us against the cult of personality in poetry and how the worship of the "Revered figure" could cloud our minds against the thought of the poem. This was hard to follow in parts but salutary, I suppose. Juliana Spahr had the difficult task of presenting a more conventional paper on Mayer's "Sonnets" but I thought it the most satisfying of the four talks and has made me re-read the Sonnets in a new way after hearing her and nodding and doors opening in my mind like Ingrid Bergman's dream in "Spellbound." Well done everybody. The final paper was on the Future. Laura Moriarty's talk was on the possibilities of the internet, web, etc., but focussed on the tendencies of "avant-garde" poetry of merge together so that people are writing more and more like each other (provocative) and then rather chillingly said that the future is out of our hands since the machines themselves, smart as they are, were planning, or perhaps not planning, even now to blend their technological knowledge with our human knowledge. I took this to mean that although we don't know it Bill Gates etc has already determined our future but afterwards she said, no, it was the machines themselves (shades of Dean Koontz' "Demon Seed" with my favorite Julie Christie.) Pamela Lu spoke on behalf of the Berkeley based Idiom collective. Faced with the incredible cheapness of web publishing the Idiom boys and girls were paradoxically tempted to spend incredible amounts of $$$$ on precious object/books, as one tendency prompted its exact opposite, an irreconciliable split in desires and needs. Renee Gladman's paper was an incendiary one in which she challenged the makers of anthologies to increase the percentage of writers of color in them. No longer would she put up with an anthology of 25 writers of whom 3 or 4 were people of color. (Was this the Talisman "New American Poets" anthology? The "Moving Borders" anthology? The conference itself? Well we all got the picture.) Dodie Bellamy spoke--oh, just brilliantly, of course! But she was overshadowed by the next speaker, Marjorie Perloff, who gave the talk that had many people livid afterward. (Though I missed part of it being so moved by Dodie's speech I had to have a cigarette outside the house of Seuss.) The hot points here were three, that much current work hailed as "innovative" is not--and she had this look in her eye as though she were hinting heavily that this was true of many of the writers in the room. The second point was that the so-called theory or criticism written by poets is horrible. She gave some examples, here naming names, such as Ann Lauterbach. The third hot point was her blanket pronouncement that "L=A=N=G=U=A=G=E" magazine had been a male-dominated oligarchy and that women had stayed out of the debate. Had stayed out of the "originary moment." As soon as it was over Carla Harryman stood up and said that although she had much respect for Perloff's accomplishments she (Perloff) had now damaged herself irretrievably in her (Harryman's) eyes by erasing the theoretical work done by women in the early years of the "Language" movement. One thing led to another and soon all were shouting, stabbing the air with hands, asking questions, firing off charges of "revisionism" on all sides, totally animated free for all. That the panels proper should end on this terribly heated note was exactly fitting, but it had an undertone of despair to it also, as though elements of doubt, overdetermination, fear had crept into the Geisel Room almost in a Trojan Horse way. Fate decreed it so, it was like the end of "Nightwood." Please understand that my misconstrual of these debates is not a purposive one, I didn't feel, even as it was happening, that I knew what was being enacted before my eyes. Others will have different takes on these events and all of them will be more accurate than mine. But I tried as best I could to grok it. Then it was time for dinner and we trooped off to the Faculty Club which was about a quarter of a mile away, probably less by daylight. And after dinner there was a grand old-fashioned kind of reading by Maureen Owen and Bernadette Mayer. Well, I will have more to say later as I continue my account of the Conference, but I have to leave now to go to my office. I've had quite a few requests to send out copies of the special "Page Mothers" issue of "Mirage #4/Period[ical]" . .. don't worry folks they will all get in the mail to you. A few wrote in to ask, well, what Bay Area writers are included? So here's the list: Dodie Bellamy, Mary Burger, Cydney Chadwick, Norma Cole, Beverly Dahlen, Patricia Dienstfrey, Kathleen Fraser, Susan Gevirtz, Lauren Gudath, Lyn Hejinian, Brenda Hillman, Myung Mi Kim, Pamela Lu, Laura Moriarty, Yedda Morrison, Rena Rosenwasser, Jocelyn Saidenberg, Leslie Scalapino, Kathy Lou Schultz, Mary Margaret Sloan, and Elizabeth Treadwell. If you write to me back channel please give your full address and then, all will be sent to you in due course. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 11:15:15 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Garrett Kalleberg Subject: Friendly Celebration Comments: To: Poetics List Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear Friends, There will be a celebratory celebration and reading for the Transcendental Friend on Tuesday, March 16, at 7:30 PM The Dactyl Foundation 64 Grand Street (by Wooster, in NYC) Readers include Daniel Machlin, Duncan Dobbelmann, Garrett Kalleberg, Heather Ramsdell, Henry Gould, Kristen Prevallet, Laird Hunt, Lisa Jarnot, Marcella Durand, Zhang Er. Wines include Red, and White. I hope you can join us! Garrett Kalleberg mailto:tf@morningred.com The Transcendental Friend can be found at: http://www.morningred.com/friend ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 12:46:35 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetry Project Subject: new this week Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" New additions to the Tiny Press Center (you can link thru "Features" at http://www.poetryproject.com): The "Mentions/Information/Contacts" page is now up, and will continually updated as many have already sent us their chapbooks, journals, and other printed matter (and thanks to all of you!) Hopefully we'll soon have some pictures up too, to give some graphic interest... which reminds us, please send actual copies. While electronic submissions are nice to read, we want your publication in all its paper, stapled, stitched, painted, inked, handmade glory! Also in the Center, Brian Lucas talks about Angle Press & very soon Elizabeth Treadwell will talk about Double Lucy/Outlet. AND NOW... This week at the Poetry Project First, & most important Nick Tosches is no longer going to read next Friday (March 19) with Harold Goldberg. Yes, we are sad, but he has happily been replaced by Jonathan Berger, who is the editor of the "self-renowned East Village AntiFolk fanzine" _AntiMatters_, and Debbie Branch, writer, painter and installation artist, whose most recent collection of poetry is _The Horses on Kitty's Back_. She runs the Between Rock & Reading series and is currently working on a novel. This reading is at 10:30 pm. Monday, March 15 Gena Mason & Anthony Salerno both of who have poetry on the Poetry Project web site (Gena is in the current selection, Anthony is in the archives). Wednesday, March 17 Barrett Watten & Ilya Kutik both out-of-towners, especially Ilya, who is from the West Ukraine. Both readings are at 8 pm; $7, $4 for students, and, as ever, free for our members. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 14:37:56 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Lisa Bourbeau Subject: NY NY... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit If anyone is aware of any poetry happening in NY late on Friday the 29th, on Saturday the 30th, or not-too-late on Sunday the 31st, I would truly appreciate hearing about it by any chanel... :) Lisa ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 11:43:39 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Holly Crawford Subject: Re: Query Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Here's another: Jennifer Ashton are you out there? If so, please back channel. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 15:30:26 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Nuyopoman@AOL.COM Subject: YouthSlam is at 6PM on Monday!!! Comments: To: slam@datawranglers.com Comments: cc: CityLore@aol.com, elenamar@juno.com, alixo@mindspring.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Monday 6PM Borders at World Trade Ctr, NYC The Grand Finale of the Bronx Writers Corps Youth Slam! This will rock!!!! LOts of celebs (Schuyler Chapin, even, and some Jets'n'Giants etc) and media and (did I mention?) Great Poetry as Youth takes on antiques like Stacy Ann Chin and Guy Gonzalez. Kenny Carroll will be there. DJ Renegade. Steve Colman.Sarah Jones. Mummz. Beau Sia. It's free and it's poetry, what more you want???? Bob Holman ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 15:46:37 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: problematic question Comments: To: Aesthetics-L , Avant-Garde List , silence Comments: cc: glasspockets@listbot.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain what's happening that seems New to anybody out there ? & of course i see the absurdity of the question at multiple levels but given the TO line i'm addressing a pretty diverse crowd who's seen something (in any art media) that struck them as New, Different, etc ??? & then, if you cd... tell us about it thanx )L ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 13:27:40 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Weiss Subject: Re: Page Mothers & Delinquent Daughters In-Reply-To: <199903120632.WAA14540@lanfill.lanminds.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I missed the opening night panel but was there for the rest of the events. I didn't hear this tone at all. I did, by the way, hear the entire Perloff lecture. Everyone I've spoken to about it seems to have heard a different talk than I did--my guess is that we all, myself included, heard what we were prepared to hear. It will be interesting to see it on the page to find out in what way my memory was faulty. As I heard it Marjorie was trying very hard to narrow her discussion to what she considers the closest thing to an agreed-upon defining theoretical position for language poetry, the divorce between sign and signified, and to what followed therefrom in the theoretical writing of language school poets. The discussion of women's work per se seemed to me to be thrown in for the occasion--it was almost beside the point. At a different conference, I thought, she probably would have cited male critical theory that she considers inadequate. But it was also clear to me that she was enjoying being provocative, and I experienced her talk within the drama of the conference as a sort of satyr play--scurrilous and comic. It was an exciting end to an exciting conference. At 10:32 PM 3/11/99 -0800, you wrote: >Hi all, > >Thanks very much to Kevin Killian and Kathy Lou Schultz for tantalizing news >of the Page Mothers conference last weekend. I hope to hear more from you >other lucky attendants. > >Something Kevin mentioned really interested me and I'd like to hear more on >this subject: the fear of women losing whatever ground we've gained. (Should >I put quotes around "we've"?) > > >A few hours later Rae Armantrout gave a >>welcoming speech that hit most of the notes of congratulation, celebration, >>etc. Though throughout the weekend there was this constant note of warning >>that although women had "made it" in a certain way and their achievements >>over the past 30 years are undeniable, it might all be taken away at any >>moment by a new cultural upheaval. This theme came back in different ways >>many times, but none more clearly as when Armantrout told us the story of >>Hypatia who was an ancient Greek writer and librarian and publisher who >>founded a great library and then it was all destroyed and she herself torn >>to pieces by Christians. > >Would love further discussions of such. > >Cheers to superwomen everywhere, >Elizabeth > >Outlet Magazine -&- Double Lucy Books >P.O. Box 9013, Berkeley, California 94709 U.S.A. >http://users.lanminds.com/~dblelucy > > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 17:26:05 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: LOOKING FOR PEOPLE IN ATLANTA Comments: To: Aesthetics-L , Avant-Garde List , silence MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain in a city this size it seems to us that there must be more poets painters sculptures dancers musicians you-name-its doing interesting (experimental? exploratory?) work the atlanta poetry group [ APG ] composed of Mark Prejsnar Randy Prunty M. Magoolaghan James Sanders Rebecca Hyman and myself wd love to know if anyone out there in the urbs burbs and hinterlands know of folks we might like to make the aquaintence of )L ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 14:48:48 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Doug Rice Organization: Kent State - Salem Campus Subject: International festival of Postmodern Piracy I thought people who participate in this list might be interested in an International Festival that I have organized. NOBODADDIES PRESENTS: An International Festival of Postmodern Piracy to be held at Kent State University-Salem, Salem Ohio April 14-April 16, 1999 Featuring: Jill Nagle, Ray Federman, Charles Bernstein, lance Olsen, Stacey levine, Cris Mazza, Larry McCaffery, Rob Hardin, Brian Mchale, Lily James, Alex Shakar, Ralph Berry, Jeffrey deShell, and many others. The Festival will include performances as well as panels on Critifictional Piracy, Novel Piracy, Discourse Piracy, Musical Piracy, Yasusada, Plagiarism, Fetish Piracy, kathy Acker, and so on. There is NO registration fee; however, to help defray costs, there is a $10.00 fee for meals. Everyone does need to register, so if you are interested in attending, please contact me directly. The Program for the festival will be up on our website at the beginning of next week (March 16). OUr website address is: http://www.salem.kent.edu/conf/nobo/nobodaddies.html Thank you, doug rice rice@salem.kent.edu 330-332-0361 (office0 http://www.salem.kent.edu/conf/nobo/nobodaddies.html ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 21:45:12 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkward Ubutronics Subject: Re: problematic question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lowther,John wrote: > > what's happening that seems New to anybody out there ? new list just starting up down the road, EPOS, about the long poem, extended works, seriality, what is/isn't...in association with the list am compiling a webliography of long poem materials on the net (seems there's not as much as one would imagine, couldnt find anything about the Maximus Poems) welcome input from any & all on this site (you dont even have to join the list)....http://net22.com/neologisms/epos/eposlistframe.html t given the TO line i'm addressing a pretty diverse crowd > > who's seen something > (in any art media) > that struck them as New, Different, etc ??? do poets hate html? small press where you can get it. when was the first time someone claimed the end of the text end of the book? miekal ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 23:53:32 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkward Ubutronics Subject: why poets hate html #2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 07:08:55 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Robert J. Tiess" Subject: Science Fiction Poems Wanted The founder of Poetfest, The New Athenaeum, and NeoLogue announces a brand new site: XYFI Science Fiction Showcase of Stories & Poetry XYfi is a new, free publication on the Internet designed to showcase classic and contemporary science fiction. XYfi seeks original science fiction short stories (up to 10,000 words) and poems (any style/length) for immediate publication online. No queries necessary. All rights remain with the author. Unpublished authors are especially welcome to submit. See guidelines and submission form at site (link below). Submit today. Advancing warning: Absolutely no fan fiction, derivative works, excessive gore or adult material. Also available at XYfi: A special guide (approved by Argus Clearinghouse) to the life and works of H. G. Wells, a web guide to science fiction sites, and more. Link: http://xyfi.spacelynx.com/index.html Please share this information with all your fellow writers. The XYfi Editor xyfi@hotmail.com . | . .. .... . . . . \/ /\ Y f i - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - > . . . . .... .. . | . ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 15:40:13 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: charles alexander Subject: Re: Page Mothers Report, part 2 In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > A few wrote in to ask, well, what Bay >Area writers are included? ah and I thought regionalism was more relegated to . . . well, other regions. charles -- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 18:14:36 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tom Beckett Subject: Re: posted because of tom beckett's "life" (if that was on this list?) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit David, Rather-- lessness ________ I'll TB ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 07:53:36 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maria Damon Subject: Re: problematic question In-Reply-To: <5D5C5C8C3A41D211893900A024D4B97C40E60A@md.facstaff.oglethorpe.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 3:46 PM -0500 3/12/99, Lowther,John wrote: >what's happening that seems New to anybody out there ? > well with all due modesty, and with acknowledgment that miekal is the prime mover here, Literature Nation seems pretty new to me... ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 02:26:10 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "A. Jenn Sondheim" Subject: THE FULL JENNIFER MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII {} THE FULL JENNIFER 1 Jennifer with Dialog so Real you can Taste it Jennifer tossed her head to one side, smiling at Alan. She was wearing a sheer blouse, and her long dark lustrous hair swayed in the breeze. You could almost see a pearl gleaming between her perfect teeth. Her beige skirt was short, her black stockings visible above her boots, and a thin line of creamy flesh just above them, flushed with blood in his direction. Jennifer's fingernails were painted red, and that smile, accompanied by long fingers holding a shot glass, brought him no end of delight. That light purple rouge of hers on her high cheekbones! The blue-black high- lights in her hair! Her full lips were slightly parted in his direction, as she said in that rich southern voice of hers, "Hello, Alan." Her left hand, holding the black patent vinyl level purse with chrome clasp, placed the said object on the transparent glass coffee-table, as if it were the most precious purse in the world. Jennifer so delightfully held her tortoise-shell cigarette holder in his direction, a cigarette inserted and begging for a light as she said, "Do you have a match?" and Alan, trembling, complied. She blew smoke in his direction, while he won- dered how they were going to complete the perl program. "I'll close the window," said Jennifer, and she walked slowly across the thick white shag carpet to the open window twenty stories up. With a deft movement of her right wrist, she wound the window shut and the room began to grow warmer as the motion of the air began to slow except for the slight stirrings of breath in the room. "Now, as you were saying," Jennifer continued, her ravishing onyx brace- lets dangling from her wonderful wrists. She cocked her pretty ears with matching earrings, to each other, and to the bracelet, in his direction, as if she were hanging on his every word. Walking over to the sumptuous couch, Jennifer's smile grew with every instant step. The beautiful glass chandelier had many tiny bulbs, throwing multiple shadows of Jennifer's long neck on the cream-colored plaster ceiling. Her perfect breasts were encased in her blouse with a brassiere so her nipples didn't show while her hips swayed as she sat down next to Alan, waiting to begin. She carefully unraveled the scroll with the perl program that was many sheets long, but rolled up in an interesting way and tied with yellow and blue ribbons, to which she said that she liked craft with her technology. "Oh Alan," said Jennifer, "this is so beautiful, what the program does and all the lines and the way it's written." She smiled and her rich pouting lips opened in his direction. Her nails carefully held the blue and yellow ribbons apart while she moved pages from the more rolled end of the scroll to the lesser end. The beautiful ebony wooden handles looked wonderful in her perfectly formed fingers, her cuticles visible through the beautiful polish upon them, reflecting the myriad lights of the chandelier. The myriad lights looked red as they were reflected from her sumptuous red nail polish perfectly applied to her beautiful nails. She carefully placed the cigarette in the ashtray with the burning end down and touching the colorful ceramic floor representing eagles above trees, of the expensive object, with the holder dangling over the trans- parent glass of the coffee-table, at the other end. She turned slightly, her pouting lips drinking from the expensive crystal shot glass holding her whiskey as she continued to study the program. "Well Alan," she shot back to him, "what do you think of this beautiful program which I like a great deal?" Her soulful eyes like full moons with plaintive cries were opened in his direction, looking as wonderful as the blue-black highlights in her dark black long hair. She was looking so intelligent and curious about this perl program that was in the scroll that was no at least partly unrolled. Jennifer placed her head back on the edge of the sumptuous couch with her lips slightly parted like red and open lips in his direction. "Well, Alan, let us relax," she said as she slithered in her amazing beige skirt across the floor to the bookcase to pull down with her long slender fingers the programming perl book that she had used for the help she had needed before she had rolled up the scroll with the program upon it, that she was show- ing him. She was so clear that she was proud of her programming tricks, her bracelet flashing in the light of myriad chandelier bulbs in his di- rection. Jennifer looked forward to a wonderful evening, and she said, in an amazingly soft and lustrous voice, "Thank you for lighting my cigarette and looking after my drink." Her beautiful legs were visible on the sofa with black stockings and books pointed in his direction. 2 Later that Night, Written Impressively with Attention to Detail Jennifer rose from the couch. Jennifer sat on the couch. Jennifer asked for a light for another cigarette. Jennifer finished the whiskey in the shot glass. Jennifer rose from the couch. Jennifer walked to the bar and poured herself another shot. Jennifer walked back to the couch. Jennifer drank from the shot glass. Jennifer took two vicodin. Jennifer walked to the window. Jennifer smiled and continued to talk to Alan. Jennifer offered comments on the program in the scroll. Jennifer looked out of the window. Jennifer said it was already past two in the morning. Jennifer puffed on her cigarette slow and languorous. Jennifer offered Alan a chocolate. Jennifer walked back to the couch and sat down. Jennifer leaned over the scroll and pointed to a line of code. Jennifer talked about the line of code. Jennifer had another drink from the shot glass. Jennifer nervously held the glass in her left hand. Jennifer continued to smoke from the cigarette in her right hand. Jennifer smiled at Alan with a beautiful smile. Jennifer parted her lips slightly in his direction. Jennifer had another sip from the shot glass. Jennifer took another vicodin. Jennifer rose from the couch. Jennifer walked to the cd player and put on an old cd of the Slits. Jennifer walked to the window and looked out of the window. Jennifer turned around and smiled at Alan. Jennifer danced slowly in front of the window looking at Alan. Jennifer walked over to the bookcase. Jennifer pulled out a book on learning perl on win32 systems. Jennifer leafed through the book. Jennifer spoke to Alan about a command mentioned in the book. Jennifer placed the book back on the bookcase. Jennifer walked over to the window. Jennifer danced again and stretched. Jennifer walked over to the couch and sat down. Jennifer looked at the lines of code in the scroll. Jennifer noticed an error in one of the lines and mentioned it. Jennifer corrected the line of code with a red pencil. Jennifer finished her whiskey in the shot glass. Jennifer rose from the couch and walked over to the bar. Jennifer poured herself another shot of whiskey at the bar. Jennifer walked back to the couch and sat down. Jennifer smiled at Alan with a beautiful smile. Jennifer had a sip from the shot glass. Jennifer put the cigarette out in the ashtray. Jennifer put another cigarette in the cigarette holder. Jennifer asked for a light and puffed thoughtfully on the cigarette. Jennifer looked with her beautiful eyes at Alan. Jennifer rose from the couch. Jennifer sat on the couch. Jennifer leaned over the scroll and traced a line of code. Jennifer circled the second variable with her beautiful hand. Jennifer took another sip from the shot glass. Jennifer rose from the glass and walked to the door. Jennifer walked from the door to the bookcase. Jennifer ran her fingers along the books in the bookcase. Jennifer pulled out a book on perl and returned it to the shelf. Jennifer walked to the window and looked out. Jennifer opened the window and took a deep breath. Jennifer blew cigarette smoke out of the open window. Jennifer inhaled beautifully the smoke from her cigarette. Jennifer looked at Alan with an eager and shiny look. Jennifer walked from the window to the bar. Jennifer finished her whiskey and poured herself another shot. Jennifer sang a shot and returned to the window. Jennifer smiled at Alan with a most beautiful smile. Jennifer walked over to the couch and sat down. Jennifer asked Alan if it was too cold in the room. Jennifer looked at the lines of code with Alan. Jennifer finished her cigarette and took another vicodin. Jennifer walked over to the window and sat down on the white shag rug. Jennifer slightly parted her legs in her beautiful beige skirt. Jennifer smiled at Alan and rose and walked to the bookcase. Jennifer looked at the beginning perl book and took it from the shelf. Jennifer read about regular expressions and the usages of sed. Jennifer described the syntax of sed to Alan. Jennifer placed the book back on the shelf and walked to the window. Jennifer danced in front of the window. Jennifer walked to the cd player and put on American Woman. Jennifer walked to the window and danced to American Woman. Jennifer said this was American Woman the long live version. Jennifer walked to the bookcase and then to the bar and couch. Jennifer sat down on the couch and leaned over the scroll. Jennifer asked Alan to light another cigarette. Jennifer placed the cigarette in her mouth without the holder. Jennifer puffed brilliantly on her cigarette. Jennifer commented on the length of the program. Jennifer wondered about its implementation in windows nt. Jennifer rose from the couch and walked to the bar. Jennifer undid the top two buttons of her sheer white blouse. Jennifer turned and smiled at Alan her most beautiful smile. Jennifer walked to the window and danced to American Woman. Jennifer walked to the bookcase and read about linux 5.1. Jennifer read the linux journal about the latest kernel implementation. Jennifer mentioned the implementation to Alan and walked to the couch. Jennifer sat down and leaned over the scroll. Jennifer outlined a subroutine in the scroll with her left hand. Jennifer demonstrated how variables are passed. Jennifer opened her lips ever so slightly in Alan's direction. Jennifer finished her shot and rose from the couch. Jennifer walked over to the bar and poured herself a shot. Jennifer walked over to the cd player. Jennifer put American Woman the long version on a loop. Jennifer smiled at Alan her very most beautiful smile. Jennifer walked to the couch and sat down. Jennifer rose from the couch and walked to the bookcase. Jennifer pulled learning perl on win32 systems from the bookcase. Jennifer took the learning perl book over to the couch. Jennifer sat down on the couch and opened the learning perl book. Jennifer pointed to a passage in the learning perl book. Jennifer placed the book to the right of the scroll. Jennifer traced the standard input lines of the scroll. Jennifer said they were elegant and worked well. Jennifer looked at the comments accompanying the lines. Jennifer rose from the couch and walked to the door. Jennifer walked from the door to the bookcase. Jennifer walked from the bookcase to the bar and took another vicodin. Jennifer walked to the couch and sat down and smiled at Alan. Jennifer uncrossed her legs and leaned over the scroll. Jennifer stood and walked over to the cd player. Jennifer walked over to the bookcase. Jennifer offered Alan another chocolate. Jennifer walked to the couch and sat down. Jennifer finished her cigarette and shot. Jennifer walked over to the bar and smiled beautifully at Alan. Jennifer walked to the couch and sat down. Jennifer leaned over the scroll. 3 Sparkling Real-Life Description Jennifer feels that Alan doesn't understand programming as much as she'd like him to. She listens to him explain the nature of subroutines and modules, worrying that she probably knows more about the issue herself. She wonders if he can see how drugged she is, working through these dif- ficult problems. Jennifer is depressed watching Alan clumsily trying one kludge or another to fix the program. She listens to him asking her to lay off the whiskey as she heads back to the bar. She bends her ear towards him, trying to make sense of his ignorance when it comes to anything computer. She's up- set at his fudging his explanations over and over again. Jennifer senses that Alan likes her when he talks about how beautiful she looks, but she senses that he disapproves of her habits. She watches him pace the floor himself now, as he tries one or another thing with the pro- gram. She's nervous watching him head to the cd player, taking off Ameri- can Woman the long version, and putting on some music he recorded himself. Jennifer cries inside, sensing his pain at his lack of musical success, now transformed into poor programming as well. She watches him take up the scroll, attempt to figure out the complex listings, then returning it to the table with the transparent glass top. She unbuttons a third button of her blouse, hoping Alan will notice when he looks up and again mentions her drinking. Jennifer senses keen disappointment as half-naked and drugged she moves closer to Alan, listening to him say that she should really really take it easy with all that whiskey. She feels intense rapture as fingers press against her naked breasts, and she is lifted bodily into the air. She senses the world turning upside-down as she is placed upon the sumptuous couch. Jennifer feels warmth all over as she snuggles under a lovely cream-white fuzzy blanket. She falls asleep with the sounds of her favorite music, American Woman the long version, playing in the background. She dreams that Alan is a brilliant programmer and a very successful musician. She dreams that he is madly in love with her. She pauses in her sleep. She begins to wake. She begs for his cock. She feels his cock deep within her, plunging her into worlds without ends, without words or dreams. 4 powerhouse description sets you right in the action o drugged jennifer so beautiful in your beige skirt and white blouse o drugged bedraggled jennifer wonderful in your black stockings o drawn and desolate jennifer in your sumptuous black boots o jennifer swallowing the air that was alan o jennifer finishing the perfect perl program o jennifer winding the ribboned scroll, entering lines of code o jennifer going to file then run then run "o beautiful drugged jennifer, i want to be your vicodin! i want to be your whiskey, i want to be your cigarette!" with fury she swung at the quivering face barely visible. out of the corner of her eye, the scroll rose in the air, white letters flamed against black sky. the scroll swung into an empty space where alan was, crashing towards the white shag floor. her teeth fastened on the space where his penis had vacated the warmth of jennifer's body. her arms tethered the knife slicing away at alan's wasted breasts. deep within her, a crash was heard and the white floor suffered an indentation. the letters howled from the scroll as the learning perl book flew from the shelf, crashing red and bloody on the floor. american woman the long live version played to the short dead thing embedded in the white shag rug, already past three a.m. jennifer walked out of jennifer. jennifer walked out of there, where jennifer walked out. "o beautiful drugged jennifer, i want to be your vicodin! i want to be your whiskey, i want to be your cigarette!" +++ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 02:23:40 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Gerald O'Connell Subject: Re: problematic question Comments: To: avant-garde@lists.village.virginia.edu Comments: cc: Aesthetics-L , silence , glasspockets@listbot.com In-Reply-To: <5D5C5C8C3A41D211893900A024D4B97C40E60A@md.facstaff.oglethorpe.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 In message <5D5C5C8C3A41D211893900A024D4B97C40E60A@md.facstaff.oglethorp e.edu>, "Lowther,John" writes >what's happening that seems New to anybody out there ? >& of course i see the absurdity of the question at multiple levels >but given the TO line i'm addressing a pretty diverse crowd >who's seen something > (in any art media) > that struck them as New, Different, etc ??? >& then, if you cd... >tell us about it >thanx >)L > --- from list avant-garde@lists.village.virginia.edu --- At any given point, maybe about 1% of 1% of what is being produced is good enough to stand the test of time, and to be acknowledged subsequently as representing a genuine development of what had gone before. Both history and statistical probability are stacked against you in any quest to satisfy both a craving for novelty and a search for significance amongst the contemporary output. Gerald O'Connell http://www.gacoc.demon.co.uk/ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 12:39:37 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: J Kuszai Subject: of Mothers & Daughters MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Because I am here at ground-zero, exactly seven days after the Page Mothers Conference wound down with one of the best group readings I have ever been party to witness, and it seems--once again--that the discourse surrounding this conference will forever be held to whispers and will not become part of the historical record, save for a useful notation of its proceedings by one Kevin Killian, and because some of my thinking was aided and advanced by the proceedings and the conversations surrounding them, I feel that it is time for me to emerge from my recuperative lurking to address the conference and a few other things that have been stewing inside me since we last snuggled up against the cold winds of December's scandal. I was tempted to hold my tongue on this, for it isn't really my place to comment--as a white male, etc.etc.--("whale" for short). On the other hand, I can't sit by in good conscience and watch this space devolve once again to a daily dose of chit-chat, which serve only to amuse the few people who bother to participate. The relative silence in this space--at the hands of those who otherwise know good and well that they should speak up--breaks what little of a heart I have left. Even the quiz presented in this forum by my new friend and true Page Daughter patriot, Kathy Lou Schultz, seemed only to add to the air of mystery and the strange shroud of silence surrounding the events. So, all this is to say, watch out, for what follows here is a multiply-long post, only some of which is addressed to the conference, which as I said helped me begin to solve problems which I see in the current landscape of language arts and the "community" which its relatively small-scale industry evokes and encourages. Welcome Back - NOTICE to LURKERS One of the last things I was working on for posting to Poetics before I bailed unto lurkdom was an essay on my "progress" as an editor. A kind of autobiography in editorial discretion. And it was partly in response to the prodding of Dale Smith and others who challenged my notion that some of the best writing being done today is being done by women, especially women who live in the San Francisco Bay Area. I had no real theories at that time about why this was. Indeed, I don't think that gender is any kind of a determining factor. I never said that I thought that women wrote better than men, but that the poetry that I liked was more often to be written by women--and often it is the case that I only found out afterwards, as it is often my practice to read books and magazines from back to front. There is, as we all know, lots of poetry by women which is terrible--as terrible as anything being written by men. One of the reasons that I think that this is so difficult for some people to take is that men are so much more present. It has been pointed out many times that men are more likely to send out their work to be reviewed by editors such as myself. When I posted to this space a call-for-work addressed to WOMEN ONLY, the majority of inquries I received were still by men, something which confused me a great deal. Do most men feel themselves to be exempt from the criticism of their sisters?? Even my gesture there, as a male editor, seemed odd and the irony of all that wasn't lost on me. The reasons that women don't contribute to this space, or don't submit their work to new magazines and presses may be found in the attitude of the men who inhabit these spaces. Look at the bizarrely phobic attitudes exhibited by some men on this list at the very suggestion that I have raised here. They can be characterized often by a spirit of ill-will, as if being the cultural dominant were somehow a tradition, not unlike the racist attitudes expressed by the right wing establishment in California. It saddens me that a number of women who were at the conference haven't, in fact, felt the need to transform this space into one in which their interests were the status quo, for no "public" forum is as ripe as a takeover, even a temporary intervention, as this one is. And while several women at the conference indicated to me that they felt that the list wasn't a place where they felt comfortable, I can only hope that this is no longer the case, that under Chris Alexander's leadership, that this space will CONTINUE to transform into something that we can all live with, or even dare I say it, feel excited to participate in. And frankly, being that this space in no way represnts any kind of democratic vista, an ideological take-over, some kind of feminist intervention would be a welcome rebuke to the potentially unfortunate return to "business as usual" that has marked the list in recent weeks. I have learned, however, there are reasons that women may find themselves disinterested, finally, in our modest project. And while I received lots of back-channel congratulations regarding my efforts to "take a stand" back in November and December, something that someone said to me off-list has stuck with me. This person, who found herself also particularly embattled at a certain moment, asked the question-- at such a time of struggle in a public forum--"where are one's friends?" -- and many of my supposedly closest friends, some of whom are former and forthcoming "meow press authors" abandoned ship like so many Titanic 1st class-passengers, leaving us "poetry workers" to attempt to save the vessel by bailing water from the sinking ship. I am not complaining or crying out at this point, having achieved enough of a distance from the spectacle's last days to have made a number of realizations about the nature of this "community" and the group of which it is a fractionate representative. I will save those speculations for another time, as I am sure that this debate will rise again. Perhaps it is a lesson that all of you have already learned. Chris Alexander does derserve praise, though, for undertaking this thankless task, and (I might add) also some help. And by that I mean that as the list returns to a status-quo (minus the bilous discharge of people who have no interest in this communitarian project) where he really needs your help is in the development of this space into an articulate energy built up over pre-considered postings--more a "magazine" than a "chat-room." I've said this before, and I know I'm not the only one with interests in this direction. The useful thing about the new format is that the moderator can have influence over the direction of the list. That itself becomes usefully ideological. There is no need to have every one-liner forwarded to the list. Likewise there is no need to put undo peer-pressure on Chris to forward such obviously back-channel chitchat to the list. I can imagine that he feels it would cause undo strain on his very diplomatic personality to try to appease every last hastily-strewn commentary. We've gone that route. It's time for a new attitude. This is not anything other than a call for all LURKERS to rise up and take a stand. Page Brothers in Drag: Wannabe Women or Can I borrow your identity to advance my career? The conference here last weekend was too multiple to address in any complete manner. I hope that other views on this will be presented, here as well as elsewhere, as the more dialog about "what happened" I hope will go a long way towards developing an adequate picture of the events. Before I go into my very subjective perceptions of one aspect of the conference, let me try to address some of the larger pictures that come through for me. It was great to see such a grouping of power brokers (mothers) and their attendant daughters, with a few of us boys scattered in for effect. The conference itself was caught in the poetry festival and academic conference dilemma, and like many of these mixed-project conferences, this was a useful bringing together. Perhaps it is a legacy of the theoretically-minded "language" school, which could be said to be one of the major literary preoccupations of many of the women at the conference (mother and daughters), that so many of the attendees (both presenters and audience members) would be so astute to the issues involved. So while it was academic on the one hand, many of the people present were not "academics" per se, something which made the conference so much more interesting than the typical academic conference, which usually has the air of a good natured sporting event, with everyone shaking hands and going home afterward. The fact that Marjorie Perloff's comments so angered Carla Harryman and others is testament to the fact that with this group the line between what constitutes theory and poetry has been nearly erased in some corners of the poetry world, and indeed, in some corners of the academic mainstream. And this is an issue that is worth developing further, but I will save it for another time. What did anger Carla, I think, brings me closer to my "thesis" about the conference, or what it meant for me. The notion that the women language poets were somehow practioners of a theoretical orientation defined and packaged by the men of that generation (Silliman, Watten, Bernstein, etc.) is perhaps not the main issue as far as I can see it. Marjorie did try to stake out too much in her brief talk, which was excerpted from a longer talk to be presented at the Barnard Conference next month. And perhaps there rests some of the problem. I don't think she got to make all of the connections she put underway, and while her argument may have depended upon the suppositions raised by the recounting of the early days of "language" history (told as male dominated in terms of theory production goes), her argument and presentation suffered because she was unable to tie it all up at the end (at least how I imagined how it might end). While she did admonish those present to more rigorously define what is meant by "innovative" and not use that word to define what I perceive to be largely social groupings of newer (emergent) poets, that proposal was made in the face of an angry group in the audience, led by Carla Harryman, who took issue with her historical portrayal of the women as not being theorists and the males being out front, etc. Unfortunately, Perloff's call for a more rigorous theorizing of the issues by women, especially younger women, was made before Jen Hofer and Summi Kaipa gave a brilliant reading / study / performace during the reading on Sunday, when Perloff was absent. Perhaps there is some deeper history to what could be seen as "academic vs. poet" arguing, as I saw an enraged member of the Harryman clan go chin-to-chin with Perloff a few years ago in the cash bar at the Orono Conference on the 1950s. As one astute ringside watcher remarked then, "at least Perloff shows up for the fight." And despite the contentious response her remarks elicited, there is perhaps another way of looking at all this which brings me closer, yet still (hang on, please), to the core of my argument. It was inappropriate for Perloff to spend so long on a particularly male history at a conference devoted to the Page Mothers and especially since she was on the "future" panel, the conversation supposedly arranged to elicit views on where "we" might go next-- and the next wave, exemplified by Renee Gladman's and Pamela Liu's presentations, the highlight of the conference for me. It was inappropriate, in my feeling, though I don't think it needed to be. Regardless whether you think Perloff's history was right or wrong (and I think we could debate this, though I would like to see a copy of the *whole* paper, since as I have said, I felt it was the subject matter alone which was inappropriate). Perloff's admonition to do theorizing more rigorously, to propose a project beyond the gratuitous fluff and name-dropping reviews so common in today's poetical discourse (a trend not limited by gender) was something I very much applaud. Someone here on this list asked recently what might be considered "new" and I think if one could take on that question, they might be setting themselves up for more criticism, as even the search for a "new thing" based on some kind of formal principle might be seen as another masculinist gesture, an attempt to prescriptively orientate our literary bearings based upon modes and criteria developed through Poundian economies, the very economies our Page Mothers and Fathers had sought to undo. It seems to me that to develop a sense of what consitutes "new" now would have to take under consideration such things as "place," "identity" and some of the other taboo issues that we are always so quick to dispense with when formulating our geneologies. And by "we" here, I am in part referring to my white brothers, who have demonized such practices as developing countercultural strategies as even those employed by Bernstein, Watten, Sherry, Silliman, and others, who sought to arrange a sub-cultural network for distribution, discussion, and more, around new poets and their publishing activities. Tangent-- History as Trangression When I first gave birth to my desire to publish a series, Charles B., warned me to start small and develop a readership, which he might have called a community, or a constituency. I had originally cooked up a wild plan with Arkadii D., to publish books for cheap, printing them in St. Petersburg on Finnish paper. We could get books for 10 cents in paper back and 50 cents in hardcover. The only problem was they had to be printed in editions of 5,000 or 10,000. Anyone can see the problem here. And while I toyed with the idea of bilingual editions of Russian and American poets, the idea of sending 8,500 copies to Moscow to be sold at cigarette stands wasn't exactly what I had in mind. The development of this community of readers has been my strategy from the beginning. Focussing on publishing works by lesser-known poets, and piggybacking them on those works by the likes of Scalapino, Bernstein, and Silliman, just to name a few, was one means of accomplishing this goal. And I hope that as my publishing venture reaches this point, this crossroads, that it has been at least modestly successful in getting works out there. But now I find myself in a troubling position. Never in my wildest dreams did I want to be in the position of judge and jury. The influx of manuscripts that trickle in now are all very much worthy of being published, whether by my press or another of similar outlook. But what is that outlook? One writer, in a review of Meow Press for the Poetry Project Newsletter, likened the press to some kind of establishment-oriented apologist for the State of New York, a co-conspirator in what she termed "crimes" : SUNY-Buffalo and the Poery/Rare Books Collection at that same school. Anyone who knows me knows how much this slam hurt me personally, as much forged upon misunderstanding and misreading as upon a failure to communicate. While I was never mentioned in the review, it was very much a personal slam, one which proposed to position MP as an establishment-oriented venture, as a student of Bernstein, etc. But this connection, the institutional affiliation is a problem, I realize, as it is something that I find to be problematic, and has been my critique of the poetics program in general, or any poetics program, such as that at New College of California, San Francisco State, and others. For me the role that institutions play in this development of literary groups and histories in general is a disturbing but real presence. These schools go a long way to reproduce the very formal preoccupations which brought them together, indeed exceptions at Iowa and Buffalo are still rare. But, rather than some ideological cloning, I think that it is within the institutional structures the very social fabric which permits editorial behavior is patterned. This pattern is then continued "outside" where the institutional preoccupations are transformed into more social-only networks. If you look at the globs of graduates from x-school, I think you will find this to be the case. And athough I don't think that such a fact has to be always bad, I will again restate my general theory of editing scenes, zines, and presses: such editing is generally all "social" and that the ideological fallacy most usually presented has some sort of connection to what Perloff so rightly decried as "innovative." For instance, to most people the difference between n-th generation New York School and n-th generation language poetry would be negligible. Indeed, a friend of mine, an MFA at San Diego State U., recently called Quincy Troupe a "language poet" -- something which made me swallow the very salt I had thought to pinch for the grain's taking. So within these various networks of the "innovative" - a term so vapid as to be utterly meaningless - there are infact social groupings which have meaning and importance to those who inhabit them. And while the Page Fathers are looking for younger poets to pick up the stick to formulate some sense of the newness which was their poetics heritage (nudge nudge Ron, nudge nudge Bruce), the Page Mothers (especially in San Francisco) have perhaps been responsible for a whole generation of younger women writers who have emerged with similar interests and concerns, social and theoretical, some of which were articulated at the conference. Lesbian Disco, or why I can't dance Listening to and watching Pamela Liu and Renee Gladman address the conference, it occurred to me that while they may have appeared on the "futures" panel almost as an after thought, an accusation I haven't seen supported, they were the greatest and truest representation of the future. Indeed, a bomb went off in my head, one which told me that I was irrelevant, outdated, uninteresting. I felt swept aside by the convincing nature of their presentations, their motivated commitment to what they are doing and their peers. And one of the great problems with this conference was that not everyone could make it. A very west coast phemenon, the pre-eminence of Bay Area women (younger and older) should have been of interest to everyone--on this list and otherwise. The silence from Buffalo on this front has been very telling for me, the silence and seeming disinterest coming from New York. Not everyone could be paid and invited, but it seems to me that this conference was either something you are interested in or not--and that some of the disinterest was based on not being invited. One criticism I do have of some of the would-be attendees, is this almost universal sense of the need to be recognized, and the bitter whining that went on at least here on the west coast, regarding who would be or wouldn't be invited is perhaps a bigger epidemic than I can address here. But Pamela's and Renee's presence on the panel stood in for much wider happening, one they addressed in their talks with great generosity. When Dodie and Kevin came to Buffalo in the Fall of 1997, they spoke of this range of younger writers, almost none of whom I had heard of. It was as if this incredible world had opened; so many things to learn about-- so much to read and discover. My world had been dominated by the New York scene, past and present, and by the historical Bay Area, from Jack London to the departure of Ben Friedlander, who was my primary source of Bay Area history and intrigue. And despite the fact that it is a literary community now run by "middle aged women" as someone put it at the end of the conference, the history of the Bay Area, with a few exceptions had been a primarily male history. So you can imagine how exciting it was to hear of this community in development. What I learned from Pamela and Renee may not be so easily put into words, and hopefully I will continue to learn from them as their works reach a wider audience though the underground small press economy of which I have been a part. When I voiced my sense of being irrelevant to a friend after the conference, the response was sheer dismissal-- i.e. that my press was an important press of new work, within this subeconomy, etc. and that I shouldn't feel that way. But being relevant here isn't about being in a position of power, though my "power" is completely relative, and the use most people seem to have for me seems completely instrumental anyhow. I sensed that magazines such as Clamor, Outlet, Proliferation, and many others (including the glossy Lipstick 11) were involved in this community building effort-- often through the use of materials gained by theft, recycle-bin diving, and creative misuse... an economy of production very close to my heart. The development of these editorial and publishing collectives, scene-building in the area of San Francisco, Berkeley, and Oakland-- this is the creation of the kind of literary community that will develop its own methods of extending their poetical discourses into the world at large. By that I mean that these women (and some men, as it doesn't seem to be exclusively one thing or another) will establish their own networks for the the development of the kind of poetics theorizing that both Silliman, Perloff and others (even myself) have called for at times. That theorizing is going on, but it will be excellent to watch them undertake this project as they begin to aquire power and authority (a dangerous trade-off, as I have discovered), as they age, as another group of upstarts seeks to establish themelves in the wake of this intensely interesting group of women writers. All of it is so new to me. During the conference I was suddenly blinded by the shock of their brilliant glow and I wished that more people of this community had made it down, as the Conference was one of those landmark historical events which will only grow in significance as the histories of it get written and rewritten. Just as for me the New Coast Conference in 1993 was a formative experience, one which inspired me to do what I do now, I hope that they will have a similar sense of the Page Mothers. But it isn't for me to write that significance, and perhaps they will have cause to have a conference of their own, wherein such poetical exchanges can include more of their contemporaries. As we reach the end of the decade (I am less interested in the millenial urge as I am 10-year clocks) such a re-thinking of how we do all this might be in order. For me, I feel myself in a great crisis, one which my brothers might not share. I felt a giant kick in the pants by the Page Mothers Conference. And not to be a reactionary, not to ask how might we white boys might best express our identity, or shore-up our hegemony, but instead, how might we rethink our very sense of place in a world which seems hell-bent at eradicating any real sense of difference as it attempts to co-opt the very communities it seeks to include. Not polarizing smallness, but how to proceed? For me, I am much more interested in education (and not pedagogy) than I am aesthetic issues these days, and that may be only the beginning of my dilemma. I live 15 minutes from Mexico and I know little about the poets there. The road to Tecate is lined with police-- border guards. And on this note, my page brothers here in San Diego will be the recipients of this questioning--and my brother Bill Marsh and I had a wonderfully exciting getting-nowhere-fast conversation about these issues-- and I know even my quick sunday morning portrayal of this question is complex, incomplete, and only beginning. But we (four boys from s.d.) are starting a magazine. Hopefully, some of you will see and feel the results of our talks about this. Thanks for your time- joel k of the valley Spring Valley, that is- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 09:26:29 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maria Damon Subject: Re: problematic question In-Reply-To: <2G9oDOAswc62Ew33@gacoc.demon.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > >At any given point, maybe about 1% of 1% of what is being produced is >good enough to stand the test of time, and to be acknowledged >subsequently as representing a genuine development of what had gone >before. Both history and statistical probability are stacked against you >in any quest to satisfy both a craving for novelty and a search for >significance amongst the contemporary output. > > >Gerald O'Connell > with all due respect for the care that poets put into their work, it is this sort of judgment that my whole professional life is devoted to dismantling --cliches like "good enough to stnad the test of time" as if that is or should be the prime consideration. it seems to treat poetry like a commodity (does it come with a lifetime guarantee, or only a one-year warranty? will i have to buy a new one in 5 years, or will this last?) ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 09:56:58 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkward Ubutronics Subject: Re: International festival of Postmodern Piracy MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit no festival of pirates would be complete without a gander at the otherground cult classic, THE PLAGIARIST CODEX http://net22.com/qazingulaza/codex/codex.html & while yr waiting for that to load check out these titles from PLAGERIZED®(sic) BOOKS, distributed by Xexoxial Endarchy from yr local distributor of appropriated texts: Destruction of Gardens by Alexei Kruchenykh published by the Institute for the Study of Zaumnaya, Tiflis, Russia, 1915. The Plagiarist Codex: an old Maya information hieroglyph, 1988. Innuendo by Lewis Carroll published by the Century Company, 1919. Classical Plagiartism by Prof. Elizabeth Was published by Oxford University Press, London, 1970. Qwa Dogs of the Rock Dwelling by Robert Smithson 20"x26" photostatic print ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 08:46:29 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: dbkk@SIRIUS.COM Subject: Page Mothers Report, part 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi, it's Kevin Killian. This morning I will try to finish my report on last weekend's Page Mothers conference (March 5, 6, 7) at UCSD & I apologize for going on and on at such length (bandwidth) about it. The question of the tone that Mark Weiss didn't hear at the conference--the anxiety that women writers might lose the ground they've recently gained--well, it's funny, because I felt it throughout, from Hejinian's exhortations that every day one must wrest victory from defeat and fight all over again, to the constant use of the word "erasure," which one heard again and again (e.g Harryman accusing Perloff of having erased the work of every woman in the room) and then in Dodie's speech to the conference of course, she evoked the spectre of Marc Lepine, the Canadian engineer who in early December 1989 walked into the University of Montreal and killed 14 women, and wounded a dozen others, simply because feminism had ruined his life. (Dodie spoke in the context of backlash in general, particularly a weird phone message she got at her office accusing her of feminism for having invited nine women to read at Small Press Traffic during this month and next.) (Check it out.) But I do appreciate that all of us who were at the conference came away with different takes on it and I hope that my example will show that hey, write something about it, it doesn't have to be complete, nor even interesting per se. So, there we were in this luxurious faculty club listening to Maureen Owen read, I had never heard her before, nor even realized that her many of her poems have alternate titles, nor the funky surrealism of her poetry, sometimes charming, sometimes a little Brautigan-esque. The showpiece was a longer and more intense poem about another true crime, a Muslim NY woman who, not wanting her children to grow up in a racist world, pushed them out of the window of their 12th story apartment building, this chilling poem very much in the Sapphire vein that looked deep into a disturbed mind and located the listener there, identification and analysis hand in hand. When Bernadette Mayer began reading the crowd really sat up and cheered. She too read of a crime, the poem she wrote for Scott Gibson's forthcoming "Blood and Tears" anthology of poems for Matthew Shepard, the young gay student who was beaten to death in Laramie late last year, his body left tied to an old fence so that passersby thought he was a scarecrow. Perhaps for many of us this was our first exposure to Mayer, so she embodied something of the "revered figure" that Leslie Scalapino had warned us about earlier, the living legend. Her "livingness" also, miraculous as it seems after her near-fatal stroke a few years back, and her remarkable recovery, has to it a Gothic edge, like the Ancient Mariner (though she's not exactly old of course), perhaps we are simultaneously drawn to and repelled by someone who has "died" already and come back, or is this just me, and in any case is it wrong to say? She gave a great reading and could make money, I think, just by selling tapes of her little laugh. After the reading many went on to a lesbian dance bar, "Flame," in San Diego proper, but I was kind of beat and made Dodie take me back to the hotel bar where we sat listening to a piano man sing the old time melodies of the 50s and 60s and talked with Fanny Howe, Owen, and Mayer, over a whole slew of Cosmopolitans far into the wee hours of the morning, talking about everything that had happened at the conference, and many many other topics including our old late friend Bob Flanagan. Fanny announced she had a crush on Piero Heliczer after reading his poems in the new issue of "Shiny" magazine, and Owen and Mayer reminsced about the real-life Heliczer and how she, Howe, was lucky not to have run into him in real life in late 60s NY because he was a menace and completely mad. Dodie had me give the pianist money to play her theme song, "My Funny Valentine" (her birthday is Valentine's Day) and Bernadette got me to ask him to play (but I forgot to ask for what reason) "Under the Boardwalk" and he did. The next morning we spent packing and then squeezed into the little convertible of Standard Schaeffer with Lauren Gudath and Pam Lu, and all our luggage and then on to breakfast on the same block as the Faultline Theater, where Stephen Cope and Joe Ross were setting up for this massive poetry reading featuring many of the participants in the conference. Well, we've all been to this kind of thing before, but this was an especially interesting reading and much more lively and fun that it had any right to be, for the program was a long one and the space isn't all that big and plenty of people came to hear and see and unwind, and people could only read for 5 to 7 minutes otherwise they would be put in jail (a prop for the current Faultline production, there was an actual jail cell on stage, with Lee Ann Brown sitting in it.) For one reason or another, Cope had figured out the order of the program should be in reverse alphabetical order, a delightful decision that always had one guessing who would read next. It must have been great for those, like Scalapino and Mary Margaret Sloan, who usually bring up the rear at these mass events, and I think we should try it in San Francisco. Thus the reading began with Bobbie West, a local San Diego writer whom I had never met and whose book "Scattered Damage" from Meow Books is terrific. Bobbie, if you're on this list, please e-mail me your address so I can send you the money for the book you signed for me. The next reader was Diane Ward, whom we had missed seeing at the conference but who proved available to come to this Sunday reading. It was great news to hear that Littoral Books is going to bring out a book by Ward and I told her, I would have walked to San Diego to hear her read for five minutes, she is the best. Or perhaps the best was Juliana Spahr, who read her wonderful poem "We," really I think (I'm thinking now) her masterpiece, this expansive, inclusive, hyper-realistic yet surreal poem about constituency, foreignness, and enduring love. This reading had a valedictory quality to it, as many readers had o up and leave as soon as they had finished reading, for their shuttles were there to take them to the airport, so I didn't get a chance to say goodbye to many, you're there one moment and then you're gone, just like "life"! Anyhow I see I'm running out of time and I didn't even write down a list of all the readers, all of whom did very very well, so I will try to condense myself. Dodie and I were extremely pleased and proud of the good showings put on by the young San Francisco writers, including Giovanni Singleton, Kathy Lou Schultz, Renee Gladman, Pamela Lu and Taylor Brady; Bill Luoma brought down the house as usual; Lyn Hejinian read from "Happily"; a duo of Jen Hofer and Summi Kaipa brought off a performance piece based on Hejinian and Harryman's collaboration "The Wide Road" (which I wouldn't have thought could be done, but they did it); a young New York poet called Alastair (sp?) Julian (sp?) of whom I had not heard was very touching; and then it all seemed to wind up to a close with Dodie's reading from the "Letters of Mina Harker" and Rae Armantrout wound up last, powerful, triumphant, grinning and standing there, as wave after wave of applause washed over her in thanks for her part in organizing the conference. With Joel Kuszai, Joe Ross, John Granger, Stephen Cope, Rick Burkhardt, Bill Mohr, Hung Q. Tu, etc., all living in San Diego and of course the more established figures Michael Davidson, Quincy Troupe, Jerome Rothenberg, David Antin, one did get the feeling there's a lot of writing going on in San Diego but that it was largely a man's world, and so this female incursion into its dominion had the effect of a dream. Like many others, I'm very grateful to Howe and Armantrout for putting on the event, and to Kuszai, Granger, Ross and Cope for being so hospitable to us at every turn. Yes, there was X amount of friction, yes the debates about inclusivity, elitism, racism and revisionism hatched at the "Page Mothers" conference will color our world for a long time to come, and yes I had a terrific time and I hope they do it again. Kevin Killian <---- page boy PS, to all those who have written me back channel about the special "Page Mothers" issue of "Mirage #4/Period[ical]" (our 84th issue) we will be mailing them out to you in the week to come. We still have some copies left. This is the issue with one page of work each by Dodie Bellamy, Mary Burger, Cydney Chadwick, Norma Cole, Beverly Dahlen, Patricia Dienstfrey, Kathleen Fraser, Susan Gevirtz, Lauren Gudath, Lyn Hejinian, Brenda Hillman, Myung Mi Kim, Pamela Lu, Laura Moriarty, Yedda Morrison, Rena Rosenwasser, Jocelyn Saidenberg, Leslie Scalapino, Kathy Lou Schultz, Mary Margaret Sloan, and Elizabeth Treadwell. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 12:33:49 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: R M Daley Subject: Re: Page Mothers & Delinquent Daughters In-Reply-To: <199903120632.WAA14540@lanfill.lanminds.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII hello elizabeth treadwell, with whom i would very much agree at least in a need to have a little more careful approach to placing expectations/obligations/ole fashioned desires on the shoulders of a 'younger generation' - we've heard this charge before, no?, from some of the gatekeepers of 'language poetry' - that this lazy bunch of upstarts aren't doing a damn thing to further the cause etc etc there are so many obviously troubling issues with the form of this kind of assigment - most notably, it seems to me, is that the work that this 'older generation' did is not only not my work, but was in large part intended to allow me to avoid doing 'their work'- eg, my mom made it possible for me to have a lot more options than to have to work all my life to have space/time (as a woman or as anything else) to work - a second very very needful point on which leslie scalapino spoke , according to kevin killian's report, at the pagemother's conference, is the danger/stupidity of the tendency of poets to parent-worship - scalapino probably did not use the word 'stupidity', but as one of the 'younger' who is so charged (by the 'older who have served their time) with responsibilities to the world, tradition, the plight of women etc, i do take much issue with the nonchalance with which poet-writers assume heroes, find it necessary to have pet influences and mythical notions of some person behind the poem- and, if killian's sum was right-on, i would agree with scalapino, that the cult of the revered figure is rather in service of obliterating interaction with the writing and if scalapino, in her argument against immersing oneself in some kind of lineage, 'makes some abrupt jumps', all the more reason for actually looking at the writing that she is talking about, no? - is it not about time that chronology (and the presumed debt to preserve it) cashed in its chips? - as one of the no-good 'younger' people, i feel quite fortunate that i can be in cahoots with books like on certainty, geographical history of america, the new sentence, querlle, all this every day, remebrance of things past, subterraneans, book of urizen without having to always, as a sonny rollins-loving friend of mine once said, worry the bridge rachel daley ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 13:48:32 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: david bromige Subject: re charles alexander's bon mot re page mothers report part 2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Just to piggyback on Charles' tweak re regionalism,,,,and to prove "the more the meme chose"....some 20 years ago, I went on the road to a number of places back east, and in the course of reporting on my findings to one of my hosts, I said "I think we live in a time of multiple provincialisms." To which he replied, "Oh, I dont think you'll find much of that here in New York." David ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 10:40:12 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tom Beckett Subject: Long Poems are the Other, aren't they? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit My wife, a School Psychologist, sees me as a classic example of a person afflicted with Attention Deficit Disorder, among other things. Maybe that's what's behind my nervously impatient--on and off again short poem--approach to poetry writing. Or maybe it is because my poetry is preoccupied with separating out the root erotics of the (w)rote from the perspective of the routed: a kind of micropolitical sexual-textual economy of meaning and moaning, mooning and, sometimes, mooing... I'm fascinated by long poems because they represent something I can't seem to do,sensibilities I can visit but not inhabit. If I write 10 pages, my characteristic impulse is to reduce them to 10 lines. I tend to condense rather than expand. I'm more likely to remove words than add them. When one does a long poem is intensity of experience sacrificed to depth or duration? I differentiate, by the way, "serial poems" from the long poem. Serial works seem to kind of swing a little both ways...I like _them_, a lot. Tom Beckett ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 13:59:04 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: david bromige Subject: re the full jennifer Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" another amazing sondheim. I am going out to buy the cd of american woman. But really I shd save my money to pay a nerd to come here & teach me more about my computer programs. I have some vicodan left over from the 80s. david ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 21:47:04 +0000 Reply-To: toddbaron@earthlink.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Todd Baron /*/ ReMap Readers Organization: Re*Map Subject: LOVE and ReMap MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit REMAP is moving its west coast office. ReMap #7 is delayed due to this move and hopes its readers and contributors will understand and still await the issue bouund and determined to be ON LOVE as of 3/28/99 our new west coast offices reside in Culver City (not far from what was once MGM--the heart of Hollywood) Todd Baron 3625 wesley street culver city ca. 90232 "...grows the heart grows...fonder" "four letter word" ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 13:35:32 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Kathy Lou Schultz Subject: PageMama O Rama (quiz, part 2) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Okay, kids, this time it gets a little tougher: this is a fill-in-the-blank. Don't worry; there won't be an essay question (this time). And no whispering! 1. The publisher who printed (mimeo-ed) Susan Howe's first book. 2. The name Ann Waldman wanted to give the writing school at Naropa (as stated in Lee Ann Brown's talk). 3. The telly tubby Bernadette Mayer displayed during her reading. 4. Name of Bay Area book publisher celebrating their 25th anniversary. 5. Online journal project being launched by Kathleen Fraser that will focus on "innovative reading/s--writing in answer to other writing, from opened perspectives & models." Answers: 1. Maureen Owen 2. The Gertrude Stein School of Disembodied Poetics 3. Po 4. Kelsey St. 5. HOW2 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 09:38:29 +1100 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: komninos zervos Subject: Re: problematic question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit try http://www.experimedia.vic.gov.au/cyberpoet/zine and http://www.experimedia.vic.gov.au/~komninos and http://members.tripod.com/~repoem/ and http://www.burningpress.org/wreyeting/index.html for starters, and you could check out my essay on technoliteratures on the internet at http://www.experimedia.vic.gov.au/~komninos/kkztext.html regards komninos Maria Damon wrote: > At 3:46 PM -0500 3/12/99, Lowther,John wrote: > >what's happening that seems New to anybody out there ? > > > well with all due modesty, and with acknowledgment that miekal is the prime > mover here, Literature Nation seems pretty new to me... ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 20:24:30 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: RaeA100900@AOL.COM Subject: Silliman reading Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Dear List, I thought those of you near or passing through San Diego should know that San Diego is about to be the site of another interesting event. Ron Silliman will read at D.G. Wills Bookstore in La Jolla on Monday, March 22 at 8:00 pm. I hope to see some of you there. Rae Armantrout ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 14:06:22 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: Re: problematic question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Maria Damon cd you tell me (us) what Literature Nation is ? > well with all due modesty, and with acknowledgment that miekal is the > prime > mover here, Literature Nation seems pretty new to me... > )L ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 13:24:23 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Kathy Lou Schultz Subject: Re: of Mothers & Daughters MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Joel K. ("Daddy Page") raises so many issues of grand importance that I can only begin to mull them over on this rainy San Francisco Sunday. First, I want to say that at the time of the Poetics List Explosion, that "as a woman," I didn't feel "excluded;" I felt pissed! There's a difference. The goings-on reminded me very much of the time I have spent doing political organizing and facillitating meetings in which a number of folks (yes, predominantly male) seemed much more interested in disruption and power-grabbing than in furthering any sort of positive action or discussion. The accusations levelled against Charles B. concerning "censorship" seemed to me simply ridiculous. I do not believe that Charles or Joel censored anyone in their delicate handling of the Poetics List. Rather it seemed that a number of men preferred to wage a pissing match with Charles--and Charles rightly declined to participate. I believe it was correct to shut the List down and regroup. And I hope now that people will begin to participate with a renewed sense of vigor. A very real impediment to this participation is, I think, time. I know that when I've been working 10+ hour days in the high-tech publishing industry, I've simply been too exhausted to reply to the Poetics List. But I've made valuable connections here, and found out some important information--including the announcement of the Page Mothers conference. I don't think I would have necessarily known about the Page Mothers conference if I had not read about it here. No, I wasn't "invited," but I felt it was very important to "show up" in all senses of that term. As a girl from the working class, I've seen again and again the futility of waiting to be invited to the table, so have set about making my own place there. That's much of what Lipstick Eleven is about. (In the "official" history I'm about to record) Jim Brashear and I co-founded Lipstick Eleven. We developed Issue No. 1 along with Catalina Cariaga and Roxane Marini. We worked as a collective. In terms of "identity" we were about as diverse a group as one could assemble in terms of race, class, gender, and sexuality. What brought us together was a shared poetics, the experience of having been "outsiders" at SF State, and friendship. For me, the experience of this publishing project is very much about the love and friendship I have with/for my fellow editors. I don't care if that's corny; it's true! And that's very much what makes the project work, as well as what makes it difficult (and necessary). After Issue No. 1, Roxane and Catalina declined to continue, but Jim and I forged ahead, and when Robin Tremblay-McGaw approached us about joining the Lipstick Eleven crew, we welcomed her with open arms. Robin is particularly interested in chapbook publishing, and has opened up new vistas for us. Another element that brought us all together is the teachers we worked with: namely Myung Kim and Bob Gluck. They have both taught me a great deal. More about the conference later--and I hope others will join in. Kathy Lou Schultz ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 14:18:38 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: derek beaulieu / house press Subject: an introduction... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit hi. my name is derek beaulieu and i am a rather new addition to the UB Poetics list having joined in just the last few days. i thot i should drop the list a note and introduce myself (as well as my press - housepress). ive been writing for only a few years - strongly influenced by the work of bpNichol, steve mccaffery, and the poetry of darren wershler-henry and damian lopes. i am also the editor and publisher of housepress - a small press dedicated to concrete poetry (and other forms as well) published in chapbooks, pamphlets, postcards, and ephemeral forms - saw in the archives and inquiry abt "keyboard po(e/li)tics" quiet a few months back - that was a chapbook exploration that neil hennessy and i wrote (a "pataphysical and oulippan look at the typewriter keys). anyway - enuf abt me - its good to be here and do hope to participate in some discussions and learn a great deal while here... yrs derek beaulieu ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 19:01:12 -1000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Susan M. Schultz" Subject: Re: LOVE and ReMap Comments: To: toddbaron@earthlink.net Comments: cc: gchan@hawaii.edu, kosanke@hawaii.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I still have lots of copies of _Tinfish_ 7: please buy copies for $3 ($2 under the usual price). The covers are unique Pacific region weather maps by Gaye Chan. The journal features poets from the Pacific region; expect to be surprised! I haven't yet put this issue on the web, and won't until I get more business. Back issues are also available at a discount. Kathy Banggo's _4-evaz, Anna_ is being reprinted for the third time; it's yours for $4. Hawaiian Creole English and standard; lyrical and tough. A "best seller." Much taught at the University of Hawai`i-Manoa. I'll be going to the AWP conference in Albany in mid-April and would be delighted to hook up with listees. Will be spending a few days in Denver prior to the conference. Likewise. Susan Schultz 47-391 Hui Iwa Street #3 Kaneohe, HI 96744 USA ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 04:45:27 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "A. Jenn Sondheim" Subject: the little train MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII / the little train one publisher tried to take my book out of production, saying no one would read it. one publisher reneged. one publisher paid for, but didn't bring out a second book, because it was too expensive. one publisher probably jumped up and down but I wasn't there. I was one publisher. one publisher lied and kept me on hold forever, doing nothing. one publisher defended my articles. one publisher is very kind. one publisher is very evil. one pub- lisher had his files destroyed because the typesetters found my work ob- scene. one publisher never sent me copies. one publisher destroyed my cat- alogs. two publishers are my closest friends. one publisher died. one pub- lisher was wonderful and worked with the book. one publisher had his files returned and had to find a new printer. one publisher was wonderful with terrific production values. one publisher produced chapbooks with amazing speed and gusto. one publisher required the subtending of the book. one publisher is on hold. one publisher wore slippers. one publisher found me a nuisance. one publisher found me easy to work with. one publisher won't speak to me. one publisher welcomes me with open arms. one publisher found my old cd's and interviewed me on the phone. I almost fell in love with one publisher. one publisher published without permission. one publisher stole my work. one publisher sent me a contract stating my work would belong to one publisher forever. one publisher rearranged my texts. one publisher did not. or intense dust, the long and languorous road to suffocation, always dif- ficult to breathe. or filtering through the airconditioned technology of distributions: records, tapes, magazines, anthologies, chapbooks, mono- graphs. or the sorriest of accounts in a certain coming-into-being. or violent and unmitigated jealousies, nightmares, smashed dreams of fame and fortune. or symptomatic of a closet and impure personality. or the submer- ging of the jewel of talent. or the righteous suppression of the mediocre. or neglect or perseverance. one publisher never answered. one publisher refused to answer or return the work. one publisher would if one publisher could. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 09:15:40 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maria Damon Subject: Re: of Mothers & Daughters In-Reply-To: <36EBF459.18A9@mail.gcccd.cc.ca.us> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" interesting musings, joel, and i appreciate your heartfelt commitment to what you're saying. i don't think i knew about the pagemothers conference. so i didn't go. i think it's fantastic that folks are finally recognizing ntozake shange as part of this feminist textual expansion --i remember mentioning her and her "scene" on an MLA panel a few years ago (with m davidson and e dorn) and feeling that i was a fish out of water, though certainly nobody (except dorn) was hostile (and he was not hostile to me as a person, quite the contrary, very gracious, but our talks were diametrically opposed in sentiment, conviction and dare i say ideology). also i'm glad, though i agree with the caveat about turning certain persons into icons, that there can be this kind of celebration since it is obvious that women have an enormously influential location i the "new poetries" --in fact, and i've said this before on the list, it was my concern with "women's writing" that first led me to "language" type poetry; it wasn't until i met charles b and some of the other guys at the louisville conference a few years ago that i even read these guys's work, let alone their theory and a few decades of internal debate (true confession time; i also have never read hamlet, and i hold a tenured position in an english dept). and i agree with kathy lou schultz that the "opposition to power" expressed by some of the guys in the days leading up to the List Implosion was misdirected at charles and certainly had overtones of competitive oedipalism. i for one have not been especially engaged with gender issues on this list because it doesn't seem the place to do this --it's exhausting and the payoffs are few. that's not what i use the list for. as for the perloff/harryman standoff, i have never met carla harryman (so don't know her personal style etc) and i'm quite fond of marjorie, but she (m) is a controversialist and often i just HAFTA disagree w/ what she says. this is a risk since she occupies such a significant gate-keeper position in the field, but i think in the long run it strengthens the field to have diverse positions articulated, even sharp disagreement, among equals. so, carry on, everybody --marjorie, carla, kathy lou, joel, henry, charles. proliferation of subject positions is all to the good. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 08:56:53 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maria Damon Subject: Re: problematic question In-Reply-To: <5D5C5C8C3A41D211893900A024D4B97C40E6A6@md.facstaff.oglethorpe.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 2:06 PM -0500 3/14/99, Lowther,John wrote: > Maria Damon > > cd you tell me (us) what Literature Nation is ? > check out http://net22.com/qazingulaza/joglars/litnat/index.html lit nat is a piece of hypertextual interwriting with all kinds of groovy special effects. as i'm a techno-neanderthal, and something of a poetic neanderthal as well (though folks on the list have done an admirable job of dragging me kicking and screaming into the present) i have no way of knowing how much of a novelty this website actually is, but for me, it's thrilling. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 10:07:54 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Michael McColl Organization: TEMPLE UNIVERSITY Subject: Re: problematic question In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT On Sat, 13 Mar 1999 09:26:29 -0600 Maria Damon said: >> >>At any given point, maybe about 1% of 1% of what is being produced is >>good enough to stand the test of time, and to be acknowledged >>subsequently as representing a genuine development of what had gone >>before. Both history and statistical probability are stacked against you >>in any quest to satisfy both a craving for novelty and a search for >>significance amongst the contemporary output. >> >> >>Gerald O'Connell >> >with all due respect for the care that poets put into their work, it is >this sort of judgment that my whole professional life is devoted to >dismantling --cliches like "good enough to stnad the test of time" as if >that is or should be the prime consideration. it seems to treat poetry >like a commodity (does it come with a lifetime guarantee, or only a >one-year warranty? will i have to buy a new one in 5 years, or will this >last?) Without entering an imbroglio over the test of time, which in fact isn't *quite* as easy to dismiss as all that, I would suggest that the test of time as applied to commodities is just as likely stolen from the world of art; commodites are being treated like art, perhaps, rather than the other way around. In any case, half the writers talked about on this list have passed, or are passing, subscribed to the notion, and the counter-traditions which have been assembled comprise writers who have, yes, passed a test of time. a test of time, no? Mike McColl ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 11:13:47 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Michael W Bibby Subject: Li-Young Lee Reading In-Reply-To: <003501be6e60$4dc4a000$6c71e4cf@cfthomps.acs.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII For any of you who might be in the south-central PA region this week: Li-Young Lee will be reading at Shippensburg University on Thurs., March 18, at 7:30 pm in Old Main Chapel on the SU campus. Questions?/directions?--b/c me at mwbibb@ark.ship.edu Michael Bibby Department of English Shippensburg University 1871 Old Main Drive Shippensburg, PA 17257 (717) 532-1723 mwbibb@ark.ship.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 12:37:23 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Nuyopoman@AOL.COM Subject: Peoples Poetry Gathering, NYT Travel Section Comments: To: slam@datawranglers.com, CityLore@aol.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit March 14, 1999, Sunday Travel Desk TRAVEL ADVISORY; Poets Will Converge Upon Manhattan Lower Manhattan has played host to poets and their movements for more than two centuries. Edgar Allan Poe, Dylan Thomas, Allen Ginsberg and e.e. cummings all embellished their talents, and occasionally their habits, in the East Village, SoHo, the West Village, and the Lower East Side. Next month poets from around the world will visit these historic neighborhoods for the first People's Poetry Gathering. From April 9 to 11, professional poets, amateurs and the curious will partake in over 50 poetry recitations, conversation groups, competitions and workshops. Although the festival is anchored at Cooper Union (East Seventh Street between Third and Fourth Avenues), events will take place throughout the downtown area. Presented by City Lore, a New York cultural center, and Poets House, a literary center and home to a 35,000-volume poetry library, the festival will explore two primary themes: ''Masters of Oral Tradition'' and ''Emerging Forms and Formats.'' ''Masters of Oral Tradition'' events will feature a performance by Utah Phillips, Grand Master of the Rose Tattoo, a dispersed troupe of hobo poets; Gabriel Segura and Rafael Perez Lopez, Colombian decima (10-line verse) improvisers; and a picnic with the cowboy poet Don Edwards, a former rancher and rodeo chaser. A 10-round ''Heavyweight Poetry Bout'' between Sherman Alexie and Patricia Smith and ''Braggin' Rights,'' a free-style street-corner rapping contest, are planned for ''Emerging Forms and Formats.'' Other featured poets will include Robert Pinsky, the Poet Laureate of the United States; John Cephas, the Piedmont blues musician and National Heritage Award winner; and Galway Kinnell, winner of the Pulitzer Prize and National Book Award. Also planned are a supper in honor of Robert Burns, midnight readings of erotic poetry and Edgar Allan Poe, a workshop for renga, a collaborative 36-stanza poem (saki provides inspiration after the sixth stanza) with masters from the Spring Street Haiku Group, and a literary tour and pub crawl. Information: (800) 333-5982, extension 5, or www.peoplespoetry.org. Book now! Bob Holman ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 12:34:31 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: derek beaulieu / house press Subject: "in grave ink" Comments: To: Undisclosed.Recipients@mail3.cadvision.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit in grave ink *seriously new writing* $4 one issue $10 for one year (3 issues) To privilege one form or style of poetry over another is not the goal of in grave ink. That is what we are trying to escape. However it does seem fair to point out that Canada does privilege a style, a form, even an ideology, perhaps we could call it Nationalism, an attempt to create a Canadian identity through poetry . Whatever is at work in this closing down of poetic possibility is not really what we care about. We care about poetry. Poetry that moves, that breathes, that kicks and hogs the covers. Poetry that gets up in the middle of the night and steals your food and money. Poetry that is both alive, and living. Although poetry is our main focus, it is not our only focus. Any form of writing and art that fulfills the above ideas of alive and living is welcome. Please let us know the borders that can be touched and crossed in all forms of art. If its new, seriously so, we want it. So what's with the claim "seriously" new poetry? Here we take writing seriously but do not necessarily see it as having to be serious. We enjoy play with language, with form, with the edges of what is stylistically possible but we play seriously. We play with the belief that words still have the power to change. So that is a rough and rambling idea of what we are doing and what we want to do. If you are interested any help is welcome. Whether this help comes in the form of poetry, other forms of art, the act of reading or even (shall I say it) subscription money, it is all appreciated. To find out more, submit or order e-mail: ldtippin@ucalgary.ca or ingraveink@hotmail.com normal mail: in grave ink c/o Lindsay Tipping 103 416 7th St NW Calgary, AB T2N 1S4 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 14:30:15 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Elizabeth Treadwell Subject: NEW AT DOUBLE LUCY: LYNNE TILLMAN Comments: cc: tillwhen@aol.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ***New @ Double Lucy's Website*** 1. Juicy excerpt from LYNNE TILLMAN's novella, LOVE SENTENCE, the first in Double Lucy's 1999-2000 Prose Series! "Everything Paige thought about love, anything she felt about love, was inadequate and wrong. It didn't matter to her that in some way, from some point of view, someone couldn't actually be wrong about an inchoate thing like love." Lynne Tillman's most recent novel, NO LEASE ON LIFE, was a Finalist for this year's National Book Award. We have admired her for ages & are proud to publish this funny, philosophical, literary valentino, starring a favorite character of Lynne's, Miss Paige Turner. 2. LUCY LINKS Check out the new Lucy Links page!! The old standards, necessary classics, and new Lucilly links to things like the GIRL WIDE WEB, too! 3. YEDDA MORRISON AUTHOR PAGE! And dash from here to Yedda as the SFBayArea's "LOCAL HOWLER" for March, while you still can! She's a celeb! 4. and while you're there don't forget to check out excerpts from the current issue of OUTLET, featuring work by Laura Moriarty, Malcolm de Chazal (translated by Irving Weiss), Brenda Iijima & Franklin Bruno. Enjoy -ET, Ed. Outlet Magazine -&- Double Lucy Books P.O. Box 9013, Berkeley, California 94709 U.S.A. http://users.lanminds.com/~dblelucy ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 18:21:21 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Steven Marks Subject: Re: Long Poems are the Other, aren't they? In-Reply-To: <943007aa.36ea86dc@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Sat, 13 Mar 1999, Tom Beckett wrote: > I'm fascinated by long poems because they represent something I can't seem to > do,sensibilities I can visit but not inhabit. If I write 10 pages, my > characteristic impulse is to reduce them to 10 lines. I tend to condense > rather than expand. I'm more likely to remove words than add them. I find that I am now doing the same. I've taken about 50 pages of prose (an abandoned novel) and whittled it down to about 60 or 70 lines. As I continue the condensing, I lose more words, but start to add in graphical elements that somehow take the place of words or sometimes reinforce them or sometimes act alone. I think I do this because I am so often overwhelmed by all that I feel I must take in. It's less like ADD (at least for me) and more like autism (withdrawal or refuge from overabundance). I feel like if I can just get down a few words and images, then the kaleidoscope will stop turning for a few seconds. As for the second part... > When one does a long poem is intensity of experience sacrificed to depth or > duration? I don't know, having never written a long poem. However, I am considering my current project as a long visual serial poem. The intensity of experience for the creator of the short poem may be stronger than that of the reader/viewer (although not necessariIy). I know that what I put into 6 pages (which may contain all of 20 words) and an equal amount of graphical elements takes me several months to build. I don't kid myself; it can be looked at in about 15 seconds. I hope that you find things in it that keep you there longer and keep you coming back. I guess I'm saying that this is probably no different an experience than can be had with a long poem. Except that there are more words and that means more time, or duration. There, I've argued both sides. Steven Marks ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 22:18:16 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Kevin L. Magee" Subject: Re: The Lament, Caravan ) posted 11 Mar MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It is still difficult for me to speak of Hart Crane. One ought to speak more severely than I do of him, to pay respect to the reality of the person Hart Crane (the person of the native inward site of emotional innocence) and the personal seriousness of the poet Hart Crane (in the period of his ascent into literary conspicuousness). Anyone attempting to comment on his work in a homespun style would have to use plain guts to sustain the inevitable gaucheness of paying such tribute, although I would not now credit him with more than a militant outspokenness, the line of it lightning-like "straight" jaggedly bent making a hit somewhere in the area of his excitability, a dazzlingness actually soft in its outburst. Any literarily environmental definition of it, especially in the wild-behavior manifestations of it, earnestness of being, from sense of the specularity of it, the rapturous seizures, his energetic enthusiasm for poet-being, the frenzies of exhibition of feeling-exuberances: the inward site where tendernesses, affections, impulses of kindest emotionality [I say "emotionality," rather than "sensuality"] ranged in chaos: He was preoccupied with the physical triumph of utterance of tradition --the English tradition--and the twists in it to make room for himself, his personal, single-minded, combative, conception of Heavenly Success (I wonder if it ever did, if it ever could have, become altogether that, to him). One might say that will rather than thought was the sponsor of his language. And the ringing-in, here, knowing what I know of Hart Crane, with the affection manifested towards me when we were in comradely association in New York, all agog with literary self-consciousness: who was going to be "successful," who might, actually, become "famous," who at least be rated as a safe bet for the commitment of the critical watchers of the candidates for the word "good" for public whispering round. I cannot read any other story into what happened to him humanly, a spectacular incurability and original confusion in terms that combined the personal and the literary--what was happening was a convulsive mixture of the two within an actually narrow frame of experience (both personal and literary experience) dedicated to poetic independence from hierarchic restrictions and stupefying refinements for all the stress put on his having given natural-poet-identity, no eccentric existing in a private literary environment of his own. The comparison has justification. Blake armed his poet-boldness with Art, indifferent to others, yet courting them, making them listen, by the forceful boast of indifferentness, as the opposite number to the Hart Crane figure of quixotic self-expansiveness, a pair of types couplable by a quite braggart singularity and grasp of the nature of critical literary learning. In this period of my thinking, my formulating of my thinking, I called the individual unreal: not just a process of reaction to existence as an environmental aggregate, the body of experience en masse, that to which one was involuntarily, almost helplessly, exposed. I can identify this environment in-the-large of individual being as collective, synthetic, reality, in so far as it is real, not something locked within a frame of existence that makes of one the reactions it excites in one. It has surprised me that I could then stretch my loyal regard across the widening breach, and encompass the whole in an appreciation both fervent and sad. I called the individual unreal. Would it have been any different if I had lingered beyond 1925? I had moved far away from the New York scene. It is still difficult for me to speak of Hart Crane. Laura Riding March 15, 193-? 194-? Near Garrettsville ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 10:21:09 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Administration Subject: disappearer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit All - sorry for the short run yesterday; UB is predictably saddled once again with mailhub problems, which caused a smidge of havoc here. Messages from yesterday have been sent to listserv, and are on their way - but I don't know at this point when they'll get here. Chris - argh ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 23:28:35 +0100 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: cris cheek Subject: e-dress wanted Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Anyone here got a working e-dress for David Antin? I'd be much abliged. Also anybody who saw his 'Sky Poems' I'd be keen to hear about that experience and if you've got any documentation of the events. thanks in advance love and love cris ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 13:22:33 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Charles Bernstein Subject: More Listserv Technical Problems Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At this point, Chris Alexander is unable to get access to his email account due to yet more problems at the UB mailhub. This will disrupt posatings the list yet again, but nothing should be lost Chris will be back on line as soon as possible. Charles Bernstein ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 10:32:42 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Richard Carfagna Subject: Enslin essays HI, Was just wondering if anyone knows of essays or the such on the long poems of Theodore Enslin, NPF just released his selected poems and I'm curious to find out more about the long poems excerpted in this volume and the ones not included. ric ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 09:53:49 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: dbkk@SIRIUS.COM Subject: Re: of Mothers & Daughters In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 9:15 AM -0600 3/15/99, Maria Damon wrote: >i think it's fantastic that folks are finally recognizing >ntozake shange as part of this feminist textual expansion --i remember >mentioning her and her "scene" on an MLA panel a few years ago (with m >davidson and e dorn) and feeling that i was a fish out of water, though >certainly nobody (except dorn) was hostile Maria, I agree with you that it's "fantastic" (you're so much more enthusiastic than I am, Maria) that Ntozake Shange is being recognized in this area--however I had lots of problems with how she was discussed at the conference. I felt there was lots of amnesia and revisionism going on. I got involved in the SF experimental feminist scene in the early 80s after having been reading more traditional feminist stuff for 10 years--and at that time I thought Shange was great--the whole country did. But when I learned the new theoretical feminist cannon, Shange was never taught, never mentioned--as far as I remember. Though Shange does some marvelous stuff formally, she was overlooked by the intelligensia--because of her populist surface, I imagine. She was someone, I felt in my younger impressionable years, that one gave up--like Plath, like Adrienne Rich, like Gilbert and Gubar--if one wanted to be a serious experimental feminist. The only black woman I can remember being acceptable was Erica Hunt (Harryette Mullen was still early on in her career; later, of course, she got noticed). These are just my memories from my "youth," which, as we all know, can be very reductive. Interestingly, one guy posed a question to my panel about class--and I was all ready to speak--finally this could be talked about because it is an important issue, I feel, one that is denied over and over again--and somebody besides me and Kathy Lou Schultz thinks so. Laura Moriarity said that class differences were breaking down--something I disagree with, which is odd since I usually agree with Laura. But then Carla jumped up and started yelling at Marjorie and the issue, once again, got swept under the rug. Dodie ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 10:41:49 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Billy Little Subject: Re: of Mothers & Daughters Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" don't you think that these are Perloff's men and she has to protect/project their dominance or she risks seeing her own writing about them become irrelevant? forbidden plateau fallen body dojo 4 song st. nowhere, b.c. V0R1Z0 canadaddy ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 12:51:52 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Judy Roitman Subject: More Larryville In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Alan Sondheim March 30 7:30 p.m. Canterbury House 1116 Louisiana Lawrence, KS And don't forget the Poetics Seminar (Mayhew on March 31, Perloff on April 19). --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Judy Roitman | "Whoppers Whoppers Whoppers! Math, University of Kansas | memory fails Lawrence, KS 66045 | these are the days." 785-864-4630 | fax: 785-864-5255 | Larry Eigner, 1927-1996 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Note new area code ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.math.ukans.edu/~roitman/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 14:38:40 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Edward Foster Subject: New Terrific Book In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII It's here: Simon Pettet _James Schuyler - Selected Art Writings_ Black Sparrow, 1999 (with photos and everything) paperback, $17.50, ISBN 1-57423-076-X ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 15:02:32 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Elizabeth Fodaski Subject: Torque MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Dear Friends of Torque, As I prepare the next issue of Torque for publication, I find myself at a frustrating crossroads. While sales of the Torque + Object collaborative issue were good, they were not good enough to compensate me and Rob for the money we spent, from our own pockets, to get the issue out. The balance of my Torque account, therefore, is not sufficient to cover the cost of the next issue. While I desperately want to get the exciting new issue of Torque into print and distributed among Torque’s faithful readers and contributors, I can’t do it without the funds. I don’t need much more money; if fifty more people bought copies of the Torque + Object collaborative issue, I would have enough, from my share of the proceeds, to print Torque #6. There are still plenty of copies of the highly successful Torque + Object collaborative issue, featuring work by 25 innovative poets. The collection has been touted by many readers and correspondents as a fantastic and fruitful collaborative effort to bring together so many of today’s most interesting and adventurous writers. I urge you to order a copy today if you don’t already have one, to buy a second if you do, and to tell anyone you know who hasn’t ordered a copy to do so. Copies of Torque #4 are also available. Order now if you don’t have this issue. The sooner the orders come in, the sooner Torque #6 will be in print! Thank you for your continued support. To order, send checks made payable to Elizabeth Fodaski to: Elizabeth Fodaski 21 East 2nd Street #14 New York, NY 10003 Torque #4 is $6. The Object + Torque collaborative issue is $10. Please order! Sincerely, Elizabeth Fodaski ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 12:05:25 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Katie Degentesh Subject: 9x9 = 6,500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit 6,500 HAS ARRIVED!!! 9x9 Industries presents the long-awaited first issue of its magazine: 6,500 Packed with poetry, prose, and poetry in translation by: Jürge BECKER --> Anselm BERRIGAN --> Edmund BERRIGAN --> Curtis BONNEY -->David CAMERON --> Maxine CHERNOFF --> The Mysterious MISTER CLAM --> Daniel COSHNEAR --> Katie DEGENTESH --> Paul FLORES --> Gregory FUCHS --> Ray GONZALEZ --> Oleg GRIGORIEV --> Martina HÜGLI --> Honor JOHNSON --> Noelle KOCOT --> Brendan LORBER --> Alice NOTLEY --> Douglas OLIVER --> Eugene OSTASHEVSKY --> Alexei PARSCHIKOV --> Kit ROBINSON --> Aaron SHURIN --> Hal SIROWITZ --> J. Tarin TOWERS --> Alicia WING To CELEBRATE this event, some of the above people (including Curtis Bonney, Maxine Chernoff, Paul Flores, Kit Robinson, Katie Degentesh, Tarin Towers, Eugene Ostashevsky, Alicia Wing, and the Mysterious Mr. Clam) will READ THEIR POETRY at New College of California 777 Valencia, San Francisco 7:30 PM THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 1999 *PLEASE NOTE THAT THIS EVENT IS ONLY 9 (NINE) DAYS AWAY* and it will cost **********$8 to get IN and GET 6,500********* THIS IS A VERY GOOD PRICE because -->6,500 has a cover price of $8<-- (you may enter for $5 if you already own so many copies of 6,500 you can't possibly carry home another and you just want to catch the amazing reading) Those of you who need to order 6,500 by mail may write checks payable to Paraffin Arts Project and send them c/o 9x9 Industries, PO Box 14842, San Francisco, CA 94114. Those of you who need to SUBMIT will do so c/o 6,500 at the very same address you see above. 9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9 6,500: six thousand, five hundred Editor: Brandon Downing Graphic Design: Eugene Timerman, Klauddesign Associate Editor: Katie "The Door" Degentesh 9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9X9 thanks to the Zellerbach Family Fund and the members of 9x9 Industries THIS IS A VERY BIG DEAL. OTHER 199X9 EVENTS: MARCH 18: Alex Green, Marvin White, Tom Roche read at Adobe Bookshop APRIL 15: Double Lucy Books at Adobe: Elizabeth Treadwell, Yedda Morrison, Sarah Anne Cox (not Sarah Rosenthal as previously mentioned) MAY 13: Michael Palmer and Jocelyn Saidenberg read at Adobe Bookshop 1999 (NINETEEN NINETY (NINE BY NINE) INDUSTRIES) 199X9 www.paraffin.org/nine/ WE WANT YOUR THURSDAY EVENINGS. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 12:51:52 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Weiss Subject: Query Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Anyone out there (including herself) who knows Lee-Anne Brown's email address? ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 19:56:14 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: charles alexander Subject: some tucson events Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" POG (poetry group) Presents: PETER GANICK with guest Sheila E. Murphy POETRY READING Saturday, March 20, 7pm at ORTS THEATRE of DANCE 121 E. 7th Street PETER GANICK is the founder/publisher of Potes & Poets Press and Abacus. His recent books include NO SOAP RADIO, NEWS ON SKIS, and RECTANGULAR MORNING POEM. He lives in Elmwood, Connecticut. He and Sheila E. Murphy (poet and POG member) have recently completed a collaborative poem, and part of the reading will consist of them reading this work together. $5 suggested contribution, but no one will be turned away. The next POG reading after this one is one POG is co-sponsoring with the Tucson Poetry Festival, and features David Shapiro reading with Charles Bernstein, on Friday, March 26, at 8:00 pm, at the Temple of Music and Art, 330 S. Scott Avenue, Tucson. The Tucson Poetry Festival charges $9 admission per session ($7 if purchased in advance at Antigone Books, Bentley's House of Coffee & Tea, or the Book Stop), or $20 admission for the entire festival ($15 if purchased in advance at the locations listed above). Poets reading at other readings during the festival are Jane Hirshfield, Robert Bly, and state poetry contest winner on Saturday March 27 at 8pm; and Pat Mora, Ramson Lomatewama, and bilingual high school poetry contest winner on Sunday March 28 at 2pm. The reading featuring David Shapiro with Charles Bernstein is the only reading at the Tucson Poetry Festival that is co-sponsored by POG. For POG information call 520-620-1626. For Tucson Poetry Festival Information call 520-620-2045. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 03:21:44 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "A. Jenn Sondheim" Subject: 1844-1999 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII + 1844-1999 I will be your pattern because it's clear there's a pattern to be made and I will be your maid and clear up the pattern made from fear of the lumpenproletariat welling up from your maid who you will have made thinking that always beyond the shame there is always another maid who will wash away that pattern while you steer clear of what you have rigorously made defining pattern beyond repetition, that is: the rigour of the maid. every pattern has its marx to upwell from the pattern. every maid dreams of jenny and black freighters. you only think of patterns and spinning jennies you think you made. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 03:56:13 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Ron Silliman Subject: SoCal Reading Tour Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain RON SILLIMAN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA TOUR HELLO, LA JOLLA Monday, March 22, 8 PM DG Wills Books 7561 Girard Avenue La Jolla, CA 92037 619) 456-1800 FIRST LA READING OF THE 1990s Thursday, March 25, 8 PM Loyola Marymount MacIntosh Center 7900 Loyola Bld (near Sepulveda & Manchester) For info, call the English Dept (310) 338-3018 Our thanks to the Motion Picture Academy for moving the Oscar Presentations to Sunday so as to avoid a conflict with DG Wills Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 11:23:09 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetry Project Subject: Future readings in the outer province Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" For anyone heading to NYC this spring or anyone here, readings on Monday nights at the Poetry Project (131 E. 10th St., St. Mark's Church) are as follows: March 22 -- Hoa Nguyen & Dale Smith April 12 -- Brian Kim Stefans & Dan Farrell April 26 -- Pamela Lu & Robert Fitterman May 10 -- Tom Devaney & Gregory Fuchs May 17 -- Rosa Alcala & Mary Burger May 24 -- Camille Guthrie & Lytle Shaw June 6 -- Ruth Altman & Gordon Ball All are welcome. Thanks, Anselm Berrigan ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 12:20:51 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "A. Jenn Sondheim" Subject: please check out Comments: To: Fop , Cyb MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII http://stadiumweb.com/turnstile/turnstile_part2.html - I forget where the URL came in, but this is one of the most fascinating works I've ever seen on the Net and well worth a visit; I've been back a number of times. Alan ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 11:36:42 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Elizabeth Treadwell Subject: of Mothers & Daughters Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" **Chris -- if this is too "macro" feel free to delete. of course. Cheers, E. Hi all, Maria Damon says that she doesn't like to discuss gender issues on the list (the payoff being negligible and the irritation high?) but that is one thing that keeps me turning to the list, even tho it can get ugly. I've felt in the last few days that its been really really interesting and not at all ugly, not at all implosive, with Kevin and Joel and Kathy Lou weighing in on Page Moms etc, and was very pleased to see Rachel's response to my "delinquent daughter" query. These gendered concerns aren't quite separable from that nebulous thing that might be called my poetix. Tho reading Joel's essay/epistle made me think bringing up delinquent daughter questions here might be talking out of school if that is the right phrase. I just hope the lurker women keep on or start speaking up. I really do. Briefly, Elizabeth Outlet Magazine -&- Double Lucy Books P.O. Box 9013, Berkeley, California 94709 U.S.A. http://users.lanminds.com/~dblelucy ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 19:32:30 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Administration Subject: "gas jockeys Unite": 5 years of filling Station Magazine / Beaulieu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit had to reformat this. Chris ----------------- Original message (ID=1F35F22F) (123 lines) ------------------ From: "derek beaulieu / house press" Subject: "gas jockeys Unite": 5 years of filling Station Magazine Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 15:50:02 -0700 filling Station magazine is proud to announce: "Gas Jockeys Unite": Celebrating 5 years and 15 issues of filling Station Magazine! Carpenter's Union Hall, Calgary, Alberta April 17, 1999 7:30pm for 5 years filling Station has been dedicated to publishing new and established authors, poets and graphic artists from around the globe. We are pleased to announce a fundraising party on April 17th featuring local Calgarian bands and readings by: Jeff Derksen Suzette Myer Richard Harrison and many others! cover charge TBA stay tuned for further details and more information! if you are interested in hearing more about this event or about filling Station Magazine in general, please feel free to contact: Derek Beaulieu and Courtney Thompson at: (h)403-234-0336 (fax)403-234-7463 housepre@cadvison.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 10:49:14 -0500 Reply-To: CLAITY@drew.edu Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Cassandra Laity Subject: CFP: NEW MODERNISMS Conference MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Date: 17-Mar-1999 10:48am EDT From: Laity, Cassandra CLAITY Dept: FAC/STAFF Tel No: 3141 TO: Remote Addressee ( _in%poetics@listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu ) Subject: CFP: NEW MODERNISMS Conference Date: 17-Mar-1999 10:45am EDT From: Laity, Cassandra CLAITY Dept: FAC/STAFF Tel No: 3141 TO: Laity, Cassandra ( CLAITY ) Subject: RE: FWD: Re: Mass Mailing Dear Poetics List: So many of you expressed interest in attending the inaugural conference of _The Modernist Studies Association_, "The New Modernisms" (Oct. 7-10, 1999 at Penn State University), tham I am posting our "brochure," which lays out the procedure both for submitting proposals and for registering for one of the sixteen available seminars listed below. We begin by presenting a list of the plenaries and special sessions appearing at the conference. As plans develop, one or two additional plenary sessions may be posted on our website and will appear in our full brochure (still in production). Cassandra Laity on behalf of the _MSA_ Program Committee _______________________________________________________________________________ The New Modernisms The Inaugural Conference of the Modernist Studies Association October 7-10, 1999 The Nittany Lion Inn State College, Pennsylvania About the Conference The recently founded Modernist Studies Association is devoted to the study of the arts in their social, political, cultural, and intellectual contexts from the late nineteenth century through the mid-twentieth century. The organization aims to develop an international and interdisciplinary forum to promote exchange among scholars in this revitalized and rapidly changing field. The conference will feature three kinds of organized discussion: 1) plenary sessions, each with two invited speakers and a respondent; 2) seminars, small group discussions (maximum of 15) based on brief essays which the participants submit in advance; and 3) panels, each with a chair and three 20-minute presentations. The design of the conference should allow each participant to attend the plenary sessions and participate in a seminar and/or a panel. Plenary Sessions "Modernism, Race, and Nation": Peter Nicholls (University of Sussex), Houston Baker (Duke University), and respondent Kathryne Lindberg (Wayne State University) "Modernism, Feminist Criticism and Identity Politics": Susan Stanford Friedman (University of Wisconsin--Madison), Rachel Blau DuPlessis (Temple University), and repondent Bonnie Kime Scott (University of Delaware) "Literary Modernism and the Visual Arts": Charles Altieri (University of California--Berkeley), Philip Weinstein (Swarthmore College), and respondent Wendy Steiner (University of Pennsylvania) Special Sessions The program committee has arranged special sessions on Modernism and "Redefining Modernity" (Rita Felski, University of Virgina); Modern Art (Patricia Leighten, Duke University); "Middlebrow" Culture (Ann Ardis, University of Delaware); The Marketing of Modernism (Mark Morrisson, Pennsylvania State University--University Park); The Editing of Modernist Texts (Robin Schulze, Pennsylvania State University--University Park); Modernism, Science, and Technology (Susan Squier, Pennsylania State University--University Park); Modernism and Post-Colonialism (Guari Viswanathan, Columbia University); and The London Literary Scene, 1911-1916 (Caroline Zilboorg, Cambridge University) Call for Panel Proposals and Seminar Registration Individuals may submit a ranked list of two or three seminars and/or a proposal for a panel. Since we can accept only a limited number of panel proposals, we encourage all prospective participants to consider participation in one of the sixteen seminars listed below. Seminar assignments will be made on a first come/first served basis, beginning now and extending to August 1st: the sooner you submit your selections, the better your chance of receiving your first choice. If you choose to submit a proposal for a panel, we encourage you to register for seminars at the same time. If your panel proposal is not accepted, you are still guaranteed a place in one of the seminars. If your proposal is accepted, you still have the option of participating in a seminar. The deadline for submitting panel proposals is June 1st. The program committee will notify those who have submitted proposals by June 30th. Seminars Seminars are small group discussions (maximum of 15) based on brief papers (5-10 pages) that the participants submit in advance of the meeting. Seminars are an attractive feature of many professional conferences. They offer participants with related interests an opportunity to meet and to engage in a conversation that may extend beyond the conference itself. We strongly encourage registrants to consider participation in a seminar either as a desirable alternative to, or in addition to, their participation on a panel. All registrants are guaranteed a place in a seminar, and will be sent a letter confirming their presence on the program. As far as travel funds are concerned, academic institutions usually regard participation in a seminar as equivalent to participation on a panel. The program committee has organized the following seminars: 1. Modernism and Popular Culture David Chinitz (Loyola University--Chicago) [25 word description still pending. See the website for an update.] 2. Modernist Irony Kevin Dettmar (Clemson University) [25-word description still pending. See the website for an update.] 3. Modernism and the Victorians Mary Ellis Gibson (University of North Carolina--Greensboro) and Cassandra Laity (Drew University) How did modernists create narratives of artistic inheritance, reflecting or diverging from their predecessors? How did gender sexuality and changes in publishing and distributing art shape these narratives? 4. Provincial to European: Constructing British Modernisms Nancy Gish (University of Southern Maine--Portland) How has political and poetic devolution in contemporary Britain challenged, displaced, or reconceptualized "English Literary Modernism" constructed as Eliot's continuation of "the mind of Europe?" 5. New Approaches to the Harlem Renaissance Robert von Hallberg (University of Chicago) [25-word description still pending. See the website for an update.] 6. Modernity, Gender and Pan-Africanism Cyraina Johnson (University of Notre Dame) This seminar invites papers addressing the relation between modernity and Pan-Africanism, as seen through the prism of the late 19th- and early 20th-century constructions of race and gender. 7. Modern and Contemporary Women Poets Linda A. Kinnahan (Duquesne University) This seminar invites papers exploring how contemporary women's poetry is connected to/affected by/read in relation to the continuing recovery and (re)reading of women modernist poets. 8. Modernism and Queer Theory Colleen Lamos (Rice University) What is the relation between modernist aesthetics and the emergent psycho-medical discourse on homosexuality? How does queer theory alter our understanding of modern literature? 9. Modernism and Pedagogy Gail McDonald (University of North Carolina--Greensboro) Theoretical and practical approaches to modernist texts in the classroom: issues of difficulty, allusiveness, and cultural "capital." What can pedagogy reveal about the assumptions and aesthetics of modernist experimentation in fiction, poetry, and the other arts? 10. Recontextualizations of Modernism Michael North (University of California--Los Angeles) [25-word description still pending. See website for an update.] 11. Modernism and the Jewish Writer Alicia Ostriker (Rutgers University) Discussions of modernism in Jewish poetry and fiction, in terms either of formal experiment, or thematic concerns such as the immigrant experience, the Great War, changing gender roles. 12. Modernism and Post-Colonialism Leonard Orr (Washington State University) What is the impact of post-colonial theory on modernist studies? How do modernist texts represent double consciousness, syncretism, and the trauma of diaspora? 13. Modernism and Politics Stan Smith (Notthingham-Trent University) The modernism of Eliot, Pound, Yeats, Wyndham Lewis, Lawrence, etc. seems inextricably linked with a right-wing authoritarian, hierarchical, and masculine politics. Is the conjuncture merely coincidental, or are there deep structural reasons for the link? 14. Modernism and the Law Robert Spoo (University of Tulsa) This seminar will consider authors in various legal contexts, including (but not limited to) obscenity laws, customs and postal regulations, passport restrictions, copyright and libel laws. 15. Modernism and the Occult Leon Surrette (University of Western Ontario) Papers of a critical and scholarly nature are invited on occult topics in modern poetry or fiction and/or occult writers. By "occult" we mean a hidden ("occult") tradition of religious belief, or secret ritual practice. Secret societies are a different category. 16. Modernism and the Canon Keith Tuma (Miami University, Ohio) This seminar will explore how we might represent British modernist literature in a post-national and post-canonical American academy in which the once-privileged position of "British" literature is increasingly a thing of the past. Seminar assignments will be made on a firstcome/first served basis beginning now and extending to August 1st. Please submit a ranked list of two or three seminars to: Sanford Schwartz Department of English The Pennsylvania State University 116 Burrowes Building University Park, PA 16802-6200 Fax: (814)863-7285 E-Mail: sxs8@psu.edu Once the assignments are completed, each seminar leader will contact the other members of the group and set a precise timetable for the exchange of materials. The general guidelines are as follows: around mid-July, each participant sends a one-page precis to all other participants in the seminar; around the beginning of September, each participant sends his or her essay to all other participants. Panels The program committee welcomes proposals for panels, though only a limited number can be accepted. The committee is especially interested in interdisciplinary topics. Please include the following: your name, session title, professional affiliation, mailing address, phone number, fax, and e-mail address, the names and affiliations of the other members of your session, a 250-word abstract on the topic of the proposed session. Send proposals postmarked, faxed, or E-mailed by June 1st to: Sanford Schwartz Department of English The Pennsylvania State University 116 Burrowes Building University Park, PA 16802-6200 Fax: (814)863-7285 E-Mail: sxs8@psu.edu The program committee will notify those who have submitted proposals by June 30th. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 19:31:07 -0500 Reply-To: BANDREWS@prodigy.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: BETSY ANDREWS Subject: question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Has anyone heard of a women and poetics conference happening at Barnard in April? wondering, betsy ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 16:13:43 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Weiss Subject: Re: of Mothers & Daughters In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" The talk went by pretty fast, even by Marjorie's standards, but I thought that she was in fact taking them to task. I wonder if othersnperceived this differently. At 10:41 AM 3/16/99 -0700, you wrote: >don't you think that these are Perloff's men and she has to protect/project >their dominance or she risks seeing her own writing about them become >irrelevant? > > >forbidden plateau fallen body dojo >4 song st. >nowhere, b.c. V0R1Z0 >canadaddy > > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 22:36:46 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Kevin L. Magee" Subject: Event Note: Transcendental Friend's 1st Anniversary MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 3/16. Dactyl Foundation. 65 Grand St. NY. Why did you come here. To observe a space. What space. Any space. Voices attached to faces. Whose face belongs to what voice. Are you here. What is 'there' to being 'here.' Who is where you are is why you are not here is why I'm here. So there. The effort it takes to hold a face in focus. Whose name does it belong to? Envelope, bookmark. Did that send you? Upend you. I arrived early and well how have you been? Is it possible that a real face might attach to the name here. Names here. Marcella Durand. Duncan Dobbelman. Lisa Jarnot. Heather Ramsdale. Dan Machlin. Henry Gould. Kristen Prevallet. Laird Hunt. Garret Kallenberg. This is an art space. "Did you see the collected prose in two lines?" "There's so much more stuff." "Incredible like prose things going on." "It's not even in the James Laughlin stuff." "He's got a CD." You keep looking for omens. What do you hear. What are you near? I got an invite. It convinced you. A sign. Is this the new city? Show up on bare hope. People keep making poetry, only the faces change. Who is making what up. Invisibility. It's good to go somewhere and wind up there. Hi Kids! Don't talk to them. Marcella Durand: "Nearby are more circuitous routes" (reading "Artery"). Duncan Dobbelman's Gaspard--reading too close to the page--and the Five Fingers: literary-scholastic. Lisa Jarnot: "Thanks Garrett I didn't understand what you said." (You Armadillo). Heather and Garrett's collaborative piece, "Bodies Correlating through some Medium"--wit, charm, but what's the difference between dialogue and counterpoint? Voices set off or slide off one another, presentational, encased, enclosed. Dan Machlin: "a Joseph's coat of outward desire." The line, "I am perpetually okay" draws a laugh from the polite audience. Henry Gould: "Your move, Beatrice." Gould's verbal improv, sound play, parodies folk/country speech rhythms (can you hear anything you make fun of?) Prevallet: Cocteau trans. in next issue. "Birds are our friends." "Marble is very influential." Laird Hunt: old french poem about a horse. Exercises de style. Everyone here has gone to a good school. Sweet, well educated, voices. BiblioPHILIA, not BiblioMANIA. Jarnot's voice had an engine running under it. Maybe Dan Machlin's. Albertine as I was leaving: "I've got feelings too." See you later, maybe. Some poems I respond to in "The Friend": "The Human Face" (Artaud Morpion/Artaud parasite) trans. Jonathan Skinner in issue 2, April 1998, and Skinner's note on "Grace" in issue 3, May 1998; see also Skinner's trans. of a poem by Ghrasim Luca in issue 6, Nov. 1998 (where was Skinner Tuesday night?) see also the "Selected Notes of Robert M. Larsen, ed. Kallenberg and Larsen, in the Rosetta section of issue 6, Nov. 1998. See also Alan Gilbert's note on Marxist linguistics in I forget which issue. Class is a language. There are proto-piracies going on among these pages, along with a whole lotta Lamartine. Gaspard de la nuit? French ponies? peonies? poesis? (In the voice of Rene Gladman): Abuse your class privileges! False translate the French Africans! NOW. KM--NY/Cleveland ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 22:51:12 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maz881@AOL.COM Subject: e-dress wanted 9 antin Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part0_921729072_boundary" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --part0_921729072_boundary Content-ID: <0_921729072@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII In a message dated 3/17/99 5:13:44 AM Hawaiian Standard Time, DROTHSCHILD@penguinputnam.com writes: --part0_921729072_boundary Content-ID: <0_921729072@inet_out.mail.penguinputnam.com.2> Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: inline Return-Path: Received: from rly-yb02.mx.aol.com (rly-yb02.mail.aol.com [172.18.146.2]) by air-yb03.mail.aol.com (v56.26) with SMTP; Wed, 17 Mar 1999 10:13:44 -0500 Received: from ppi-ims-ny3751.penguinputnam.com (ppi-ims-ny3751.penguin.com [204.91.180.2]) by rly-yb02.mx.aol.com (8.8.8/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with ESMTP id KAA21038 for ; Wed, 17 Mar 1999 10:13:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from msxchny4.putnam.com (MSXCHNY4 [167.167.54.200]) by ppi-ims-ny3751.penguinputnam.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2232.9) id HCKSVV6J; Wed, 17 Mar 1999 10:11:15 -0500 Received: by MSXCHNY4 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) id ; Wed, 17 Mar 1999 10:12:35 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Rothschild, Douglas" To: "'Maz881@aol.com'" Subject: RE: POETICS Digest - 15 Mar 1999 to 16 Mar 1999 (#1999-49) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 10:06:03 -0500 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit yea, while we were in SD & antin was way out of fasion with the CFAP (so mike D never talked about antin or what he was up to)....yada, yada..... but the story of the sky poems is in some antin talk that he gave at UCSD. he gets some grant to do this thing & finds this sky writer & antin says that he always wanted to sky write a poem ever since he saw this sky writing as a boy at coney island (or some other beach)...Harold Fox Fabulous Furs...so antin says that he always imagined a fox with great fur....& the sky writing guy in LA (the only one antin found on the coast at the time) says, that was my dad--who sky wrote that. antin describes the sky writing as interesting because the begining of a line would disappear before the end of a line was finished, & though it was not as he imagined it, he found the result to be interesting. (he did it in LA i think). > -----Original Message----- > From: Maz881@aol.com [SMTP:Maz881@aol.com] > Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 1999 3:44 AM > To: drothschild@penguinputnam.com > Subject: Fwd: POETICS Digest - 15 Mar 1999 to 16 Mar 1999 (#1999-49) > > antin did sky poems? > > << Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 23:28:35 +0100 > From: cris cheek > Subject: e-dress wanted > > Anyone here got a working e-dress for David Antin? I'd be much abliged. > Also anybody who saw his 'Sky Poems' I'd be keen to hear about that > experience and if you've got any documentation of the events. > > thanks in advance > > love and love > cris >> > << Message: POETICS Digest - 15 Mar 1999 to 16 Mar 1999 (#1999-49) >> --part0_921729072_boundary-- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 20:34:13 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Kathy Lou Schultz Subject: Re: of Mothers & Daughters MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes, in response to Dodie Bellamy, I have to say it was absolutely fascinating the speed with which this man's question was dismissed. Class peeps out into the open briefly and then BAM! silence. Fascinating and all-too-familiar. I thought Laura Moriarty was trying to point out (correct me if I'm wrong here, Laura) that there are in fact working class and people of color among "us" (experimental poet types). She seemed to be identifying as working class and saying that the evidence of class can therefore be "oneself." I went up to "the man" asking the question afterwards and got his name and address (he's Chris Beach--Hi Chris are you out there?) and he and I had a discussion with Bobbie West about what had happened. They both seemed a bit stunned. Me, I felt "same song different day" playing in my head and saw all of my college experiences passing before my very eyes. I promised to send them both my essay on class and experimental poetries that appeared in the premiere issue of Tripwire (and I will--promise). Yedda Morrison, one of the editors, was extremely supportive in helping me to bring this essay into being. But there is MUCH MORE to be done. Thanks to Dodie for raising the issue here. Kathy Lou Schultz >Interestingly, one guy posed a question to my panel about class--and I was >all ready to speak--finally this could be talked about because it is an >important issue, I feel, one that is denied over and over again--and >somebody besides me and Kathy Lou Schultz thinks so. Laura Moriarity said >that class differences were breaking down--something I disagree with, which >is odd since I usually agree with Laura. But then Carla jumped up and >started yelling at Marjorie and the issue, once again, got swept under the >rug. > >Dodie > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 16:54:47 +1100 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: John Tranter Subject: Let's do the Modernism! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I was interested to note the announcement for the Modernism Conference at Penn State. There's one blindingly significant point about Modernism Then and Now that I bet doesn't get talked about at this Conference, to wit: Of all the thirty or so people who created Modernism (in poetry and prose), not a single one of them ever taught at an American university. They never did it, ever. Off all the thirty or so people discussing Modernism at Penn State, every single one of them makes a living teaching at an American university. They do nothing else, all the time. Hmmm . . . JT from John Tranter, 39 Short Street, Balmain NSW 2041, Sydney, Australia tel (+612) 9555 8502 fax (+612) 9818 8569 Editor, Jacket magazine: http://www.jacket.zip.com.au/welcome.html Homepage: five megabytes of glittering literature, free, at http://www.alm.aust.com/~tranterj/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 13:44:50 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: John Cayley Subject: email address requests Comments: To: british-poets@mailbase.ac.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Can anyone send me - back channel *current* email addresses for: Christian Bok Will Alexander Ronald Fraser Munro Lisa Robertson Thanks in anticipation, John ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 11:05:14 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Administration Subject: Re: Page Mothers & Delinquent Daughters / Russo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit had to reformat this. Chris ----------------- Original message (ID=5A456822) (578 lines) ------------------ From: "Linda Russo" Subject: Re: Page Mothers & Delinquent Daughters Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 10:31:22 -0500 I've been thinking about Rachel's post responding to E. Treadwell's & trying not to disagree with her as I like the serendipity of what she proposes (akin to an idea Rachel you've expressed to me before -- the idea that you do something and if someone else does something as a 'result' of that, that's just something else, something they've done) but i just can't put stock in this kind of separatism -- the way you would separate generations and things generated (poems from people) first, I agree with the troublesome "assignment" of continuing the project of another generation, and to be acused of laziness for not outwardly appearing to carry on the good fight makes at least one narrow assumption: that the fight will take on a guise or method that is similar in its devices and so immediately recognizeable as a continuation. Yes we are doing a different and a next thing, and the problem seems to be that we're not acknowledging where we came from so to speak -- so we're perceived of as having lost some ground. I don't see any problem in asking for evidence that this hasn't indeed happened in the form of 'statements of poetics or positions' that work to clarify one's relationship to advances that have been made -- especially where 'advances' may not be perceived as such under the 'new' methodology, i.e. where certain techniques are rejected as ineffective tools (the victim-centered poetry of the early women's movement, e.g.). Maybe the statement mode right now is sort of dead. No one here I think responded to Rebecca Wolff's "manifesto" posted a while back; though I'll admit that I'm guilty of thinking about it & not being sure how to respond, or not being sure that the list was a fertile place for a response -- though I would very much like this list to be so -- or for this response, an issue I'm working out in response to Joel's most recent post. Nancy Shaw from the Kootenay School of Writing gave an interesting talk on this point last night to a small audience at the Corner Shop here in Buffalo. The talk isn't published, she wrote it for this particular occassion, but what she said is extremely pertinent to this situation. She suggested that the manner in which 'so called Lang poets' related their poetics to the social (namely irony) had played itself out, that their social effectivity was measured on 'modalities of difference' (analogy, constructionism, subjective expression) as articulated in Watten's "Bride of the assembly line" which were to some extent no longer useful for charting developments. This I think may be why we're accused of not doing anything, because we are constructing new modalities as it were. (I find myself suddenly irritated by this 'we' i've been using, as it is simply in this context a generational tag -- Nancy referred to the 'so-called under forties' -- and I don't feel particularly that there is a 'we' that I'm related to (more than peripherally, of incidentally) in any aesthetic sense -- but this might be part of the 'problem' or at least indicative of how different the situation is now then it was 70 years ago when, for example, there wasn't this list to provide one with a sense of poetic kindredness -- a point I'm taking up in my response to Joel). Nancy discussed Sianne Ngai's "Poetics of Disgust" (orig. pub'd in _Open Letter_) as making the sort of moves that Silliman (et al?) had demanded (in Philly Talks) but as being ignored as such, criticized on the basis of it's having been carelessly read. She proposed that a Poetics of Disgust works as a "cultural poetics," a relation of poetics to the social 'in the tradition of' Lang po, but structured with its own, although contingent, ideaology. it is perhaps this sort of connection -- a shift in modalities -- that we are to be on the look out for, and that ought to be written about. reviews can facilitate this if a book is read with the question in mind: how is this doing something differently? How does it compare to this other thing? (and here i'm having a deja vu from talking to Leslie Scalapino about a year ago, about what brought her to the lang po crowd in the first place -- so i can see where it's easy to read her in terms of a dis-connected geneaology, when really her geneaology is just slightly 'other'). And finally what does this difference achieve that the other thing couldn't? That is, if you want to read poems as possible sites of such cultural or political achievement. Nancy does this, and her term for such is "Cultural poetics" (her term I think) is a hybridization of Birmingham School Cultural Studies and Poetics. I found this point confusing, as cultural studies as it is currently being imagined is at once flaggelating itself for its lack of political/social effectivity and reassuring itself that that's ok -- it's just a set of diagnostic devices, and an intellectual and not necessarily a political tool (ut oh -- am i to be accused of saying the intellect isn't a political tool? or are those days over?). I would rather call it a Materialist Poetics (and here again i wave in the direction of the response I'm preparing to Joel's post) This brings me to the other sort of separation you Rachel (via Kevin via Scalapino) would bring about in the name of not falling for parent/hero-worship, not worrying the bridge, etc. Because it seems to me that you would dismiss a sort of personal/communal lineage altogether (a canon even). I don't think Scalapino would advocate this as she'll readily tell you what her lineage is and how important it is to her. >I do take much issue with the nonchalance with which poet-writers >assume heroes, find it necessary to have pet influences and mythical >notions of some person behind the poem- and, if killian's sum was >right-on, i would agree with scalapino, that the cult of the revered >figure is rather in service of obliterating interaction with the writing >and if scalapino, in her argument against immersing oneself in some kind >of lineage, 'makes some abrupt jumps', all the more reason for actually >looking at the writing that she is talking about, no? - is it not about >time that chronology (and the presumed debt to preserve it) cashed in its >chips? - I'd like to hear more about this nonchalance. & what about material rather than mythical notions of persons behind poems? I mean I just can't that gleefully feel like I'm interacting with writing and that's great, and that's IT, because I'm constantly reminded of the material circumstances in which poems are produced (and I may be accussed of generalities here, but i'm referring to the poetry that currently circulatees in and around this list, American poetry usually emmanating from sub/urban areas many of which I have been too) But I wouldn't obliterate that writing-interaction either. Maybe i'm limited by my own condition, my need to be materially located, to feel poems in some way connected to places. I suppose it's intellectually generous of you to read Scalapino's obtuseness as a pointer to some 'originary'(?) sources, as a sort of self-effacement -- "don't sit here trying to figure this out! read stein!" I think scalapino would agree that though we shouldn't focus too much on the self, the self is mired in particular material circumstances to which he/she responds (or she never would have left her Oakland abode to see what all the fuss was -- the fuss for example that turned into Perelman's _Writing/Talks_), and that lineage is part of that circumstance, as is being handed down a certain set of tools and problems to work with or refuse. I don't know what you mean by time cashing in its chips -- is time playing poker and we're the cards, shuffled about, operating only by chance? There's too much intention in poems and the circumstances under which they get circulated to run on that. But I also think that it's not unreasonable to expect that some position-taking be risked or some degree of indebtedness (not to the dealer but to the ante) -- or refusal -- be acknowledged. I also think it's important to 'continue the project' so one doesn't loose too much ground and risk worshipping the Ally McBeal of the new feminism in contemporary poetics. I'm interested in a cultural worker not some mythological/fictional hero -- and the only evidence of that is in the construction of a 'cultural poetics' or otherwise formulated responses to poems and not in the poems themselves -- the reception/reaction of poems are as important as putting them out there. After a veritable proliferation of little magazines that serve the social (and the political perhaps via the sort of networking they make possible) by publishing almost exclusively a lot of poetry I take _tripwire_s conception as a sign that people are ready to start having these sorts of conversations. That's exciting. thanks for tuning in, linda ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 10:35:23 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Linda Russo Subject: Re: question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Women Poets at Barnard presents Where Lyric Tradition Meets Language Poetry: Innovation in Contemporary American Poetry by Women Barnard College, Columbia University, New York City April 8 ­ April 10, 1999 A preliminary schedule for the Barnard conference in April is posted at http://www.zip.com.au/~jtranter/jacket06/barnard.html >Has anyone heard of a women and poetics conference happening at Barnard in >April? > >wondering, betsy > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 11:15:27 -0500 Reply-To: CLAITY@drew.edu Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Cassandra Laity Subject: Modernism and American Us' MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Date: 18-Mar-1999 11:06am EDT From: Laity, Cassandra CLAITY Dept: FAC/STAFF Tel No: 3141 TO: Remote Addressee ( _in%poetics@listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu ) Subject: Modernism and American Us' Dear John Tranter and Others, I won't entirely dispute the implications of your posting on modernism and the American University. But I would like to refer you to Gail McDonald's wonderful book, _Learning to be Modern: Pound, Eliot and the American University- (Oxford, 1993) in which she explores American educational history as a context for what Pound and Eliot learned in Universities, how the poets needed universities, and how universities needed them. "Rewriting the syllabus of exemplary writers [Eliot did], revising the rules of poetic decorum, and proposing new standards for the study of poetry, Pound and Eliot emulated and contributed to the American academy's reformation of its mission and curriculum as it evolved from nineteenth-century religious college to twentieth-century research university" (McDonald, vii). We would be honored if you would sign up for our seminar on Modernism and pedagogy run by Mcdonald at the "New Modernisms" conference. There will be several poets there as well--Alicia Ostriker, Rachel Blau DuPlessis and others. Cassandra Laity _MSA_ Program Committee ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 11:58:59 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group Comments: RFC822 error: MESSAGE-ID field duplicated. Last occurrence was retained. From: Brian Lennon Subject: Re: Let's do the Modernism! In-Reply-To: <4.1.19990318165100.00957e00@pop3.zipworld.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" In response to John Tranter's observation on the Penn State Modernism conference: I admit that my own ambivalence about academic life, and its deadening effects, is gratified by this riposte. And yet: would we rather have no Modernism conference than one conducted by (American) pro scholars? I certainly can't say with any authority that the situation of literary artists inside and outside the American university is any different than it was at the time of historical modernism, but common sense would suggest it be so. To suggest, furthermore, that any academic is *not* profoundly ambivalent about her or his occupation seems unrealistic at the least. However, JT's response was intended as wit. Perhaps I'm responding off-mode. At 04:54 PM 3/18/99 +1100, John Tranter wrote: >I was interested to note the announcement for the Modernism Conference at >Penn State. > >There's one blindingly significant point about Modernism Then and Now that >I bet doesn't get talked about at this Conference, to wit: > >Of all the thirty or so people who created Modernism (in poetry and prose), >not a single one of them ever taught at an American university. They never >did it, ever. > >Off all the thirty or so people discussing Modernism at Penn State, every >single one of them makes a living teaching at an American university. They >do nothing else, all the time. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 11:13:49 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Christopher Reiner Subject: L.A. Books reading this Sunday In-Reply-To: <2632112956.921755114@ubppp-246-018.ppp-net.buffalo.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII (Academy what? Awards? Never heard of 'em...but lemme tell you about this reading...) SUNDAY, MARCH 21, 1999 Poets Eleni Sikelianos (New York City) and Robert Crosson (Los Angeles) read from their work at Cafe Balcony, 12431 Rochester Avenue, Los Angeles. 4:00 p.m., (310) 444-7790. Part of the L.A. Books reading series. $ 5 donation goes directly to readers. ABOUT THE READERS: Eleni Sikelianos has published several books and chapbooks of poetry, including The Book of Tendons, and, most recently The Lover's Numbers. She is the recipient of an NEA fellowship in poetry, and two Gertrude Stein Awards. She lives in New York City, where she works at St. Mark's Poetry Project and Teachers & Writers Collaborative. Robert Crosson's many books of poetry include the long poem Geographies, and, most recently, a poetry chapbook In the .thers of the Amazon. Crosson's work is included in the Los Angeles anthologies Poetry Loves Poetry and L.A. Exiles. In 1989, he was awarded a poetry fellowship by the California Arts Council. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 15:14:08 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maria Damon Subject: Re: Let's do the Modernism! In-Reply-To: <4.1.19990318165100.00957e00@pop3.zipworld.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 4:54 PM +1100 3/18/99, John Tranter wrote: >... >Of all the thirty or so people who created Modernism (in poetry and prose), >not a single one of them ever taught at an American university. They never >did it, ever. > the idea that modernism was created by 30 people is, i thought, the very idea that new modernist studies is intended to put to rest. if this conference ends up being one more roster of Lives and Works of the Greats, what's the point? ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 09:56:30 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Administration Subject: Michael Basinski performance MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mark Peters asked me to forward this. To anyone coming through the Buffalo area next week, I highly recommend it. Chris ----- From: "Mark Peters" Date: 3/18/99, 1:24 PM +0000 Announcing: Poetry and Sound Poetry Performance Michael Basinski (and friends) Tuesday Night March 23rd at 7:30 at Hallwalls 2495 Main Street, Buffalo NY If you aren't familiar with Basinski's incredible work, some of it is on the web at his EPC author page: (http://writing.upenn.edu/epc/authors/basinski) There are also some great pieces at the Light and Dust site (which you can get to through the books section of the EPC) and at my magazine, Deluxe Rubber Chicken, also available through the EPC. Anyone who saw Basinski's performance a few semesters ago, or any of his readings for that matter, knows this reading should not be missed. Don't say I didn't warn you! This reading is part of the Deluxe Rubber Reading Series Mark Peters ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 11:33:39 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Christopher M Devenney Subject: Re: of Mothers & Daughters In-Reply-To: <01be70f8$93091980$06c0480c@one> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I've been following this "thread" with some interest over the last week or so, and I would like to make one small contribution to this nascent discussion concerning the issue of "class." While I was not at the conference (Buffalo to San Diego requires more dollars than I have or can find), as I read the various comments and hear that the question of class was raised--"what about class?"--I'm reminded of a series of "what about" questions that have pervaded various discussions--academic and non--over the last decade or so. The interesting thing about the "what about" question is that it tends toward implosion, pulling everyone and everything into its center, though it is a center more often than not that functions uncritically, tending to stand on a "moral" ground rather than upon anything that makes "sense." So "what about class?" Yes, indeed, as indelicate, and possibly polemical as this may come across (not my intention), what about it? Wittgenstein once wrote: "A philosopher says that he understands the sentence 'I am here,' that he means something by it, thinks something--even when he doesn't think at all how, on what occasions, this sentence is used. And if I say 'A rose is red in the dark too' you positively see this red in the dark before you." Is there an analogy to be made here between "a rose is red in the dark" and the red we positively see, fantastically, in the dark, and the shearing question "what about class," or am I just grossly misunderstanding? Still, I cannot seem to get past the circularity of the question, the unstated assumption that we indeed all *know* what 'x' is: "Imagine someone saying: 'But I know how tall I am!' and laying his hand on top of his head to prove it." Chris Devenney ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 21:18:19 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Karen McKevitt Subject: Under Flag Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain As many of you probably already know, Kelsey St. Press has re-printed Myung Mi Kim's _Under Flag_. (So now everyone will be able to purchase it from SPD!) But I also wanted to let all of you teachers know that if you are interested in teaching the book, or want more information, please contact Kelsey St. Press by responding to kelseyst@sirius.com, or you may e-mail me at editit@hotmail.com. Karen McKevitt Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 21:57:09 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Kathy Lou Schultz Subject: Class & poetics Comments: cc: yedd@aol.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've gotten several backchannel requests for copies of my essay on class & poetics entitled "Talking Trash, Talking Class: What's a Working Class Poetic, and Where Would I Find One?" I sincerely appreicate the interest in this topic. The essay appeared in Tripwire: A Journal of Poetics No. 1, which is edited by Yedda Morrison and David Buuck. If you are able, it would be great to support the editors of this wonderful journal. The magazine is available from Small Press Distribution in Berkeley, Calif. (www.spdbooks.org) and has a cover price of $6. If you are having trouble getting the magazine, let me know and I can send you a copy of the essay. Thank you, Kathy Lou Schultz kathylou@worldnet.att.net ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 09:42:32 +0200 Reply-To: robert.archambeau@englund.lu.se Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Robert Archambeau Organization: Lunds universitet Subject: Irish Experimental Poetry Online MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Steve Tomasula of The Notre Dame Review has set up an online supplement including poems by Catherine Walsh, Trevor Joyce, Maurice Scully, Randolph Healy and Geoffrey Squires. The site also features short bios of the poets and an interview I did with Randoph Healy. The URL is: http://www.nd.edu/~ndr/issues/ndr7/ndr7.html My two-part article on these poets is also online now -- click the "back issues" button and go to the reviews sections of issues 4 and 5. Robert Archambeau Lunds Universitet, Sweden ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 10:06:24 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Administration Subject: gender & class / Tremblay-McGaw MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit this message came to the admin account instead of the listserv. Chris ----- From: "R. Tremblay-McGaw" Date: 3/18/99, 12:33 PM -0800 Hello All, Just a brief collection of notes in response to list comments on class and gender issues. I weigh in with Elizabeth Treadwell, agreeing that for me, gender concerns aren't really separate from my poetics. And gender issues also so tied up with issues of race and class and sexuality. nearly inextricable. and that brings me to the class issue. I have struggled with how to incorporate class issues in my own work in a formally interesting way without coming off as banal, this particularly difficult in poetry. I think both Dodie and Kathy Lou Schultz manage to address class in a challenging and interesting variety of ways in their work, Dodie in the Mina Letters and Kathy Lou in her Genealogy piece (part of which, I believe, is in Idiom online). Kathy Lou and I have been at work on a collaborative piece that deals with issue of gender and language and in its own way, class. or maybe in addition what I mean to say is that there are certain class issues on which the creation of the work is predicated. the notion of stolen time--much of the work written while we're at our jobs, in between the cracks. a little notation about reading the fabulous Figuring the Word by Johanna Drucker. Struck by her discussion of how certain of her books came into being, articulating events from her "personal" life and how they shaped/informed her experiments with language/text/the book. I was also struck by the sheer amount of time required to set the type for some of these works and the apparent time available to her for investigation and experiment. Time and its relation to class. to production/enquiry/visibility. Hard not to feel a sense of rage, envy, lust and so on. My job calls so that's all for now. oh--and next issue of tripwire is on gender issues. looking forward to that. Robin Tremblay-McGaw ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 10:08:44 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Administration Subject: orality and the avant-garde? / Kane MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This msg came to the admin account instead of the listserv. Questions on the difference between these addresses can be sent to me here at . Chris ----- From: "Daniel Kane" Date: 3/18/99, 5:50 PM -0500 In Charles Bernstein's _Close Listening_, Johanna Drucker has noted in her essay "Visual Performance of the Poetic Text": "the aesthetic arenas in which visual experimentation takes on a developed form in the first half of the century include Italian Futurism, Russian Futurism, German and Swiss Dada, English Vorticism, Dutch De Stijl, Anglo-American modernism, and, to a lesser degree, French modern poetry and visual arts associated with Cubism and then Surrealism. In other words, there was a visual component to almost every area of modern poetry" (132). Clearly, these movements in many cases played with or eliminated what most people would call conventional typography. What I'm interested in (since I'm at work on a project tracing the history of Lower East Side poetics and poetry reading series) is whether there is a link between typographical experimentalism and orality/real time performativity. That is, can one say that the movements Ms. Drucker lists were also partially characterized by their often rambunctious presentation of their works in performance? Does typographical experimentalism especially invite utterance, performance in some way? If anyone could provide me with an example or two (or a book that might say it all) of these movement's propensity for performance (especially as that performance relates to the way the text is built), I'd greatly appreciate it. You can backchannel me at djk5474@is2.nyu.edu --daniel ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 12:33:08 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Charles Bernstein Subject: Barnard Conference Schedule (fwd) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Women Poets at Barnard presents Where Lyric Tradition Meets Language Poetry: Innovation in Contemporary American Poetry by Women April 8 =AD 10, 1999 The Poetry Conference, =93Where Lyric Tradition Meets Language Poetry: Innovation in Contemporary American Poetry by Women=94, is sponsored in part by The Barnard Women Poets Series, which for thirteen years has hosted free, public readings at Barnard by established and emerging women poets. Through these poets=92 varied voices and styles, we have hoped to broaden and challenge our audiences=92 visions of poetry=92s range and effects. In addition to our readings, the series publishes a first collection from a new woman poet each year. Booklist described Women Poets at Barnard as =93The best series currently introducing new writers to the public.=94 This event is co-sponsored by The Academy of American Poets, The Poetry Society of America, and Poets & Writers Inc. and is funded in part by The Axe-Houghton Foundation and The Lannan Foundation. THURSDAY, APRIL 8 CONFERENCE KICK-OFF EVENT EVENING READING: 8:00 PM =AD 10:00 PM Barbara Guest Jorie Graham Introduced by Susan Wheeler RECEPTION TO FOLLOW FRIDAY, APRIL 9 REGISTRATION, MORNING COFFEE & BOOK SALES: 8:30 AM =AD 9:00 AM PANEL I: 9:00 AM =AD 10:00 AM Session 1 On Jorie Graham 1. Brian Henry, =93The Will to Change: Style and Stylistic Achievement in Graham=92s Poetry=94 2. Jennifer Lewin, =93Graham=92s Philosophy of Language=94 3. Andrew Osborn, =93The Push of Reading in Graham=92s =91On Difficulty=92= =94 Session 2 On Barbara Guest 1. Terrence Diggory, =93Barbara Guest and the Mother of Beauty=94 2. Anna Rabinowitz, =93Notes Toward Painterly Osmosis=94 3. Marjorie Welish, =93On Barbara Guest=94 Session 3 Opening a Community: Women Writers at the Poetry Project 1. Brenda Coultas, =93Feminist Voices from the Project 1966-76=94 2. Marcella Durand, =93Publishing the Community: Women=92s Publications=94 3. Kimberly Lyons, =93A Retrospective of Experimental Women=92s Writing=94 4. Prageeta Sharma, =93Notions of Ethnicity: Creating a Poetic Community=94 5. Eleni Sikelianos, =93Memory & Ascent: Mayer, Notley and Waldman=94 PANEL II: 10:15 AM =AD 11:15 AM Session 4 On Lucie Brock-Broido=92s The Master Letters 1. Stephen Burt, =93The Selves of The Master Letters=94 2. Eric LeMay, =93The Master Letters and The Master Letters=94 3. Stephen Massimilia, =93On the Language of Catastrophe and Transfiguration=94 Session 5 On Language Theory 1. Calvin Bedient, =93Leslie Scalapino=92s Aesthetic Theory=94 2. Bob Perelman, =93Rae Armantrout, the Objectivists and Imagism=94 3. Joshua Weiner, =93McHugh: Another Kind of =91Language=92 Writing=94 Session 6 On Brenda Hillman=92s Loose Sugar 1. Susan McCabe, =93Alchemies of Synthesis=94 2. Lisa Sewell, =93Memory, Development and Women=92s Time=94 Panel III: 11:30 PM =AD 12:30 PM Session 7 On Alice Notley 1. Kimberly Lamm, =93Flexibly Authentic Identities in Notley=92s Love Poetry=94 2. Heather Thomas, =93Notley=92s Epic =91Beginning Again=92=94 Session 8 On Quilts, Postscripts and Jokes 1. Logan Esdale, =93Postscripted Poetry=94 2. Jennifer Luongo, =93Quilting the Multiplicity of Voice: Mullen=92s Muse and Drudge=94 3. Susan Wheeler, =93Gravity No Stretch For The Zip Wit of Rae=94 Session 9 On =93Poetics of Production=94 1. Caroline Crumpacker, =93Female Publishers in the 1920s and 1930s=94 2. Rebecca Wolff, =93Female Publishers in the 1920s and 1030s=94 3. Linda Russo, =93Production Between Populist Feminist Poetics & the Avant-Garde=94 LUNCH: 12:30 PM =AD 2:45 PM ROUNDTABLE DISCUSSION: 3:00 PM =AD 5:00 PM Rae Armantrout, Lucie Brock-Broido, Jorie Graham, Barbara Guest, Lyn Hejinian, Brenda Hillman, Ann Lauterbach, Harryette Mullen BREAK: 5:00 PM =AD 8:00 PM EVENING READING: 8:00 PM=AD 10:00 PM Lucie Brock-Broido Brenda Hillman Ann Lauterbach Introduced by Lee Ann Brown RECEPTION TO FOLLOW SATURDAY, APRIL 10 REGISTRATION, MORNING COFFEE AND BOOK SALES: 8:30 AM =AD 9:00 AM PANEL I: 9:00 AM =AD 10:30 AM Session 1 On Harryette Mullen 1. Kathy Crown, =93Feminist Epistemology and the Poetry of Mullen=94 2. Allison Cummings, =93Public Subjects: Ideas of Audience in the Poetry of Brooks, Hunt, and Mullen=94 3. Elizabeth Frost, =93Mullen and Traditions of the Avant-Garde=94 4. Cynthia Hogue, =93Mullen and the Poetics of Black Female Experience=94 Session 2 Epistolarity and Experimentation: The Letter as Fact and Fiction in Innovative Writing By Women 1. Lee Ann Brown, =93Alphabet Bernadette=94 2. Stephen Cope, =93Mayer=92s The Desires of Mothers to Please Others in Letters=94 3. Kate Fagan, =93Hejinian and Robinson=92s Letter-Poems=94 4. Chris Stroffolino, =93The Mayer/Riding Jackson Correspondence=94 Session 3 On Susan Howe 1. Elisabeth Joyce, =93Howe=92s Orienteering Guide to the Adirondacks=94 2. Jeffrey Jullich, =93A Vertical Reading of Howe=92s Invisible Angel=94 3. Jean Schulte, =93Howe=92s =91A Bibliography of the King=92s Book, or= Eikon Basilike=92 and =91Poe(t)heory=92=94 4. Lara Trubowitz, =93Antinomian Controversies as a Principle of Poetry=94 PANEL II: 10:45AM -11:45 AM Session 4 Forms of Affect and Memory in the Poetry of Hejinian and Berssenbrugge, or, What Language Remembers of Itself 1. Charles Altieri, =93Intimacy and Experiment in Berssenbrugge=94 2. Craig Dworkin, =93Paranoia as Literary Methodology=94 3. Linda Voris, =93The Shape of Memory in Berssenbrugge=92s Poetry=94 Session 5 On Publishing Anthologies 1. Anne Finch, =93On Editing A Formal Feeling Comes=94 2. Alan Golding, =93Poems for the Millenium and Rothenberg as Editor=94 3. Mary Margaret Sloan, =93Poetics and Publication History of Selected North American Women Writers Since 1970=94 Session 6 On Barbara Guest 1. Catherine Kasper, =93Determinable Music: Guest=92s Poetry=94 2. Sara Lundquist, =93Guest=92s Stripped Tales: Narrative and the Experimental Poet=94 3. Robert Mueller, =93Poetics and Language in the Work of Guest=94 PANEL III: 12:00 PM =AD 1:00 PM Session 7 Textualities of Race and Gender 1. Cara Cilano, =93Gender, Race, Time, and Space in M. Nourbese Philip=92s Looking for Livingstone: An Odyssey in Silence=94 2. Linda A. Kinnahan, =93Economies of Race and Gender in the Visual / Verbal Collaborative Clash of Hunt=92s Arcade=94 3. Elizabeth Rich, =93Searching the Black Hills for Lost Histories in Weiner=92s Spoke=94 Session 8 Multivocal Poetics 1. Mary Jo Bang, =93The New Elliptical=94 2. Camille Martin, =93Kristeva and Weiner: A Poetics of the Multivocal Semiotic=94 3. Ira Sadoff, =93Blurring the Boundaries Between Experimental and Representational Poetries=94 LUNCH: 1:00 PM =AD 2:30 PM Conversation with Charles Bernstein and Lyn Hejinian KEYNOTE ADDRESS, ROUNDTABLE & RESPONSE: 2:45 PM =AD 5:00 PM Marjorie Perloff, =93After Language Poetry: Theory and the Question of Transparency=94 Calvin Bedient Rachel Blau DuPlessis Lynn Keller RECEPTION: 5:30 PM - 7:00 PM EVENING READING: 7:00 PM - 9:00 PM Rae Armantrout Lyn Hejinian Harryette Mullen Introduced by Jena Osman (Program is subject to change.) WITH APPRECIATION The organizers of the conference, Allison Cummings and Claudia Rankine would like to thank the following organizations for their invaluable support: The Academy of American Poets The Axe-Houghton Foundation The Lannan Foundation The Poetry Society of America Poets & Writers Inc. Registration Form Please print or type This form may be duplicated for additional enrollments. Mail to the following address on or before March 30, 1999: Tiffany Dugan, Poetry Conference Coordinator Barnard College, 3009 Broadway New York, NY 10027-6598 Forms may also be faxed to (212) 854-5845. ___________________________________________ Name ___________________________________________ Address ___________________________________________ City/State/Zip ___________________________________________ Telephone (with area code) ___________________________________________ E-Mail ___________________________________________ Institutional Affiliation (if applicable) Please circle the sessions you plan to attend: April 9 Panel I Session 1 or Session 2 or Session 3 Panel II Session 4 or Session 5 or Session 6 Panel III Session 7 or Session 8 or Session 9 April 10 Panel I Session 1 or Session 2 or Session 3 Panel II Session 4 or Session 5 or Session 6 Panel III Session 7 or Session 8 Conference Fees: April 9 ___ Pre-registration $20 ___ Student with ID $12 ___ Barnard Faculty & Staff $12 ___ Lunch $15 April 10 ___ Pre-registration $20 ___ Student with ID $12 ___ Barnard Faculty & Staff $12 ___ Lunch $15 Enclosed is a check for $__________________ made payable to Barnard College. Walk-in Registration is $25 for each day of the conference. Lunch is by pre-registration only. Please send information regarding: ___ Travel ___ Hotels ___ Parking General Information Registration: Enrollment for the conference is limited and will be conducted on a first-come, first-served basis. Registration forms should be mailed to be received by March 30, 1999. Walk-in Registration will take place on Friday, April 9 and Saturday, April 10, in the Barnard Hall Lobby, located at Broadway and 117th Street. Your cancelled check will serve as your receipt and registration acknowledgement. No confirmation of your registration will be sent. Lunch will be provided for conference participants at an additional charge of $15 for Friday or Saturday, $30 for both days. Please indicate on the registration form if you wish to order lunch. A list of local restaurants will be provided in your registration packet. Lunch is by pre-registration only. Fee: The fee for the two day conference is $40, ($20 per day). Walk-in Registration is $50, ($25 for each day). There is a special two day rate of $24 for students with ID, Barnard Faculty and Staff ($12 for each day). The fee includes refreshments, but does not include lunch. Cancellations: For individuals who pre-register, cancellations will be accepted until April 5. The balance will be refunded, less a $5 processing fee. Individuals wishing to cancel after April 5 will forfeit the entire conference fee. Questions: If you have any questions regarding registration, hotel accommodations, or any special needs you wish to discuss, please contact Tiffany Dugan at (212) 854-8021 or E-mail tdugan@barnard.columbia.edu. Although there is no parking available at the College, information on parking in the vicinity is available upon request. Barnard College is wheelchair accessible. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 10:30:59 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Prejsnar Subject: gender class poetics poetry MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII One way of looking at the political dimension, is to realize that socialist concerns, feminist concerns, historical edges, may sometimes become part of the work because they are integrated into the poet's mind and activities, and ongoing personal focus..... For instance Susan Howe seems to have developed a response to these dimensions, purely out of the intricate dance of her mind around themes of historical violence and tension that jabbed at her personally. The poetics underlying her work is very complex--i don't mean to suggest otherwise. But some of the most interesting political poets have responded to the social/political level, by simply letting their own interests, concerns, despairs, play thru the fabric of the writing they are doing. Some poets grow this sense of connectedness out of being activists. Some like Howe out of a fierce and personal immersion in historical data. (i myself have never felt a tension between an interesting formal approach and an awareness of class, gender and other weights... They seem naturally related....) Even some of the post-1970 generation who are thought of as theoretical language-oriented writers eventually come to a flow where the formal impetus and the political passion feel to be of a single push. (i'm thinking for instance of two Perelman books, favorites of mine: Face Value and First World.) This is a not to say that there aren't poetics theories that address important concerns here (the shape and movement of form against social contradiction as thought out by Brecht, Silliman, Bernstein, McCaffery, have been important to me) But poetix ideas threaten in the current climate to take on a weight that i find a little disquieting. To some extent politics in the world precedes politics in the word-processor. The activist sensibility of the political person is a substratum for the politix of the working poet. mark prejsnar ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 11:32:49 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: RaeA100900@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Class & poetics Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I think my girlhood memoir, TRUE (Atelos Books), can be read as being about class - by the way. Rae Armantrout ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 08:49:30 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: MAXINE CHERNOFF Subject: Re: Class & poetics In-Reply-To: <01be71cd$544699e0$1d40480c@one> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Two issues on social class: May/June 1985: "The Reader's Egotism" in AMERICAN BOOK REVIEW and in Po Prject Newsletter #140, Feb/March 1991, "Social Class and the Writer's Identity," Paul Hoover argues that the reader seeks reassurance in texts of the rightness of his/her views and social position. On Thu, 18 Mar 1999, Kathy Lou Schultz wrote: > I've gotten several backchannel requests for copies of my essay on class & > poetics entitled "Talking Trash, Talking Class: What's a Working Class > Poetic, and Where Would I Find One?" I sincerely appreicate the interest in > this topic. The essay appeared in Tripwire: A Journal of Poetics No. 1, > which is edited by Yedda Morrison and David Buuck. If you are able, it would > be great to support the editors of this wonderful journal. The magazine is > available from Small Press Distribution in Berkeley, Calif. > (www.spdbooks.org) and has a cover price of $6. If you are having trouble > getting the magazine, let me know and I can send you a copy of the essay. > Thank you, > Kathy Lou Schultz > kathylou@worldnet.att.net > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 09:07:46 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: james perez Subject: Re: Let's do the Modernism! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain JT said: >>There's one blindingly significant point about Modernism Then and Now that I bet doesn't get talked about at this Conference, to wit: >>Of all the thirty or so people who created Modernism (in poetry and prose), not a single one of them ever taught at an American university. They never did it, ever. >>Of all the thirty or so people discussing Modernism at Penn State, every single one of them makes a living teaching at an American university. They do nothing else, all the time. getting poetics in digest form, it was very interesting that this message came after KLS's post on class issues and so I'm thinking of both at once... one thing that's always been interesting to me about reading Stein (esp. How To Write...) is that I can feel that she never worked retail in her life or waited tables or whatever (don't know this for a fact, not a stein scholar), and what did Eliot ever do? Artists that teach v. class of artists of yore I think is a very interesting topic to dig into. What does it mean to be a trust fund/landed nobility artist v. a college-educated "bohemian" v. an out-and-out homeless artist (stein v. stevens/williams; byron v. keats; marlowe v. shakespeare; whitman v. dickenson; sorry I know this is neither litigation nor boxing, though I think the stein/w.c.williams bout would be a good one)? the question nobody seems to ever want to answer about there art: what is it for?: it's going to pay for my kids' college, it's going to get me out of the projects, it's going to save humanity/create a better world, I don't know I was bored and passing time, I'm going to prove I'm smarter/better/more educated/cooler than my dad/my brother/my mom/him/her/you I think some of these are luxuries that we all can't afford, others can...but all seem to have an intrinsic effect on our resulting poetics. I don't really know where I'm going with this, but I think it is important to what we think of our fellow poets/artists and what prejudices we may form against those that do "sell out" or put there poetry on billboards/subways or read at inaugural events. I'll go back to lurking now, jamie.p Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 10:32:28 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Elizabeth Treadwell Subject: Page Daughters & the Microwaveable Feast Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi all, I am laughing in response to John Tranter's note about the Modernists never having TAUGHT, and the Panelists only having taught, and somehow it seems hooked up with these conversations about Mothers and Daughters. Hey, Ally McBeal, fictional as she is, is a cultural worker, Linda! A cultural broker? I think part of the problem is that I feel still quite young as a poet, perhaps I do not understand my poetics and influences and 'points' NOW as I will THEN. This is certain, no? But one problem with the definition of this, 'my', generation, X, NEXT, Diet Coke, whatever, is that we are in the long and often quite voluble, dreary, and bossy shadow of the BABY BOOM. (I am also influenced by my material (girl) conditions in this tyedied collegiate burg to feel so.) In this shadow, which also contains many a glimmer and salvation, especially for a girl, left there by your mother's awkward, glorious footsteps, it is often hard to find a mirror in which to see the light of one's own self. Especially when those who left said footprints and leaflets and napalm are shining a flashlight through the typeface of Time magazine into your eyes to see if you appreciate them & all they've done for you. Kathy Lou points out that there are people of color and working class people among us (us = The Microwaveable Feast?), & so then there are also young bratty people just pulling their brass tacks together too. And if US can include an even longer and wider history, all the better. What about Grandma and Gramps and your freaky 2nd cousins? Its mysterious in here, do you know who your influences are? What was R Wolff's manifesto? Don't trust anyone over/under 30/40 ET "Yet no one can extinguish 'oneself' , in the sense of being weighted by traditions, to see the real, which is only the present." -Leslie Scalapino, _Objects in the Terrifying Tense/Longing from Taking Place_, Roof, 1993 Outlet Magazine -&- Double Lucy Books P.O. Box 9013, Berkeley, California 94709 U.S.A. http://users.lanminds.com/~dblelucy ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 14:53:48 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetry Project Subject: this week's news Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" The Tiny Press Center at http://www.poetryproject.com has been REORGANIZED with a convenient new "click and point" option that allows you to go directly to the place in which you are interested. Also new: Elizabeth Treadwell of Double Lucy Books/Outlet Magazine gives us her thoughts on publishing. And also also, there are lots of new entries on chapbooks, broadsides, magazines. Thank you everybody for sending such great materials in! Snaps/graphics/pictures are not far behind... And this week: Nick Tosches has cancelled for tonight, Friday, March 19, 10:30 pm (we know you got this once before, but nobody wants surprises, right?) to be replaced by Jonathan Berger and Debbie Branch. Monday is Hoa Nguyen & Dale Smith (check out "Skanky Possum" in the Tiny Press Center!) in from out there Austin, Texas at 8 pm Wednesday is Jocelyn Saidenberg & Ann Lauterbach at 8 pm Jocelyn has a fantastic poem ("seance") in the Poets & Poems archives at the Poetry Project website. Friday is Inappropriate Behavior with Legs McNeil & Gillian McCain at 10:30 pm and then it's April with readings by Philip Lamantia (a very rare thing), Anne Waldman, Victor Hernandez Cruz, Nicole Brossard rescheduled, and a tree dedication/book party for Allen Ginsberg. Not the cruelest month after all. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 09:16:12 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: John Cayley Subject: email address request - 2 Comments: To: british-poets@mailbase.ac.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sorry about this, but here's another email address request: Can anyone send me - back channel *current* email addresses for: Walter Kew? Thanks in anticipation, John ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 17:46:28 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: schuchat Subject: Re: Let's do the Modernism! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John Tranter and others -- did Ford Madox Ford have any role in creating Modernism? I mean, is he one of the "30" cited? Since he did, after all, teach at an American university (well, college -- Olivet College was the name of the place, as I recall). Stein's series of lectures at Chicago and elsewhere in America were the functional equivalent of a year (okay, at least a semester) as a guest professor. Is she one of the 30 creators? Is Pound one of the 30? Until they fired him for letting a dancer friend sleep over, he taught at an American institution of higher learning. I hold no brief for academics, am not one myself, and hate to spoil a good sound bite, but wonder thus in the interests of accuracy. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 21:35:48 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "A. Jenn Sondheim" Subject: Re: Poets in Residence (fwd) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII (This was a brief interview by Peter Evans for a paper, on the trAce vir- tual writing residency coming up in September. It may be of interest here; I received permission to forward. Alan.) On Wed, 17 Mar 1999, Peter L.Evans wrote: > The questions are: > > Why did you choose to do this residency on the internet? I do almost all my writing on the Net - I literally make my texts with the emacs or pico editors online. For me, working with avant-garde and philo- sophical/experimental issues, there is an audience; the kind of work I do is rarely published offline. I also love the surprise of working online through conferencing and email - as well as the incredibly wide demographics and international contacts. And then it depends on what's meant by writing - I also do graphics, video, use perl programming online, and so forth. The environment is amazingly rich and active/activated. And of course all of this brings cross-fertilizations, Deleuze/Guattari's 'rhizomatic' creativities on a world-wide scale. > What are your aims and what do you see as the possible outcomes? > With the residency? Introducing experimental work, examining the possibility of community/communal writing, and running workshops which might involve post-structuralist/postmodernist thought. Pushing writing from the older 'writing-degree-zero' to at least the binary, if not the transfinite, dimension. > What advantages do you see to working on the internet? > Audience and performativitiy (programming, using MOOs and MUDs and talkers etc.). Or do you mean working with students? You're unclear here. If the latter, then the ability to work one on one, looking at the text and not at the writer, suggesting other resources no farther away than a URL. Also, in relation to texts - the ability to close-read and intersperse comments. One disadvantage may be the time necessary to reply, simply because of the labor of typing. > Were you able to set your own 'agenda' for the residency? The agenda's not set yet, but I would say yes, although I would do this in conjunction with past residencies - it's useless if it doesn't work. I hope the agenda ultimately is somewhat dialectical, in other words. > > Do you see your work as being primarily education, or promotion of poetry, > or as poetry mentor, or something else? Again, I assume now you mean my residency? I look on my "work" as my artistic output. I'd say in relation to the residency, all three of the above, as well as learning myself, from others, thinking through the possibilities of language on the Internet, the future of language in general, new modalities of communition. What happens when prosthetics are the order of the day, when there are no more masterpieces, when information overload requires information manage- ment, when it's no longer possibile to 'know oneself,' and so forth. > > Will there be objective evaluation of the work being done? What is "objective evaluation" of work in general? I'm not sure what you mean. I certainly hope and expect the staff of trAce to take an interest in all of this and if I stray 'out of line,' to say something. And of course the work will be in the process of continuous evaluation - perhaps a kind of evaluation 'without standards.' > > How will you judge the success of the residency? > By a lot of things - whether or not other participants remain; the quality and quantity of their participation; the quality of the work developing; whether other participants feel they're benefiting. > How do you see your own writing developing? Always developing. I deal with the metaphysics and phenomenologies of languages, including programming languages, scripting, etc. In terms directly related to the residence, on one hand - probably very little effect - and on the other - probably a great deal in terms of what may emerge from community. Yours, Alan > > Thank you for your time. > > Best Regards > > Peter Evans > ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 11:48:46 +1100 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: John Tranter Subject: Free Nathaniel Tarn reading in London UK on 19 April Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Poetry Reading: SCANDALS IN THE HOUSE OF BIRDS A Reading and Talk by NATHANIEL TARN April 19th, Monday, at 6.30pm at King's College London in the Council Room Entrance is free. All are welcome. SCANDALS IN THE HOUSE OF BIRDS is the title of Nathaniel Tarn's latest book, an extraordinary 'experimental' ethnography based on many years of work in Guatemala. The first chapter of this book (and other material by Tarn) is featured in the latest issue of Jacket magazine, at this URL: http://www.jacket.zip.com.au/jacket06/index06.html Tarn will be reading from the book, discussing it and his recent work and also reading some of his recent poetry. Contact - Shamoon Zamir, email to Department of English, King's College London, Strand, London WC2R 2LS, UK Phone: (0)171 873 2551 Fax: (0)171 873 2257 ------------------------------------------------------------- I understand that you may not wish to receive these notices from Jacket magazine. If so, please reply to this email to that effect, and I'll take your name off the mailing list pronto. [ J.T. ] from John Tranter, 39 Short Street, Balmain NSW 2041, Sydney, Australia tel (+612) 9555 8502 fax (+612) 9818 8569 Editor, Jacket magazine: http://www.jacket.zip.com.au/welcome.html Homepage: five megabytes of glittering literature, free, at http://www.alm.aust.com/~tranterj/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 07:21:52 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Burt Hatlen Organization: University of Maine Subject: Re: POETICS Digest - 16 Mar 1999 to 17 Mar 1999 (#1999-50) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Re: Richard Carfagna's comment on Enslin. The New NPF Enslin _Selected Poems_ does not include excerpts from Enslin's long poems. Rather the book is devoted to extensive selections from his many collections of short poems. NPF is hoping to do new editions of Enslin's out-of-print long poems (_Forms_, _Synthesis_, and _Ranger_) and his unpublished long poem _Axes_. Burt Hatlen ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 10:52:59 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Laura Moriarty Subject: Re: of Mothers & Daughters Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dodie, Kathy Lou, et al. - About the class thing - I was responding to a point made by Marjorie Perloff that many early language writers were white men who had been to Ivy League colleges - true enough, but, I thought, too generalizing and disappearing of the backgrounds of such important figures as Ron Silliman, Erica Hunt and Rae Armantrout (just for starters) among the early language writers, not to mention the genders of other early ones. My own background (education, chances etc) happens to be working class and I find currently that I am among the writers (from various classes) who are spending a lot of their time making a living. I like the effect of class on people's writing, (and like to observe and imagine it in individuals) but what class are we anyway? Being an artist/poet/whatever with a working class background might mean these days that though you have an open invitation to lunch with the Baroness ( or to read in this or that place etc) you can't afford the time or the air fare. I don't think I said that I thought classes were breaking down - though god knows I may have - but that experimental or innovative writing were becoming somewhat meaningless terms, given the many kinds of work being published under those general rubricks -- and that that was a good thing. In retrospect, I liked the way Marjorie's talk shook things up - though I regretted the attention it took from some of the other talks. I found it very interesting to be there in person - saying yes but what about this event or person or fact which seems to refute this generalization(?) Usually one reads these things in a book and just fumes away. As currently my hands are almost numb from entering SPD's upcoming catalog - I should say (type), while I have the strength - that I am very grateful to Fanny and Rae for setting up such a unique, valuable and memorable conference. That several people came up to Leslie Scalapino (whose talk against literary lineage was great) to tell her that her talk had been "brilliant" - and also that several of the talks - Myung's, Carla's, Dodie's, Harryette's, and (agreeing with Joel here) Renee's and Pamela's (there are other names I know I am forgetting) - were interesting in a directly inspiring and enabling and challenging way. Not to mention one of the most incredible group readings of all time that happened on Sunday (thanks Stephen and Joe) - Oh and I also don't think I quite said (Kevin) that computers were taking over but that we are interacting with our media technologies in a way that is changing us and our writing and that the way technology is changing does seem to have something like a life of its own with which we we interact in our own writing and thinking processes - as is occurring here. Laura moriarty@lanminds.com http://socrates.berkeley.edu/~moriarty/ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 15:23:44 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maz881@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Page Mothers & Delinquent Daughters Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 3/18/99 7:14:43 PM Hawaiian Standard Time, LISTSERV@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU writes: << Nancy discussed Sianne Ngai's "Poetics of Disgust" (orig. pub'd in _Open Letter_) as making the sort of moves that Silliman (et al?) had demanded (in Philly Talks) but as being ignored as such, criticized on the basis of it's having been carelessly read. She proposed that a Poetics of Disgust works as a "cultural poetics," a relation of poetics to the social 'in the tradition of' Lang po, but structured with its own, although contingent, ideaology. >> Linda, thanks for the long and thoughful post. can you clarify the clause "criticized on the basis of it's having been carelessly read"? also, what evidence do you or did Shaw feel supports the notion that people are ignoring Sianne's essay in the "group-manifesto" sense? it seems obvious to me at least that the essay, with an editorial thrust by jeff derksen, functions exactly in this way. now if you take the essay (which is part of a larger piece/project i know little about--might be a dissertation) out of open letter it would appear to me to to function a lot less in this traditional group forming negativity sense. and i suppose i would be more inclined to meet the essay in this context. i guess i see the group manifesto thing as played out. not that groups aren't happening or that groups aren't primary to "advancement" (i get by with a little help from my friends), but i believe once you start defining groups on paper with poems and essays then eventually those definitions, which appear fixed in print, will come back to haunt you. so that you get exclusion problems, who's in who's out problems, correct form problems, race gender and class problems, people who think they're in one group fighting against people who think they're in another group, etc. eg l-p looks to be led by white prose-poetry writing poem-essay blurring hetero males seeking out the academic sinecures of the mark strands of the world. i'm not saying that's the case or even that it's an intelligent way to read the l-p phenom. but it can be read that way. and we should keep in mind Dodie's good point about revisionism re Shange. i suppose it could be argued that i am just having some anxiety of "appearance". perhaps. but all of the energy put into that group definition could be keeping you from the next good poem. so that the group project initialized as l-p, at least as i read it being valorized in the recent open letter, might actually hinder "advancement" (now). also i mean where is the "advancement"? to me it seems more important (now) to look for commonalities among different groupings and try to create permeable groups, to seek out many to many relationships. Bill Luoma ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 00:37:44 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: AERIALEDGE@AOL.COM Subject: New @ Bridge Street, Blanchot, Creeley, North &&& Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Ordering & discount information at the end of the list. 1. _Above the Human Nerve Domain_, Will Alexander, Pavement Saw, $12. "displaced & obsessed with contaminated grammar" 2. _Tales of Murasaki and Other Poems_, Martine Bellen, Sun & Moon, $10.95. Winner, National Poetry Series selected Rosmarie Waldrop. "We know what the animals do because we married them." 3. _Four Year Old Girl_, Mei-mei Berssenbrugge, Kelsey Street, $12. "The long neck is how light looks like occupied time." 4. _The Station Hill Blanchot Reader: Fiction and Literary Essays_, Maurice Blanchot, trans. Lydia Davis, Paul Auster, and Robert Lamberton, Station Hill, $29.95. Reprints seven of Blanchot's eight Station Hill Books including _Death Sentence_, _Thomas the Obscure_, _The Madness of the Day_, & _Vicious Circles_. 5. _& Calling It Home_, Lisa Cooper, Chax, $11. " A mind (also called a sin) until rhythm insists on its / last stand. /We float to ground & belt down an old soul like polite corage / which, as if one can't tell, is as cute as easily as a button." 6. _The Evacuated Forest Papers_, Jeff Conant, Buck Downs Books, $10.95. ". . . to say nothing beyond my ken, / to say nothing if it's bigger than / your head . . ." 7. _Day Book of a Virtual Poet_, Robert Creeley, Spuyten Duyvil, $12. "All the tendentious proposals as to 'why write,' in Pound's useful phrase, finally fade to the one point W. C. Williams made by saying, 'Why don't we tell them it's fun?'" 8. _The Arcades_, Michael Davidson, O Books, $10. "This duet seeks some area not quoted" 9. _Poetry As Experience_, Philippe Lacoue-Labarthe, Stanford, $14,95. 10. _Matinees_, Ange Mlinko, Zoland, $13. "but don't make too much of this or someone will call you 'poetic'" 11. _The Case_, Laura Moriarty, O Books, $11.50. "He regains his humility. She is recognized as having stuck with it. This seems like a promotion. The unsolved nature of the case is the institution they have become." 12. _Dark_, Hoa Nguyen, Mike & Dale's Press, $7. "numb where the knowledge knife is gifted" 13. _New and Selected Poems_, Charles North, Sun & Moon, $12.95. "In the language of the spirit / one of the waist-high ashtrays is on fire!" 14. _The Cambridge Companion to Ezra Pound_, ed Ira B. Nadel, Cambridge, $19.95. George Bornstein, Hugh Witemeyer, Daniel Albright, Ian F. Bell, Ronald Bush, Peter Nicholls, Richard Taylor, Massimo Baciagulpo, Ming Xie, Reed Way Dasenbrock, Michael Ingham, Tim Redman, Helen M. Dennis, & Wendy Flory. 15. _Shiny Magazine Number 9/10_, ed. Michael Friedman, guest ed. Larry Fagin, $15. T Berrigan, Szamatowicz, North, Parsons, Coolidge, Mlinko, Ashbery, Greenley, Reverdy trans Padgett, Malmude, Young, Violi, Koch, Willis, Mathews, McCain, M Gizzi, Reifman, Collom, Hejinian, Rodefer, Meltzer, T Davis, Hollo, Jarnot, Champion, Goldman, Towle, Sharma, Greenwald, Harryman, Heliczer, Berrigan/Padgett, & Winthrop Mackworth Praed. 16. _Spiderwasp or Literary Criticism_, Juliana Spahr, Spectacular Books, $6. "_(one thing?)_" 17. _Deepstep Come Shining_, C.D. Wright, Copper Canyon, $14. "What if we stay here long enough to attend a stranger's funeral. I like this spot." 18. _The Future of History_, Howard Zinn, interviews with David Barsamian, Common Courage, $13.95. 19. _Louis Zukofsky and the Poetry of Knowledge_, Mark Scroggins, Alabama, $24.95. New In paperback: _The Mooring of Starting Out: The First 5 Books_, John Ashbery, $18. _So There: Poems 1976-83_, Robert Creeley, $14.95. _Wittgenstein's Ladder_, Marjorie Perloff, $16. Some Recent Bestsellers: _True_, Rae Armantrout, $12.95. _My Way: Speeches and Poems_, Charles Bernstein, $18. _Big Allis 8_, $8. _A Secret Location on the Lower East Side: Adventures in Writing 1960-1980_, $27.95. _Mina Loy: Woman & Poet_, ed Maeera Shreiber & Keith Tuma, $24.95. _Log Rhythms_, Charles Bernstein, w/ illustrations by Susan Bee, ltd edition of 500 copies, saddlestitched, $35. _Ron Silliman and the Alphabet_, ed Thomas A. Vogler, $15. _An Anthology of New Poetics_, ed Christopher Beach, $19.95. _Whatsaid Serif_, Nathaniel Mackey, $12.95. _Democracy Boulevard_, Kit Robinson, $11.95. _The Future of Memory_, Bob Perelman, $14.95. _Tripwire: A Journal of Poetics #2_, $8. Poetics folks receive free shipping on orders of more than $20. Free shipping + 10% discount on orders of more than $30. There are two ways to order. 1. E-mail your order to aerialedge@aol.com with your address & we will bill you with the books. or 2. via credit card-- you may call us at 202 965 5200 or e-mail aerialedge@aol.com w/ yr add, order, & card # & we will send a receipt with the books. We must charge shipping for orders out of the US. Bridge Street Books, 2814 Pennsylvania Ave NW, Washington, DC 20007. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 12:41:52 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: nora chai Subject: cavalli query Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain hello all -- i tried to post this message a few days ago and afaik it didn't go through, but on the off chance this is a repeat post please flame me duly. could anyone point me to english translations of/work in english about the italian poet patrizia cavalli? so far i've only seen her work in anthologies, i.e. vintage contemporary world poetry, various italian compendia, etc. i believe there is/are collection(s) of her work in english, but i haven't been able to find them in the usual online catalogues. any info apppreciated. thanks a whole lot... nora Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 22:31:15 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: david bromige Subject: L A readings this week Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" {DB posting on behalf of Aldon Neilsen} Two Upcoming Poetry Events at Loyola Marymount University Tuesday March 23 at 8 p.m. Peter Gizzi & Elizabeth Willis Hilton 300 C & D Thursday March 25 at 8 p.m. Ron Silliman McIntosh Center No admission charge to either event. 7900 Loyola Boulevard (off Manchester). inquiries to English dept., 310-338-3018. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 12:08:38 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Charlie Morrow Subject: update on Banquet for Armand (fwd) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Please list the enclosed announcement. Thank you, Charlie Morrow studio +1 212-595-8300 fax +1 212 595-6566 Charles Morrow Associates, Inc. 2095 Broadway, Ste 504 New York, New York 10023 USA ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Fellow Celebrators of Armand! The Peoples Poetry Gathering - and organizers Poets House and Citylore - have added this Banquet to the weekend events Jeanine Klein (Armand's sister) and I, with input from our collaborators, have been putting things together. The Swedish cultural authorities have given Sten Hanson a travel grant to come over and MC with me. Rumor has it he will wear his tails and Royal Swedish honorary colors conferred by the King of Sweden two years ago. It is interesting to note that a former King of Sweden, famous for his picture on a Swedish kronor bill, is a ringer for Armand. Charlie Morrow www.cmorrow.com __________________________________________ Please come to the Banquet for Armand Schwerner Sunday, April 11, 7 pm Teachers & Writers, 5 Union Square West, NYC Armand Schwerner was a poet musician compared in his recent NY Times obit with Ezra Pound. He is most famous for a series of poems called The Tablets in which he creates Mesopotamian "found tablets" with missing and untranslatable lines and the comments of the scholar translator. The Lving Theater created a critical success with a staged version of The Tablets. We all are chipping in 18$/person for food and wine. Ellen Zweig and Jeanine Klein have created a meal of Armand's favorite food from the Moustache Restaurant. Wines have chosen accordingly. There will be toasts and performances by Adam Schwerner, Jeanine Klein, Jerome Rothenberg, Spencer Holst, Sten Hanson, The Living Theater, Charles Bernstein, Jackson Mac Low and Anne Tardos, Mike Heller, Ellen Zweig, Francis Alenikoff, Pierre Joris, Nicole Peyrafitte, Charlie Morrow, Phill Niblock (film), Bernard Heidseick (recorded on phone), Logos Duo of Belgium with a work based on the address in Antworp where Armand was born. And more. We have seatings for 70. Please prepay reservations by April 10 through Citylore, phone 212 529-1955. No tickets sold at event. Presented as part of the Peoples Poetry Gathering by Poets House and Citylore in association with Teachers and Writers Collaborative, Jeanne Klein and Charlie Morrow. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 12:01:32 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Subject: Biography and Film: A Special Issue of _Biography_ / Schultz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit this had to be reformatted a bit. Chris ----------------- Original message (ID=7C1F5775) (110 lines) ------------- From: "Susan M. Schultz" Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 08:17:59 -1000 ---------- Forwarded message ---------- A SPECIAL ISSUE: THE BIOPIC The January 2000 issue of _Biography: An Interdisciplinary Quarterly_ will explore the biopic. Guest editor Glenn Man is looking for papers which address the theoretical, generic, historical, cultural, or technical aspects of representing or telling lives in film or video--from Hollywood spectaculars to indie films, from short subjects to A & E Biographies. Interdisciplinary and multicultural approaches are particularly welcome. Manuscripts should be between 2,500 and 7,500 words, though shorter and longer essays will be considered. Please submit two copies of any manuscript. Since _Biography_ has a double-blind submission policy, the author's name should not appear anywhere on either copy, but in the cover letter. Decisions about publication will be received within three months, and comments will be provided for all essays received. Consultation on manuscript ideas is welcomed. For more information, contact the general editor, Craig Howes, by email at biograph@hawaii.edu by telephone at (808) 956-3774 by fax at (808) 956-3774 or by mail at the Center for Biographical Research, University of Hawai'i, Honolulu, Hawai'i 96822. DEADLINE for submissions: August 1, 1999. ____________________________________________________________________________ Craig Howes Home Phone: 808-732-4250 President, CELJ Center Phone: 808-956-3774 Editor, _Biography_ Fax: 808-956-3774 Director, Center for Biographical Research Professor, Department of English 1733 Donaghho Road University of Hawai'i at Manoa Honolulu, Hawai'i 96822 Center Homepage: www2.hawaii.edu/~biograph UH Journals Biography Homepage www2.hawaii.edu/uhpress/Journals/BI/BIhome.html Council of Editors of Learned Journals Homepage: www.msu.edu/user/pod/celj * * * * * * * * * * --------------8C799046A02CF653310C6EB3-- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 01:46:08 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Kevin L. Magee" Subject: Re: Chris' interest in Riding-Crane MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SNAPSHOT The impulse is everything They did not expect to be next to each other Now they are about to fall over each other and see not them that cannot be 'seen' other things also so try to show those other to say it would be not to slide off it being said, find ways to sacrifice it to the elsewhere in us Not to tell (you) for you or for me The action of thunder noticed but not thought about, is "The Wrestling God's WCW Thunder Report": "Hey anonymous, I hope you don't believe that windbag crap you are trying to tell people" (The Turnstile Scroll)(or Delphic Oracle?) What I write (note) I don't (try not to) notice. We are what interferes with us and that rough-handling and penetration is the lived moment, that there are paths to be followed like responsibilities Thought is what floods us and wants to be written and what was interfered with was not an aim or narration to build a wall around itself and form its own kingdom (as an oyster makes a pearl of the interfering sand) making myself available to the barrage energy and reflection upon what was just 'here' only 'there' for the moment of its performance that memory (selective, judgmental, etc.) immediately what need does it answer? Spaces emerge, and a new mutant species tries to inhabit them Why both talk about what you are talking about? You are never tallking about what you are talking about I don't want to kill what I really want to talk about neurons project me against the strength of incoming stimuli, force me to new efforts of will and intervention and if we respond it is as an 'error' of responding to what we PROJECT . . . offending as a way to respond to what is present try to anticipate the next stage see the entire web-of-associations make that statement and do that thing if the audience is being delighted by what they already know is delightful the rallying cry must not be the game (move and countermove) of Western art write the PROTECTION against noticing, PROTECT us what can we include in the on-going heretofore devalued and kept out, etc., etc. web intersections, web of relatedness of all find exhiliration and freedom and creative ever-alike relation to your own web you are no longer blind and hypnotized you are a free man in all moments of your life make contact with the reality that is really-there not a new "that knocks me out like . . . " (Shakespeare, sex, etc.) convinced of the reality of one's own seeing when we are awed or moved by the other, an alien other in whom we wish we could partake (Hart's romantic art) interacting the mind forgets its own workings and there is no real meeting, only face to another moment of "artificial" "something" that is mindless too one dimensional to be a real encounter choose turbulence, inject disruption into knowing my instinct to charge what comes into me and it occurs to me that the reason it occurs to me what I am doing now in the collision with the now-between PROJECT and what resists it the reflex is the pretext to set a process in motion, it's a pivot point (i.e. frame now, frame not-there) AMASS as the MASS grew, suck the life into the orbit my day of writing on that day allows for eruptions of specific willed activity the starter button of "Hey kids!" gets pushed a certain effect on a certain kind of human attention performing the necessary leverage on the machine of my class for a good many years now Why did my machine start working this way? AUTHORITY not available to me in other aspects of my kid-life and all those other refined things that classical art is always about, thought washing itself lightly onto the page noise broke out over me, chu_______________ trees seem to shake and to lean over me my attendants are Kaldirhgyet (Split Person) Waralsawal (Crazy or idiot, a narhnorh or spirit), and 'Arhkawdzem-Tsetsauts (Tsetsaut-is-thoughtless, also a narhnorh) sometimes it is a bad song within him or her (wawq: sleeping, or ksewawq: dreaming), her full name is Niskyaw-romral'awstlegye'ns upheaval in singing and clapping of drums P.S. Dear Chris, ask Bernadette? She's probably got a copy of Chelsea 35 (1976) Alfredo de Palchi, the guest editor of this anthology of L(R)J writes that he first read her "Respect for the Dead" in Nuovissima Poesia Americana e Poesia Negra (1949-1953). Kevin ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 16:22:43 -0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lawrence Upton." Comments: To: british-poets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Writers Forum has published NOISES by Serge Segay and Bob Cobbing ISBN 0 86162 866 7 - "collaborative visual poetry" They're quite different poets. Segay collages disparate material, slams it together and leaves it there, jarring to some extent and uses certain bits and pieces over and again - his rubber stamp "Made in Zaumland" appears here I think Cobbing has had the last say here. The elements of the page meld together - but he too has utilised some heterogeneous bits and pieces to get to where he is - I recognise the phrase "plummets towards a worm hole" from cris cheek's talk on Domestic Ambient Noise at the last sv colloquium... & I have just noticed "poetics of domestic noise"... sounds familiar (no pun intended) WF has also published two more pamphlets of Domestic Ambient Noise = ##204 & 205 BRIDGE THAT GAP by Bob Cobbing & Lawrence Upton 0 86162 867 5 - Upton's variations on Cobbing's PONTOON LOOKING FOR A GAPE'S NEST by Lawrence Upton & Bob Cobbing 0 86162 868 3 - Cobbing's variations on bridge that gap All enquiries with s.a.e./ i.r.c. to New River Project, 89a Petherton Road, London N5 2QT ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 10:56:03 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkward Ubutronics Subject: 30 Samples for Orchestra MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 30 Samples for Orchestra http://net22.com/qazingulaza/radio_caterpillar/thirtysamples/thirtysamples.html (flash 3 required, it is not streaming so let it load to your computer before clicking anything) miekal and ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 21:21:03 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "David L. Erben" Subject: Pitts Lodging Query Comments: To: UB Poetics discussion group MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Might someone on the list have suggestions for reasonably priced lodgings in the Pitts downtown? I'm off to a conf in April and the conf hotel is outrageously priced. Please backchannel any suggestions. Thank you David Erben derben@utoledo.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 12:37:56 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Prejsnar Subject: what poetry's for MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII "the question nobody seems to ever want to answer about there art: what is it for?: it's going to pay for my kids' college, it's going to get me out of the projects, it's going to save humanity/create a better world, I don't know I was bored and passing time, I'm going to prove I'm smarter/better/more educated/cooler than my dad/my brother/my mom/him/her/you" the above is quoted from a post by James Perez. I don't think poetry is *for* anything. Adorno would say it reveals near-unbareable tensions and tears in the social/historical fabric, which exists "in" society but also permeates down into our subjectivities; Marcuse would say it points forward to the full realization, as an apprehendable utopia, of human possibility... (the latter being ideas he probably partly takes from E. Bloch) I think they're both *right* (in a partial way); but niether of these defines what poetry is *for* .... These are things it *does* It's a basic defining human activity, and it makes at least as much sense to say that *we* exist in order to do it, as it does to fall into the delusion thinking that it "exists for something." It is not apprehendable in terms of function. It ain't a functional thing. (..it is more an activity than a thing, in fact, but that's another post...) mark prejsanar ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 10:03:31 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: dbkk@SIRIUS.COM Subject: Re: of Mothers & Daughters In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19990320185259.00adf278@pop.lmi.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 10:52 AM -0800 3/20/99, Laura Moriarty wrote: >I don't think I said that I thought classes were breaking down - though god >knows I may have - but that experimental or innovative writing were becoming >somewhat meaningless terms, given the many kinds of work being published >under those general rubricks -- and that that was a good thing. Laura, Thanks for clarifying this and many good points. When Cecil Giscombe gave his wonderful talk about race and nature at Small Press Traffic a couple of weeks ago, to which only TWO people came (thank you Lee Ann Brown and Renee Gladman) he said some insightful things about class during the question and period. He'd spoken during the talk more than once about being middle class--but also pointedly about living along the margins. I asked him to clarify that. The margin point was, he said, about writing and the realm of experimentation. He then talked about how the ability to play in the margins at ease (and I'm heavily paraphrasing here and probably getting it all wrong) is a function of class. He talked about the students in his classes, how working class students, both black and white, behaved with more of a hesitancy than middle class students. That playing in the margins when you're middle class, you're not risking everything, your whole being--that you have more of a support system to fall back on. Personally, I don't think those kind of dynamics ever totally get erased--regardless of who's publishing who, who works at what job. The--everybody complains about "experimental" and "avant-garde"--why don't we just call it "arty"--arty poetry world defines itself as white middle class, and while there are serious and gratuitous attempts to expand that, people from other backgrounds are always within an outsider group that's playing against the white middle class center. How many pomo theory books have to be written before it's taken to heart--that nothing's really going to change until that center is redefined. Dodie ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 14:21:54 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tom Orange Subject: shifts in modalities MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII linda, i want to pick up on yr lead regarding cultural poetics as a diagnostic tool for discerning shifts in modalities in/or language environments. i missed nancy's buffalo talk but caught her reading (along with kevin davies and deirdre kovac) in toronto -- write-up forthcoming. i know nancy's current critical work engages with british cultural materialism, leavis thru birmingham school -- very useful right now, as perhaps such a return can yield new insights into where cult studs/poetics might fruitfully be taken. tho the term cultural poetics was popularized in literary study by stephen greenblatt in the early-mid 1980s, who in turn points to clifford geertz as inspiration, and who preferred the term in lieu of "new historicism." john guillory gave a talk here at western a few weeks ago, wherein he offered a historical critique of cultural studies largely along the lines of what he called its object of disciplinary desire. basically: whether our critical modality flattens everything into text (deconstruction as neo-high-formalism) or cultural artifact (cult studs), there remains this ineluctable hermeneutic residue as i call it, i.e. our task remains one of interpretation regardless of what we call it. i sort of dismally envisioned this limestone quarry filled with critics pounding their heads against the wall of meaning hoping that someone will simply notice them bleeding. a heavy critique with, unfortunately, little payoff: i asked guillory what we do with this hermeneutic residue, and his suggestion was that cult studs shift its modality away from the artifact itself and towards the mediation itself, between the artefact and history, economics, politics, etc. easy to assert, hard to do no doubt. point being: i think you and (or summarizing) nancy are on the right track, and the way that different language environments mediate material conditions is where we should be trying to look. and i'm sympathetic to sianne's efforts on this front to articulate a poetics of disgust. i think the essay is quite capable of being misread, but upon rereading it carefully i found much more wrong with it than i originally had. (save this for another time.) suffice it to say that as a highly localized and provisional tactic/ environment, i think disgust is useful, but that we need at the same time to identify a whole range of grammars: of abhorrence aversion loathing repugnance repulsion revulsion. and that unless disgust can start to help us identify and articulate other modalities such as these, it remains unabashedly singular, local, limited. which is, of course, a good, and perhaps the only, place to start. tom orange london, ontario ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 14:28:16 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tom Orange Subject: shaw/davies/kovac in toronto MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII nancy shaw, kevin davies and deirdre kovac read from their work at the redhead gallery (96 spadina ave, 8th fl) in toronto this past thursday evening. they were introduced by peter jaeger, who coordinated the event. this was my first time hearing all of them, though i was somewhat familiar with their work only through peridoicals. hot on the heels of nancy's and kevin's reading in buffalo the previous night, and imbued with the sense of comraderie found only through several hours of being on the road in the close quarters of scott pound's ford fiesta, the three shared their remarkable talents and personalities with us well into the next day. nancy started off with portions of "flags," which can be found interspersed throughout the other works found in jeff derksen's recently-edited issue of open letter. as she moved into other sequences such as "torch songs" and "anthems" -- the latter of which, i believe, nancy apologized for as being somewhat "didactic" -- i found the nervous edge of nancy's delivery to persist: it was curiously both compelling and faltering, as if caught up in its own forward pace. i found it distracting for a stretch but then found myself becoming acclimated to this sort of arhythmia. and by the time nancy finished off with a set of new work, in which the didactic had become more enmeshed in the more lyric mode of "flags," the delivery's edge for me had become a perfectly engaging counterpart to the text. after a short break, kevin davies took the floor, calmly stacked his loose sheets on the right side of the table, picked them up one by one, read them and placed them face down in a pile on the left, with next to no prefacing or commentary and only an intermittant announcement of a sequence's title. the humor that is so vital in kevin's work was only reinforced by the deadpan earnestness of his delivery. at times he studied the page from which he was reading, as if he too was puzzled or struck by what they contained, only to return them to their proper pile with the others. the energy in the room was infectious, with each listener alternately giving in to the sustained need to let out a guffaw or cackle. another short break and deirdre kovac was introduced. known to listeners primarily as a co-editor of the journal big allis, her work was largely unfamiliar to us, tho by the time she was finished there was a clear need and desire to see and hear more. deirdre puts little inflection or emphasis into her delivery, and it really doesn't need it because her words take on a music of their own. her work has a marvelously complex texture of interweaving and reoccuring sound patterns that moved near the threshhold of sense. her vocabulary was exotic, even lush, and at times became atomized and then recombined into a rich sonic wash. the bulk of the texts were from her manuscript called mannerism, which needs to find a publisher at once. special notice also should go to deirdre for maintaining utmost poise after toronto luminary john barlow, upon arriving late and trying to take a seat inconspicuously in the rear of the gallery, ended up taking down with his backpack not one but two display cases mounted to the wall and containing sculptures. kevin had presaged just such an occurance and felt remiss in not carrying out some pre-emptive measures. also in attendance were christian bok, stephen cain, karen mac cormack, steve mccaffery, jenifer papparro, andrew patterson, scott pound, and darren wershler-henry. post-reading festivities ensued at the cameron house on queen street west and carried on well into thursday evening. on friday morning we met for a leisurely brunch at the lakeview diner on dundas and ossington. this was followed by a visit to coach house press, where darren gave a tour and offered merchandise. scott then loaned us his car and peter, christian, and nancy and i took kevin and deirdre to the airport shuttle. we had a few hours to kill before nancy's train left, so peter took us on a whirlwind tour of some other toronto galleries, including the 401 richmond complex, mercer union, and art metropole (the best place for artists' books this side of printed matter in soho). as peter departs for a trip to england shortly, we look forward to the renewal of the redhead gallery reading series, to which we hope that broken sculptures do not form an insurmountable deterrant. tom orange london, ontario ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 14:51:30 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "P.Standard Schaefer" Subject: NEW RHIZOME Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Rhizome 3 is finally here. This issue focuses on longer selections of work. Poetry by: Jen Hofer, Tracy Grinnel, Emily Grossman, Adriano Spatola (Italy), Annie Le Brun (France), Juan Luis Martinez (Argentina), Monica Nepote (Mexico), Ray DiPalma, Gwyn McVay, Oscarine Bsquet (France), Joe Ross, Dennis Phillips, Chris Stroffolino, George Albon, Carmen Lenero (Mexico), Paul Hoover, Luigi Ballerini (Italy), Martha Ronk, Bob Crosson, Cathy Wagner, Garrett Caples, Pascallee Monnier (France), Elio Pagliarani (Italy), Robert Hale, Franklin Bruno, Cole Swensen, Jena Osman, Mateo Goyocolea (Argentina), Keith Walddrop, Paul Vangelisti, Guy Bennett, Camille Guthrie and Mohammed Dibb (Algeria). Plus, many reviews and essays (by Jacques Debrot, Robert Hale, Summi Kaipa, Franklin Bruno, Patrick Pritchett and others). Copies are available for $8.50 Quite a bargain for 231 pages of reviews, essays, poetry and so forth. Please write checks to: STANDARD SCHAEFER (not Rhizome) 366 S. Mentor Ave. #108 Pasadena, CA 91106 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 15:31:11 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Billy Little Subject: Re: Fwd: Let's do the Modernism! In-Reply-To: <36F2D3AA.258D@ix.netcom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" you should have heard Duncan McNaughton at Capilano College the other night, talking about the mysteries, don't explain them to me please, be the mystery, let the mystery occupy you, if you're lucky or un you practice the mysteries, they reveal you. duncan is one of the vital poets, a partofspeach accelerator, as we needed to read charles olson with it or not we need to read mcnaughton he's pitchin fastballs and curveballs and knucklers and not a few spitballs he rePresents the elemental forces, he washes your window with a conjunction, his form is like the fogs, he permeates, a cloud of understanding, knew dewds drewds, like a flyfisher he gets you on the way back, like a boomerang carrying your brain bang back to your cranium loverboys, blistering lips blips ript against unwrought stone in Cyprus not her occupying you. geography/geology occupying you, natural history get with it sung loud duende propels compells soupsong it's not the aere its the aether McNaughton is it, he's got it, he's with it, get his especially if that's all you can afford, i.e., can't afford not to...tomorrows talk today. billy the millionaires' buddhist little forbidden plateau fallen body dojo 4 song st. nowhere, b.c. V0R1Z0 canadaddy ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 15:33:11 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Billy Little Subject: norma cole In-Reply-To: <199903191732.MAA15144@nico.bway.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" she plays your brain like a banjo like an orchestra i've been rereading for the fourth or fifth time Desire and its Double these songs delicious on the tongue delirium she carries forward the san francisco tradition of lean precision like Spicer, like Josephine Miles, like George Stanley, she makes sense, like whalen, in the sense of seventh sense, sense you never want to prove, or deduce, accept a very offhand or matter of fact projective verse at its best instanter phanopoeia, logopoeia and melopoeia full flame in this classy humble publication of instress a hymnbook of "sentiences" she performed a weekend finale for the KSW several weeks back i feel remiss at not reporting on same dazzling matteroffactness short reading work in progress Spinoza in her Youth, virtuosity without encore, her redelivered Oppen Lecture the Poetics of Vertigo the following day brought us the less secure more professional Cole still incisive but more crossed tees and dotted eyes less flight more lift more hydraulics i prefer her singing, her original voice, her ear her ghostly accuracy, her spare succulent syntacticks, do they put duende in the drinking water in san francisco: green ribbons all untied, the other's knots, the other's sky the stone or plane beyond her shoulder, this glow around her head the less distinct profile of a knotted rope, the bloody knot-what is euphoria?-the pictured events cut a star to the size of your hand framing the flowers of diction, division, decision, the flags "along the way i managed to escape" -for Ruth Singer forbidden plateau fallen body dojo 4 song st. nowhere, b.c. V0R1Z0 canadaddy ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 22:47:59 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "P.Standard Schaefer" Subject: Carl Martin Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I just came across the lovely new book from Dalkey Archive and am sort of baffled that I'd never seen Carl Martin's work before. Who is he? Does anyone know how I could locate him? Thanks, Standard ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 00:26:38 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Don Byrd Subject: Renga MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Some time back--my sense of chronology is never too good-- there was a renga project on the net. I think I may have actually contributed to it, but most of the details have slipped my mind. Does any one remember it? Know who organized it? Know if it was archived anywhere? Best, Don Byrd ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 00:56:07 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: George Bowering Subject: Re: of class In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19990320185259.00adf278@pop.lmi.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I like to think that the question of class in writing has to do with the argument of the writing, not the place where the writer of the writing was born. That is to say, my favourite working class writer from the US was and is Douglas Woolf, but you know, his parents were pretty comfortable in the NE. And Doug wrote about the west, mainly, too. So I would not call him a middle class NE writer. George Bowering. , 2499 West 37th Ave., Vancouver, B.C., Canada V6M 1P4 fax: 1-604-266-9000 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 15:02:20 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: derek beaulieu / house press Subject: Fw: for info or action Comments: To: Undisclosed.Recipients@mail4.cadvision.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----Original Message----- From: Derek.Beaulieu@fluordaniel.com To: housepre@cadvision.com Date: Thursday, March 18, 1999 10:48 AM Subject: for info or action > CIRCULATE WIDELY > > Petition to protect small booksellers. This petition is important to > the small independent booksellers. Please take a moment to sign it.If > you are the 50th, 100th, 150th signature, please e-mail the petition > to the AMERICAN BOOKSELLERS ASSOCIATION, e-mail address > ab-info@bookweb.org . > > If you want more info, here is a web site: > http://web.bookweb.org/m-bin/by_topic?topic_id=37 > > PETITION TO BLOCK BARNES & NOBLE ACQUISITION OF INGRAM > > This petition will be sent to the US Congress, Department of Justice > and the Federal Trade Commission to block Barnes & Noble's proposed > acquisition of the Ingram Book Company, the single largest supplier > of books to small bookstores across the country. This acquisition, > should it be allowed to take place, is just one more example of the > large scale corporate consolidation that has infiltrated every corner > of our culture. > As the desire intensifies to increase bottom line profits, no > matter what the other consequences, so does the concentration of > power in the book industry. Consumers are left with an environment in > which fewer and fewer people are deciding which books get published > and ultimately, which books Americans can read and buy. Barnes & Noble > has already entered into an alliance with the $14 billion media > giant, German-owned Bertelsmann AG. Now with Barnes & Noble's > proposed acquisition of the billion-dollar Ingram Book Company, there > can be little doubt that the book industry is falling prey to the > same anticompetitive ills that currently plague computer software and > other industries. This deal would make independent bookstores > virtually dependent upon their largest competitor for their books. > (It is as if Burger King and Wendy's had to buy their French fries > from McDonald's). > > We need your help. As a patron of independent booksellers, please > sign the petition to help us lobby the government to stop this > proposed merger. > > Please exercise your right as a citizen and tell the government how > you feel. We sincerely thank you for your support. > > Please add your name to this petition and forward it to as many people > as you can. If you want to sign the petition but not send it around, > please sign and return it to e-mail address above. > > **IMPORTANT: Do not use the "Forward" utility in your mail program. > Instead, cut and paste this message into a NEW E-MAIL, add your name > to the bottom of the list, and send it out widely to all your friends > and networks. ** > > 1. Meg Gouraud, Canon City CO > 2. Garrison Keillor, St. Paul MN. > 3. Roy Blount Jr., NY NY > 4. Ridley Pearson, Bellevue ID. > 5. Amy Tan, San Francisco CA > 6. Stewart Wallace, New York NY > 7. Richard Einhorn, NY, NY > 8. Norman Hollyn, Santa Monica CA > 9. JoAnn Hanley, Los Angeles CA > 10. Isabel King, Gardena CA > 11. Maya Conn, Santa Monica CA > 12. Matthew Weinstein, Brooklyn NY > 13. Alice Shechter, Brooklyn NY > 14. Bj Richards, Oak Park, Il. > 15. Susan Salidor, Chicago, IL > 16. Heidi Kafka, Chicago, IL > 17. David Lavan, Chicago, IL > 18. Annissa Anderson, Bend, OR > 19. Cheryl Heinrichs, Bend, OR > 20. Sean F. Everton, San Jose, CA > 21. Deanne L. S. Everton, San Jose,CA > 22. Dawn Ramsey, Bend, OR > 23. Barbara Boothby, Bellingham, WA > 24. Laura Cazares, Santa Barbara, CA > 25. Karin Gursky, San Rafael, CA > 26. Gregory Hines, San Francisco, CA > 27. Hal Conklin, Santa Barbara, CA > 28. Daniel Figlo, Santa Barbara, > CA 29. Neal Rabin, Santa Barbara, CA > 30. Christopher Horner, Venice, CA > 31. Luis Watts, Bloomfield Hills, MI > 32. Joel Swadesh, USA > 33. Jane Prettyman, Santa Barbara, CA > 34. Joe Forgy, Texarkana, TX > 35. Janet Stevens, Irvine, CA > 36. Jeannie Brown, Mission Viejo, CA > 37. Patricia Sierra, Toledo, OH > 38. Austin Wright, Cincinnati, OH > 39. James Wheatley, W. Hartford, CT > 40. David Richter, New York, NY > 41. John Richetti, Philadelphia, PA > 42. Nina Auerbach, Philadelphia, PA > 43. Catherine Benamou, Ann Arbor, MI > 44. Celeste Olalquiaga, NYC > 45. Eunice Lipton, NYC > 46. Sharon Frost, NYC > 47. Allen Eisenberg, NYC > 48. Alan Sondheim, NYC > 49. E.M.Garrison, Boise, ID > 50. John Cayley, London, UK > 51. Miles Champion, London, UK > 52. Lynette Hunter, Leeds, UK > 53. Frank Davey, London, ON, CAN > 54. Susan Rudy, Calgary, Alberta, CAN > 55. Jonathon Wilcke, Calgary, Alberta, CAN > 56. Derek Beaulieu, Calgary, Alberta, CAN > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 13:51:10 +1100 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Margie Cronin Subject: Re: Announcing Jacket # 4 In-Reply-To: <4.0.1.19980730153023.00f70320@zip.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable David Kelly (of the poets union) will launch MTC Cronin's latest collection of poetry - "Everything Holy" (Balcones International press, usa)- at the rose hotel (corner of rose and cleveland streets, chippendale) on sunday 11 april at 3pm (it's free). (if anyone can't make it the book is available for $15 from the author at 108 chelmsford st, newtown, nsw, 2042; ph: 02 9550 2918; or on amazon.com). Her recent australian collection - the world beyond the fig (five islands press) is also available for $13 from the publishers or the author. At 15:37 30/07/98 +1000, you wrote: >Jacket magazine is a literary quarterly free on the Internet, edited from >Sydney Australia by poet John Tranter. Issue # 4 is now fully fitted and >stitched up, at this URL:=20 > > http://www.jacket.zip.com.au/jacket04/index04.html > >Announcing Jacket=92s first QUIZ, with real prizes!=20 > >With a gallery of sparkling poems by :=20 > >Adam Aitken, Charles Alexander and Sheila Murphy - a collaboration, Gary >Catalano, Maxine Chernoff, Bernard Cohen, M.T.C.Cronin, Elaine Equi, Coral >Hull, David Lehman, Tony Lopez, Rod Mengham, Ian Patterson, Roger Pellett, >Gig Ryan, Keston Sutherland, and Robert Vandermolen.=20 > >Articles to knock your socks off:=20 > >David Lehman - The Questions of Postmodernism,=20 >Eliot Weinberger : on the strange ghosts of =CDsland,=20 >Caddel and Quartermain : OTHER British and Irish Poetry since 1970,=20 >Forrest Gander - review of Yasusada : DOUBLED FLOWERING,=20 >A peculiar and perspicacious Portuguese perspective of the 1998 Cambridge >(England) Conference of Contemporary Poetry,=20 >H.M.Enzensberger's "KIOSK" reviewed by Lawrence Joseph,=20 >Noel King interviews Pete Ayrton, publisher of Serpent's Tail books,=20 >Mr Rubenking's "BREAKDOWN" - computers and writing (with a REAL AUDIO >recording of ROBOT POET Joy H.Breshan reading a computer-generated poem in >the mode of Mr Ashbery, and John Tranter=92s =93Carousel=94, a= computer-assisted >prose story),=20 >Tom Clark's "White Thought" reviewed by Dale Smith,=20 >Photography - art, fine art, or prostitution?,=20 >Pet of the Month - the MEERKAT (very handy for poets - find out why),=20 >Great Moments in Literature # 13 - Kleist=92s TWELVE-VOLUME OPUS reduced to >haiku (!) ,=20 >Dangerous Liaisons # 91 - Jo and Meg in Mexico.=20 > >. . . and, as usual, a lather of photographs and other visuals.=20 > >Drop by, try the fit of the Jacket, and if you like it, tell your friends! > > ( I understand that you may not wish to receive these notices.= =20 > ( If so, please reply to this email to that effect, and=20 > ( I'll take your name off the mailing list pronto. [ J.T. ]=20 > > from > John Tranter, 39 Short Street, Balmain NSW 2041, Sydney, Australia > tel (+612) 9555 8502 fax (+612) 9818 8569 > http://writing.upenn.edu/epc/authors/tranter/3poems-interview.html > Editor, Jacket magazine: http://www.jacket.zip.com.au > > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 09:38:45 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Grant Jenkins Subject: Re: gender class poetics poetry In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Grant Jenkins here. Even though I am a habitual lurker, I'd like to weigh in on the class discussion by responding to Mark Prejsnar's post. I think this interrelation that Mark talks about between the personal and the political is very important, especially with Susan Howe. One simply has to read her statements on poetics or her introduction to _The Europe of Trusts_ to see how she views the relationship of her self/poetry to history. But, as others have already suggested on this list, there's an aspect of class, economics that is beyond the author's intentions. This goes for both activism and autobiography. Class pressures and situations condition every aspect of a writer as well as his or her relationship to culture, community, and history. Howe's upper-middle class upbringing in the household of a Harvard University professor as well as her marriage to a famous sculptor--just to name 2 of many many factors--provided her with many economic/social opportunities (and problems) that she does not incorporate consciously into her work. Furthermore, there is no necessary or predetermined relation between class and poetic production. The meaning of those pressures and how they shape a life/work is a matter of careful study and analysis of particular situations. I just think the intent angle in this discussion needs to be discussed further. And while were at it, perhaps we could get some definitions of "class," as someone else suggested. Grant ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 09:55:04 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Subject: Jena Osman at Barnard MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This came in with a request to forward to the list. Chris ----- From: JLCR Date: 3/23/99 1:03 PM -0500 Women Poets at Barnard Presents Jena Osman on Thursday April 1 at 8pm Jena Osman the 1998 Winner of the Barnard Book prize for THE CHARACTER will be reading with Lyn Hejinian. The reading will be held in Held Auditorium in Barnard Hall at Broadway and 117th street, NYC. Admission is free. Reception to follow. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 10:32:52 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Jordan Davis Subject: Delinquent Pages MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Beel (maz881) writ: >to me it seems more important (now) to look for commonalities among different >groupings and try to create permeable groups, to seek out many to many >relationships. > >Bill Luoma Why? This sets off my utopia-alarm. Except that I like venn diagrams too, and though I find I only understand new meanings when they overlap somewhere with what I already know or think about, I only go crazy for things that are completely different -- other other. Permeable group sounds like open to attack. Many to many sounds like Earl Gray which is to say the not my cup. I don't go to school so my reading is only two eyes, unsanctioned, and therefore independent but also subject to demands of time and motivation. What seems important to me now is not even that looking for commonalities but making the work, putting mine and others' work together for like or unlike, moving the work around in front of other eyes (and the ears! but we know that sense already), and being available to (being tolerant of!! without risking too much of the mental health) the unknown. Whatsay? J ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 09:27:15 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Joe Amato/Kass Fleisher Subject: Re: gender class poetics poetry In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" here's a really crude class distinction, which i offer w/o apology: there's nothing i do re which money doesn't matter... i know it's horrible to admit to this---but the best way to get me going is to start talking about how you needed to do this, so you did it... and how you needed to do that, so you did it... and even, you needed to do this and that, and so you hunted out the best buy---and it was all so very difficult... b/c in the end, for me, if you keep talking about what you needed to do and ultimately did, why then you still up and did it... how's about we talk about what YOU COULDN'T DO... you just couldn't do... b/c you didn't have the cash and.or couldn't afford the credit... or b/c you couldn't leave your family behind, say... i can recall a truly aggravating conversation i had once with someone who kept insisting that i shoulda spent a semester abroad as an undergrad... i kept saying "but i couldn't" and s/he kept saying "but you should have"... of course here s/he was, standing in his/her parents' half-a-million dollar house, so advising, and feeling entitled to advise... and here i was, tongue-tied b/c i didn't feel like explaining the niceties of food stamps in those quarters, in these times... so whilst i live these days, strictly speaking, in middle-class trappings, with upper-middle-class aspirations, i often worry and certainly react, strictly speaking, along working-class (or worse) coordinates (though it's fair to say i'm used to worrying and reacting so, so you *might* not notice)... no, i don't think you need to hail from poverty to write meaningfully about poverty... it helps of course---but it's not a necessary or sufficient condition... at the same time, i DO think (e.g.) there are tons o artifacts out there that provoke in me an immediate class reaction, to the extent that i know (or think i know) that the creator(s) either didn't give a hoot about class, or wished to sidestep.avoid it... alla that said: one of the initial obstructions to my immersion in more avant-garde (or whatever) writing (for me) was its apparent failure to respond to the immediacies of class i'd been confronted with for so many years... i can imagine mself reacting differently---e.g., seeing it as an *escape* from these more quotidian realities ... but it took me a long while to get over my resistance (as if i'll ever entirely get over it) and i still find appealing the sort of writing that works out of a rather raw engagement with said experiences---*provided* i don't get the sense the writer is copping a holier-than-___ stance and.or offering it all up as utterly "real" and w/o any fictive intervention... i.e., provided the writing encourages reading with brain intact (which latter is shorthand for all sortsa specifically textual practices that, or so i would hope, bring class/race/gender etc and their interrelations into focus)... at the same time, owing to my white het male background i suppose (though this is only part of the picture of course), i was likely in a somewhat secure state, finally, to venture forth into less orthodox literary form... all of which is to say that my experience as a teach accords very much with cecil g's (wish i coulda been in san fran to hear his talk, dammitall!---though i chewed over some of these issues with him here in chicago prior)... i have, i must add, also run into plenty of students who are not from the working classes, who have been educated (extremely thoroughly) to regard any but more orthodox writing much as they have been educated to regard the 60s... i.e., as an example of mere cultural self-indulgence and hypocrisy... this is as i see it a republican.centrist sentiment that seems to have successfully seeped through much of higher learning... i would just want to be sure that we don't lay the burden of the class.aesthetic conjunction solely on the shoulders of the lower classes... best, joe ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 12:42:50 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tom Beckett Subject: Re: what poetry's for Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Mark, I think poetry is _for_ _love_;that it is the fundamental science of emotional-epistemic investigation; & that it has more to do with questions than answers. Tom Beckett ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 13:21:45 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Grant Jenkins Subject: Re: Renga In-Reply-To: <36F7260E.374B3FF7@nycap.rr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Some time back--my sense of chronology is never too good-- >there was a renga project on the net. I think I may have actually contributed >to it, but most of the details have slipped my mind. Does any one remember >it? Know who organized it? Know if it was archived anywhere? > > Best, > > Don Byrd Don, There was a renga for Ginsberg after his death. Is that what you're thinking of? It was in the Fall of 97 (?), I think. Shouldn't it be archived in the Buffalo website? Grant ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 10:54:27 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Weiss Subject: FYI--Academy of American Poets Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Here's an AP story that may be of interest to the group. U.S. Academy of Poets Diversifies By BETH J. HARPAZ .c The Associated Press NEW YORK (AP) -- All it took to shake up the Academy of American Poets were a few harsh words. A year after it was criticized by two of its own as a bastion of white male elitism, the academy's board of chancellors is adding nine new members -- five of them female, two of them black and several of them known for their experimental styles. ``What we've set out to accomplish is to make this group more representative of the breadth and spectrum of poetry in America today,'' executive director Bill Wadsworth said Monday. ``The creaky rusty sound you're hearing now -- that's the gates of the academy of the future slowly opening,'' said Bob Holman, co-producer of the PBS series ``The United States of Poetry.'' Last fall, chancellors Carolyn Kizer and Maxine Kumin resigned to protest the board's lack of diversity. Wadsworth said their resignations and other criticisms prompted the changes. The new members are Lucille Clifton, Robert Creeley, Louise Gluck, Yusef Komunyakaa, Heather McHugh, Michael Palmer, Adrienne Rich, Rosanna Warren and Charles Wright. Ms. Clifton and Komunyakaa are black. Creeley and Palmer write in experimental styles. Ms. Clifton was pleased at the diversity of the new board. ``It's lots of patches in a quilt -- all of them part of the American quilt,'' she said. The new chancellors join John Ashbery, Jorie Graham, John Hollander, Richard Howard, Donald Justice, J.D. McClatchy, W.S. Merwin, Mark Strand and David Wagoner. All of them are white; Ms. Graham is the only woman. ``I'm delighted at the reorganization and I think it was worth all we went through in resigning, which was rather painful, although we had dozens of letters in support from all over the country, which was gratifying,'' said Ms. Kizer, who lives in Sonoma, Calif. ``The new group includes a couple of African-Americans who are distinguished poets, and that's a big step forward.'' Joseph Parisi, editor of Poetry magazine in Chicago, said: ``These are all people of great accomplishment. ... The reconstituted chancellorship is more representative of what's going on now.'' ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 14:12:56 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "P.Standard Schaefer" Subject: rhizome info Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit For those of you who have asked, Rhizome is currently reading for the fourth issue and will be reading until July 15. So send your poems by then. Of the utmost interest to us, however, is sharp reviews, essays, and translations. So if you have something to say about a book, please consider sending your review to us. Books that I want reviewed include: M. Davidson's ARCADE, M. Bellen's TALES OF MURASAKI, L. Browns THE AGENCY OF WIND, the forthcoming Italian anthology by Sun & Moon Press, Carl Martin's GENII OVER SALZBURG, and the Hejinian/Scalapino collaboration SIGHT. Laura Moriarty's THE CASE, and Joan Retallack's HOW TO DO THINGS WITH WORDS.... ... .(A VERY PARTIAL LIST). For translations, I'm sort of more interested in South Americans and Italians these days than the very well-represented French. contact me either at ssschaefer@aol.com or at 366 S. Mentor Ave. #108, Pasadena, CA 91106. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 11:27:01 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Pete Neufeld Subject: Re: gender class poetics poetry MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" "Furthermore, there is no necessary or predetermined relation between class and poetic production. The meaning of those pressures and how they shape a life/work is a matter of careful study and analysis of particular situations." I just wanted to interject at this point how important I think it is to mark this distinction, which Grant Jenkins brings up, clearly, because I think any discussion of "classing" poetry and the production of poetries teeters at the brink of overdetermining this relationship, which I think certainly exists. The question is relational, not absolute-- and there are some classifications that pass for "class" in the interpretation of poetry that I would resist-- the hack Marxism that equates "difficult" with "bourgeois." The conditions of literary production are more interesting than gathering up the 1040's of American poets and making a list for the modern state. It is also a distinction that produces meaning on the reader's side of things. Tentatively, I would venture that it may not be an intention in writing, but a condition, or perhaps more productive to caste it so. It is a concern one can foreground and trace through the reading of a text, or an author's work, or so on. And it is always there. And I think when one reads with these concerns one takes an aesthetic to its most radical limit and asks how it relates to that other of itself, the real (whatever that might be) that the words are pointing towards or perhaps pointing in. And I would further venture that there is an overwhelming tendency (perhaps an Academic tendency (and I don't think "Academic" is a bad word, I even like some of them)) to look at literary movements as solely aesthetic resolutions, conflicts, reconciliations-- working outside of, or having an alterity to, the activities of the historically happening world of existence. I don't think either need cancel the other out, but establish an economy of reading which for me means introducing ethics into the discussion of the poetical, and specifically I'm thinking here that maybe Pound is the test for the this kind of reading or maybe even better, Dickinson. I'm just going to stop right here. Peter ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 15:37:09 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Kathleen Crown Subject: announcing HOW2, a new on-line journal Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" HOW2 Poetry's renegade path, as practiced by Twentieth Century women writers & scholars ___________ . HOW2 will extend the alternatives and borders of HOW(ever) by going on-line and global. It will be edited tri-annually. . HOW2 will focus on innovative reading/s--writing in answer to other writing, from opened perspectives & models. It will publish new works inside and out of the poem's genre; originals & reprints of essays; reflections, letters, journals, paragraphs, graphics; in-progress drafts, research, translations, alphabets, cross-overs. HOW2 http://www.departments.bucknell.edu/stadler_center/how2 Inquiries to: or Stay tuned! An archive of the hard-to-find print issues of _HOW(ever)_, published between 1981and 1992, will soon be available at Rutgers University Libraries, where the HOW2 website (archive and template for new issues) was designed and produced -- thanks to Miriam Bartha, current director of the "Poetry and the Public Sphere," and to the Rutgers-Princeton Center for Electronic Texts in the Humanities. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 13:29:17 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Pete Neufeld Subject: Reading Announcement MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Anne Carson, the noted poet and Hellenist from McGill University will = be reading at San Francisco State University=A0 on=A0 Tuesday,=A0 April 6, = 7:30 pm, in the Humanities Building room 281. This event is sponsored by the = Classic Students Association. I hope that many of you will be able to make this event.=A0 Please backchannel any questions or for directions.=A0=A0 =A0Thanks. Pete Neufeld. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 23:53:05 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Linda Russo Subject: Re: Page Daughters & the Microwaveable Feast MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >I think part of the problem is that I feel still quite young as a poet, >perhaps I do not understand my poetics and influences and 'points' NOW as I >will THEN. This is certain, no? or is it uncertain? I'm not so sure one understands one's poetics as much as one keeps them on as active and productive uncertainties. page mother kathleen fraser provides instruction in this area, in her letter to Andrea in her poem "Five letters from one window, San Gimignano, May 1981), which is available on her author page at the EPC. she writes: "one might sometimes think I was returning to the style of work i did twenty years ago . . . still i am just as uncertain and resistant, at the beginning of each work attempted, as I ever was . . . I'm trying to find a way to include these states of uncertainty" So are 'we' at once in the shadow the shadow of uncertainty and overdetermination? Probably just being good little feminists if we are. which reminds me, ally mcbeal, a cultural worker? because she gets away with wearing a goofy sock hat? she _still_ makes me feel inadequate. >What was R Wolff's manifesto? she posted it here a while back. I don't remember what the subject line was. it was in relation to the journal she edits. (and to which I partially respond to in a post i am writing in my response to joel's response to page mothers, which i am working on, and rewriting, so it doesn't sound too much like a manifesto) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 22:12:11 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tenney Nathanson Subject: POG: David Shapiro events (Arizona Quarterly Symposium; Tucson Poetry Festival) Comments: To: tn aruba MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Poet, art critic, and musician David Shapiro will be featured in several events this coming Friday, Saturday, and Sunday, associated with both the Arizona Quarterly annual Symposium and the Tucson Poetry Festival (Shapiro's Poetry Festival reading is co-sponsored by POG). On Friday at 8pm, Shapiro and Charles Bernstein will read to open the Poetry Festival. Temple of Music and Art. On Saturday, at 10am, Shapiro will give the concluding presentation at the Arizona Quarterly Symposium (which begins on Thursday): "Poetry and Architecture: A Reading." The Symposium takes place at the "Swede Johnson" Alumni Building, NW corner of Speedway & Cherry; all events free and open to the public. On Saturday afternoon at 2, Shapiro, Bernstein, and the other Tucson Poetry Festival featured poets will be part of a panel discussion on "Poetry and the Sacred." Temple of Music and Art. On Sunday morning at 10, Shapiro will hold his Small Group Session for the Festival. Temple of Music and Art. * DAVID SHAPIRO, poet, art critic, and musician, has written more than twenty books since his first was published when he was eighteen years old. These books include Lateness, To an Idea, and House (Blown Apart), and the recent After a Lost Original (all from The Overlook Press). His many awards include the Zabel Prize from the American Academy and Institute of Arts and Letters, a Merrill Foundation grant, a Book of the Month Club Award, and a nomination for the National Book Award. As a critic he has written on both poetry and art, with books on John Ashbery, Piet Mondrian, Jasper Johns, and Jim Dine. Shapiro holds a Ph.D. from Columbia and has taught at Princeton, Brooklyn College, and at Cooper Union. Since 1980 he has taught a seminar at Cooper Union’s Channin School of Architecture. A forthcoming book by Shapiro, to be published by Cooper Union, is a collaboration with Jacques Derrida. Shapiro is also an active playwright and exhibiting visual artist. To the Earth (by David Shapiro) I fell with my father through space Madly in love with the earth The POG Poets & Artists Series is supported in part with grants from the Arizona Commission on the Arts and the Tucson/Pima Arts Council. mailto:tenney@azstarnet.com mailto:nathanso@u.arizona.edu http://www.u.arizona.edu/~nathanso ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 08:01:20 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maria Damon Subject: Darkroom Collective? In-Reply-To: <01J8XN1TTTWY920H5D@drew.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" can anybody send me (backchannel) the e and snail mail addresses for members of the Darkroom Collective? I don't think they meet any longer, but i'd like to contact them about this special Bob Kaufman issue. thanks in advance. (aldon, are you out there?)--md ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 07:22:19 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rebecca Wolff Subject: Re: shifts in modalities In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" You need only take a look at the dismal thing that is the lowgrade grad seminar at the middle-ground state university in which, say, a bunch of middle class folks who "love books" or in this case "love poetry" and want to write papers about it and teach it are being agonizingly weaned by a well-trained, frustrated professorial practitioner who got her pHd, needless to say, somewhere entirely else, away from the practice of looking for "what it means" and toward the practice of coming up with salient materialistic points for their inevitably crappy papers to know why this particular shift will be the death of all joy in poetry. I have no doubt that it will happen, and it will suck. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 07:37:03 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rebecca Wolff Subject: Re: gender class poetics poetry In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" This [the posting about S. Howe's particularities] is exactly what I was talking about earlier when I said that "it [the shift into classrooms producing critics whose facilities are lamed] will happen and it will suck." I do not want to know what Susan Howe's family home was like and I do not want to know what her husband does for a living. Cultural studies is simple biographical criticism in thin disguise: an excuse for sensationalism and for those who are uncomfortable with ambiguity to write about where their subject was born and how many doctors were around the table, color of baby blanket, etc. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 09:56:34 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: Re: what poetry's for MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain a basic defining human activity as much sense to say *we* exist in order to do it, as it does delusion that it "exists for something." not apprehendable in terms of function ain't a functional thing (..it is more an activity than a thing, in fact, but that's another post...) said mark prejsanar sonar is no marking of the sky what is poetry for ? the object/process bit rears its head (..it is more an activity than a thing, in fact this is another post...) says the interventionist i am entertained by the suspicion that 'poetry' as category term is too something leads us down dark pathways toward definitions that seem fixed as in the price of fixity is unintelligibility mark says it's a basic defining human activity and i want to say it cd be but that this sounds apologetic eulogistic even [taking my terms from Buchler who i don't even like too much] i question how much utility there is in posing poetry as this primal human attribute as it's too easy to imagine there being no poetry at all mark further then he does etxt as i do revise; as much sense to say *we* exist in order to do it, as it does delusion that it "exists for something." yes yes me up and down to this unless "exists for nothing" is not apprehendable in terms of function ain't a functional thing because i think (doesn't 'mean' i am) but cdn't it be cdn't, not 'poetry' but a poem be a functional thing i'm trying to do that now and then others are too i know examples etc that 'resolution of art object and art process' piece poem as 'thought experiment' ? )L ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 12:23:43 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Eryque Gleason Subject: Re: Renga In-Reply-To: <36F7260E.374B3FF7@nycap.rr.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT don, i think it was list requirement at the time to participate or forever suffer the disdain of people who have more words than they know what to do with. if i remember right, jordan davis and bill lluoma were among the most prlific renga-ers. On Tue, 23 Mar 1999, Don Byrd wrote: > Some time back--my sense of chronology is never too good-- > there was a renga project on the net. I think I may have actually contributed > to it, but most of the details have slipped my mind. Does any one remember > it? Know who organized it? Know if it was archived anywhere? > > Best, > > Don Byrd > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 13:02:38 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Andrew Rathmann Subject: Re: Carl Martin Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear Standard: I was surprised by Martin's book as well. Growing up in Winston-Salem, North Carolina, he was a regular at poetry and music events; I remember him giving some readings in the early 1980s. I assume that he still lives there. I don't think he works (though I'm not sure of this), and if information doesn't have him listed, you might try contacting him care of the English Department at Wake Forest University (I believe that he has taught some classes through them). All the best, Devin Johnston ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Chicago Review The University of Chicago 5801 South Kenwood Avenue Chicago IL 60637 ph/fax: (773) 702-0887 e-mail: chicago-review@uchicago.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 01:58:44 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "A. Jenn Sondheim" Subject: TWELVE HUNDRED BANGS FROM A SLAUGHTER (fwd) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII \ TWELVE HUNDRED BANGS FROM A SLAUGHTER BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! 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BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 18:17:41 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Grant Jenkins Subject: defensive poetry In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >This [the posting about S. Howe's particularities] is exactly what I was >talking about earlier when I said that "it [the shift into classrooms >producing critics whose facilities are lamed] will happen and it will >suck." I do not want to know what Susan Howe's family home was like and I >do not want to know what her husband does for a living. Cultural studies is >simple biographical criticism in thin disguise: an excuse for >sensationalism and for those who are uncomfortable with ambiguity to write >about where their subject was born and how many doctors were around the >table, color of baby blanket, etc. Well, I guess I should come to my own defense--if I am able, being only a lame, lowgrade academic. All snideness aside, I have a question for you, Rebecca: what exactly then do you think is the "joy of poetry"? What I can gather from reading the texts of Susan Howe--letters, poems, journals, marginalia--that it is precisely the textual particulars of another that she finds to be the "joy of poetry." Reading Melville's Marginalia, a colletion of his notations in books he was reading, inspired her to write a poem that exposes the irony, uncertainty, and change in not only Melville's "life" but also in history (another text). Immersing herself in the manuscripts of Emily Dickinson, Howe reclaims and reconsiders Dickinson in a feminist context. I read much joy, Susan's and mine, in both of those works. The joy comes not just from the work but that it was written, by someone. This is not biographical criticism because it does not distinguish between a "text" and a "life." Both are in language yet bear the traces of another person who chose to write. Nor is this mere cultural criticism, as you would have it. It's what Peter Neufeld in his post refered to as an ethics that calls for a consideration of the uncertainty and alterity that mark our reading of an other's texts. There is more at stake than just figuring out "what it means." Anyway, I don't know to many academics who have this goal. (Isn't so much of the poetry that we all enjoy and feel invested in marked by a blur between poetry and criticism? Must we draw that line in the sand again? Why?) For me, the joy of poetry comes not just from New Critically reading (or writing) the Genius of a poem, In Itself. But from following the textual threads out of the work and into other texts and other uncertainties, ad infinitum. Not knowing "what it means" is the greatest joy. Grant ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 18:32:22 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Linda Russo Subject: Re: Page Mothers & Delinquent Daughters MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit re Nancy's discussion of Sianne Ngai's "Poetics of Disgust" > Linda, thanks for the long and thoughful post. can you clarify the clause > "criticized on the basis of it's having been carelessly read"? you're welcome. Nancy seems to think it is a viable formulation of a cultural poetics that has been overlooked as such. She didn't cite any specific readings or criticisms on Silliman's part or anyone else's. also, what > evidence do you or did Shaw feel supports the notion that people are ignoring > Sianne's essay in the "group-manifesto" sense? it seems obvious to me at > least that the essay, with an editorial thrust by jeff derksen, functions > exactly in this way. now if you take the essay (which is part of a larger > piece/project i know little about--might be a dissertation) out of open letter > it would appear to me to to function a lot less in this traditional group > forming negativity sense. and i suppose i would be more inclined to meet the > essay in this context. i guess i see the group manifesto thing as played out. > not that groups aren't happening or that groups aren't primary to > "advancement" (i get by with a little help from my friends), but i believe > once you start defining groups on paper with poems and essays then eventually > those definitions, which appear fixed in print, will come back to haunt you. > so that you get exclusion problems, who's in who's out problems, correct form > problems, race gender and class problems, people who think they're in one > group fighting against people who think they're in another group, etc. eg l-p > looks to be led by white prose-poetry writing poem-essay blurring hetero males > seeking out the academic sinecures of the mark strands of the world. i'm not > saying that's the case or even that it's an intelligent way to read the l-p > phenom. but it can be read that way. and we should keep in mind Dodie's good > point about revisionism re Shange. I don't really se 'group project'. I see people talking about things, and those things materializing in the small press. What's interesting is what serves to 'group' these people. location? politics? aesthetics? this list? gender? I disagree with your description of Language groups as "led by white prose-poetry writing poem-essay blurring hetero males seeking out the academic sinecures of the mark strands of the world." Duplessis, Hejinian, Howe, Scalapino, and Fraser have all written essays and some even books, or have in some other way, as teachers or as editors, assumed leadership positions. But I see your response as evidence of the problem implicit in the gender dynamics of the small press. More men edit, more men publish, thus more men control the means through which poetries and ideas are materialized, and so there are more men leaving a 'paper trail' -- those cultural artefacts that we so love. A second 'problem' -- these women are probably partly obscured by their 'dual' concern with feminism and poetics. Poetry is as much about having a gender as not, yet women, as other, have assume the responsibility of addressing this issue. I don't see a lang-po group -- the connections are made variously. But they can only be grouped on the basis of some particularity of their engagement and not generally. Its this sort of insistence, I hear from Eliz. Treadwell and Rachel Daley and others recently on this list, the insistence on a group (generation as a group) to emerge that 'blinds' one to the groups that are emerging. part of Nancy's talk, which doesn't bear thru in an account of her reading of Ngai only, is the issue of shifting modalities, and the recognition of those as such. > to me it seems more important (now) to look for commonalities among different > groupings and try to create permeable groups, to seek out many to many > relationships. I would tend to agree but then your terms are so general here that I'm not sure what I'd be agreeing with. What do you mean by grouping -- a sort of self-selection? or that of the taxonomist? We can't first look for commonalities without first deigning to articulate them, no? But these writings would then be your "ghosts"? How does one proceed? > > Bill Luoma ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 18:41:14 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Linda Russo Subject: Re: shifts in modalities MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit hi tom. I agree with you on some problems in Ngai's argument. As a diagnostic a poetics of disgust does help identity a particular grammar ("raw matter"). but i'm not sure there's much cultural work being done in that. it's culturally aware in that it views the poetics as a response to culture. Ngai would like to push that into an area where it will do actual ideological batle with democratic pluralism which would exclude disgust as a reaction. On the other hand, she want to argue that 'raw matter' doesn't 'mean' but 'be's' (with a nod to mark Presjnar's recent post) but i'm not sure this isn't so much more of the 'subversiveness' which she tries to separate it from. I'm not sure, but I think by 'subversiveness' she means that which is merely textual? Or a position assumed as a reaction that isn't really effective? As 'material' as such a poetics is (@%$#!! and [] being some of its more material gestures, those that 'be') it's still only language, still implicit in language as a referential system (she wants to say we 'turn away' from those gestures [as in disgust] but maybe we just step over them so to speak?), and still not bodies thrown in the line of fire so to speak. She brings up a useful warning against the idea of 'eclecticism' however which would obscure the sort of taxonomies that both you tom and Bill luoma seem to desire. Again it's with reference to this concept that she tries to push a POD in the direction of the political, but in the end it still seems like an analogy to me. * * * * Linda Russo lvrusso@acsu.buffalo.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 18:53:47 -0500 Reply-To: levitsk@ibm.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rachel Levitsky Subject: a pole query: Poets for Justice for Diallo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Al Sharpton vowed arrests everyday until the four officers are indicted for the Amadou Diallo killing. He has made good on his promise--a prolongued strategy which has allowed other slower moving groups to join this campaign challenging Police Brutishness. I have heard from activists that these arrests, at 12 noon at Police Plaza have been very calm and non-eventful (all walking, no resisting) and the consequences have been a mere Desk Appearance Ticket, most of which end up being dismissed, and that notables and non notables have been treated alike. I am wondering, if there would be folks out there willing to partake in this symbolic arrest, some time next week, date to be determined. Of course at any time these events can be cancelled, especially if the officers are indicted,which they may be next week. Backchannel if you are interested. No polemics on Sharpton please. thanks, Rachel ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 20:43:39 -0500 Reply-To: levitsk@ibm.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rachel Levitsky Subject: Subway Sonnets by Steve Fried MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A coworker with whom I teach CUNY writing test prep (wat) for the union 1199 wrote the following. Let me know if I should post more. --R. Levitsky Sonnets from the Job from Subway Sonnets Steve Fried coeurl@aol.com 5. The rudeness by which a student will stand up and come, during class discussion, to my desk to ask a question about homework tops my list of the insensitive and pesky behaviors that betoken fear... of what but success, progress, learning as a nut rust-locked to threads it cannot climb or fall but sits becoming one with its bolt in a rotting way that spreads, infecting all the process with its broad assumption that learning is the province of some race or class or caste or code or outward grace and not the democratic saving spot of shine where rust flakes off without a trace. 6. What the administrator doesn't know is that our students, people who're on jobs closer to war than she will ever go, need not the pose of friendship, sweetened so it patronizes, but not to be robbed of their time and strength in such short supply that just getting to class is winning one of a few battles in the whole long day with odds as good as crooked books would lay on fights of men with pens with men with guns. The fallacy is sharper than the sword when bureaucrats play numbers with the need of people whom momentum forces toward an end that rescues or an end that bleeds. 13. A test, like toilets, functions in a stall designed to catch and conduit the work of thought and body, and raise animal maneuvers to the status of elite and esoteric dance-steps: fighters' tricks taught to a handful of combative feet and practiced against bound bundles of sticks on petaled mountainsides that early spring when gray thaw water loosened under crusts of twig-enciphered ice that, cracking, sings down breezes that unbend bodies of grass against all gravity. Their gestures dust heaven with autumn's water to amass cumulus continensts that pass the test. 27. A confrontation at a meeting starts a chain of phonecalls, more meetings, advice on how, without offending, to impart our distress at our new bosses' attacks on how we teach and whom, at more-than-twice- posed questions answered only with fog, stacked decks of stock response and blood-ugly lies that what we teach is not about the tests our students must pass to, in their own eyes, be whole and ready to pursue courses out of dying jobs, wield instruments against breathed roach-dust that stops breath or the fell force of race hate that buys Giuliani's votes and police batons across their children's throats. 28. Off to meet with a new class, my ennui becomes a headwind against which I tack and, in the face of each resistance, lose the slightest will to move, until money asserts its primacy and sends me out to test the classroom weather, and there tout learning as something that deserves desire, as if where it has brought and left me proves it worth calories to make bodies move against such wind's enmity, through such fires as blow and burn between ourselves and it -- as if, besides this paper's freight of scrawl that moves me line by line from world to wall it bespoke lore that found love, or paid debts. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 18:00:11 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Weiss Subject: query--poetry project newsletter Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Heard a rumor today that I hope is unfounded that the St Marks Poetry Project Newsletter is soon to be no more. Confirm, deny, or elucidate? ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 22:44:37 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Kevin L. Magee" Subject: Re: Henry's interest in destinato critico MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here and There Here is the negative. Over there where you are. Here? Yes, sir. That is the way you saw it? Yes, that is the way you saw it. That is not the picture they taken the date that parked pop truck was here. Before it goes into the, into the furnace. Always something in the factory or something like that. Somewhere around there. If you wanted to check it out, you could check it out, if not you didn't have to. Hold it a minute. I think over here, about there. Coming out there, come right here. Come right on back here, right there, about right in here, and like this pulls out of here over there. Do you have a picture? There is no picture. The police taken pictures. Yes, ma'am. Pull around from here to there. Yes, ma'am. "Here" and "there" is a curtain place. Pull around there about from here to that chair, and it stayed there, about down to the back of the chair, back here. The chair in the last row? Yes, the back row of chairs from where you are to the back row. You are as far from where you were to what period of time did you work at Winn-Dixie. Do you remember when a man come out to talk to you, and there was a red-haired young lady making some notes? She was writing down the things being said. I was out there. I was already out there. And then my boss said, "What the hell, he wasn't even out there." No, I was already out there. After he left, he talked to me. After they got done calling me. The guy said he was hollering the way he was going on there. I told him a lot more than that. You all in here, somewhere around there. She knew the ropes, things like that. She was like trying to train me. It wasn't like I didn't pay no attention. What they had trained me for was a mold instrumentor. And then they said it and it got bigger and popular. Admonitions. Go out there hollering. It is putting platinum wire on a jet propeller. P.S. Dear Henry, last Saturday Miguel Rubio was writing a parapgraph for me and wrote down this word --pressing pen hard on to page, like he was carving it-- e x s p e c i a l i l y, which brought to mind my own e x s p e s s h a l l y, spoken 22 years ago this April in a community college in Plantation, Florida (my hometown). "Get rid of that X." "It sounds ignorant." On the table were letters of recommendation (her idea, not mine) to Vanderbilt, Princeton and Yale (I made it as far north as New Orleans--for a year). Why is educated english so afraid of the X? That's how they said it in elizabethan england according to my original spelling edition of shaxespear. My students from the east side of Cleveland come down hard on the X--chewing it, enjoying it, refusing to give it up--and I never admonish them (my Adorno: "the poor chew words to fill their bellies") so I would speak to your yearning for "black speech": I listen for it listening and trying hard to relearn the eloquent vernacular of the north american working class that I readily sacrificed--buried, really--so severely that when I walked into a room in Des Moines in 1987 to meet with agitators getting jobs in the slaughterhouses their leader, whom I'd already met and spoken with, whose own folks he'd said had been sharecroppers in Mississippi, laughed out loud the brave heart's laugh as soon as I opened my mouth. "There," he said, "didn't I tell you he had a British accent?" It is called CLASS BETRAYAL, but that is not the right word. Kevin ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 00:43:35 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: AERIALEDGE@AOL.COM Subject: Integrity & Dramatic Life by Anselm Berrigan Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Edge books is absolutely pleased to announce publication of _Integrity & Dramatic Life_ by Anslem Berrigan. 64 pgs, perfectbound. Regularly $10, special to the Poetics List $7.50 until April 15. Or receiv= e _Sight_ by Lyn Hejinian and Leslie Scalpino and _Integrity & Dramatic Life= _, both books for $15. Email your address & we will send you an SASE for paym= ent or mail your check to the address at the end of this post. Publisher's Weekly says "Berrigan's book is a rare, beautiful keeper." See here: A brooding intellect injected into the effusive lyricism of the New York School makes Berrigan's famous parentage--he is the son of poets Ted Berri= gan and Alice Notley--an inheritance he self-awarely transforms. Berrigan is n= ot so much undoing intellectualism as trying to wear it lightly, and lyricize= it in ways that may at first resemble the work of Ron Padgett, but comes clos= er to the more sublimated pleasures of John Ashbery: "Do I have to slip into = a box/ To prove my disinterest in watching my step?" Berrigan posits a kind = of detachment that can co-exist with a heavily marked social calendar ("the p= hone never rings I never get it when it does"), yet is wryly aware that as a po= et "you can get a medal for running in circles, that's integrity for you," an= d thus balances the sometime solemnity of art with a "dramatic life" that ca= n "instantly trivialize anything." At the tender age of 26, Berrigan is a ma= ster of the exuberant, and reading the book straight through can somewhat dimin= ish the quirky insights and intense subjectivity of the individual poems. Yet = the pathos of "8/1/97"; the slower, intimate, tenderness of "To what end is wh= at we got..."; and the formal quatrains that appear at the end of the sprawli= ng poem "Ghost Town"-"To be as strange as what/ The heart contains as method/= Of departure it makes sense/ To shake when approaching"-evidence an impressiv= e tonal range. An exciting debut that taunts its own allure-"Catullus didn't= / Have to go down on the mic"--Berrigan's book is a rare, beautiful keeper. =09=09=09=09=09--Publisher=92s Weekly 3/29/99 Anselm Berrigan's poems, in Integrity & Dramatic Life, seem almost as much like natural objects as anything constructed-a waterfall of inevitable beauty. But built they are, of course, & very cannily. Here is someone who= has been absorbing poetry all his life, exactly as Ken Griffey Jr. picked up baseball, with equally spectacular, seemingly effortless results. His poem= s are so good you can read them backwards or forwards or standing on your he= ad; they sing in every direction. "Simply the best we have." =09=09=09 =09=09=09=09=09--Elinor Nauen Marvelous. Terrific. Gorgeous. Anselm Berrigan's Integrity and Dramatic Li= fe tells stories about being young and living in a city and having love for others. Here the poems are so rich with connection they change one's life = for the better. =09=09=09=09=09--Juliana Spahr AERIAL/EDGE They Beat Me Over the Head With a Sack, Anslem Berrigan, $5. Integrity & Dramatic Life, Anselm Berrigan, $10. the julia set, Jean Donnelly, $4. Marijuana Softdrink, Buck Downs, forthcoming 1999. World Prefix, Harrison Fisher, $4. Metropolis 16-20, Rob Fitterman, $5. perhaps this is a rescue fantasy, Heather Fuller, $10. Sight, Lyn Hejinian and Leslie Scalapino, $12. Late July, Gretchen Johnsen, $3. Asbestos, Wayne Kline, $6. Stepping Razor, A.L. Nielsen, $9. Errata 5uite, Joan Retallack, $8. Dogs, Phyllis Rosenzweig, $5. Aerial 9: Bruce Andrews, Rod Smith ed., $15, forthcoming May1999. Aerial 8: Barrett Watten, Rod Smith ed., $15. Aerial 6/7 featuring John Cage, Rod Smith ed., $15. Aerial 5 featuring Harryman/Hejinian, Darragh/Retallack, Rod Smith ed., $7.50. On Your Knees, Citizen: A Collection of "Prayers" for the "Public" [School= s], Rod Smith, Lee Ann Brown, and Mark Wallace, eds., $6. Cusps, Chris Stroffolino, $2.50. Nothing Happened and Besides I Wasn''t There, Mark Wallace, $9.50. Orders to: Aerial/Edge, POBox 25642, Washington, DC 20007. Thanks. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 01:36:23 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Catherine Daly Subject: was gender class etc. & also Loyola readings Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I think it was David Bromige (sp?) who posted the Loyola readings listing; thank you. I enjoyed the reading. Started a bit late: the campus church bells rang eight WAY before Willis and Gizzi started. Also re: the gender/class discussion. I came across this Turing test site: http://www.cs.bilkent.edu.tr/~psaygin/ttest.html I had forgotten the test was a man, a woman, and a questioner... Now if the questions were poems, or a corpse, then... And if only male engineers (working class or professional?) construct the machine... Regards, Catherine Daly cadaly@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 20:08:42 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "A. Jenn Sondheim" Subject: Help B92 campaign started tonight (fwd) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII ---------- Forwarded message ---------- D-ate: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 23:37:09 +0100 (CET) F-rom: sjoera nas T-o: nettime-l@Desk.nl S-ubject: Help B92 campaign started tonight Pressrelease March 24th 1999 Help B92 and the independent media in Yugoslavia Latest news at http://helpB92.xs4all.nl Last night the transmitter of radio B92 from Belgrade was confiscated by the Serbian authorities. The editor-in-chief, Veran Matic, was held in custody in a police station for well over 8 hours. Despite this intimidation the station continues its independent news service. At De Balie in Amsterdam a support group has been founded tonight, which intends to support B92 and other independent media in Yugoslavia where possible in the continuation of these important news services. With the support of internetprovider XS4ALL B92 also transmits its signals via internet since december 1996. These digital broadcasts are picked up by the BBC Worldservice and retransmitted via satellite. Through a network of local radio stations the programs of B92 can be heard throughout Serbia, despite repeated attempts by the authorities to silence the station. At this moment it is still possible to follow the broadcasts of Radio B92 in real audio on their website, at http://www.b92.net In light of the current tense situation it is very likely that the possibilities of B92 to continue its independent news service will be limited even further. The support group therefore intends to take measures to distribute news by and about B92 from Amsterdam. For that purpose a special website has been opened at http://helpB92.xs4all.nl B92 is the backbone of the independent news service in Yugoslavia. Without immediate financial support this last source of independent news for the inhabitants of this region is endangered. A fundraising campaign is being started by the support group, in order to send money and equipment to B92 and other independent radio stations in Serbia and Kosovo as soon as possible. The founders of the support group are: B92, De Balie, De Digitale Stad, Next 5 Minutes, Press Now, radioqualia (Australia), De Waag (MONM) en XS4ALL. The Postbank account for donations is 7676, made payable to Press Now in Amsterdam, please specify "Help B92". For more information or to send messages of support, please e-mail helpB92@xs4all.nl. You can also digitally support this initiative by copying the special logo onto your website and linking to Help B92. --- # distributed via nettime-l : no commercial use without permission # is a closed moderated mailinglist for net criticism, # collaborative text filtering and cultural politics of the nets # more info: majordomo@desk.nl and "info nettime-l" in the msg body # URL: http://www.desk.nl/~nettime/ contact: nettime-owner@desk.nl ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 00:32:08 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: dbkk@SIRIUS.COM Subject: Stevens date Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi everyone, this is Kevin Killian, I'm writing an article on the actress Julie Newmar and would like to know--real quick--what is the year Wallace Stevens wrote "Anecdote of the Jar"? Please respond back channel to yours truly and thanks to everyone. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 11:58:10 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkward Ubutronics Subject: Re: Armand Schwerner Tablets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Im working on a piece for armand schwerner & am having an impossible time finding anything from the tablets on the net, (if I go interlibrary loan it could take months out here), does anyone out there in popoland have ecopy of any, or know of any secret websites that may have excerpts? (who knows maybe alta vista is a shitty searchengine.) Or mayhaps someone is courageous enuf to key in their own favorite or lovely sections & post it herefront. just doesn't feel the sample without one-liners, something abt community. miekal ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 13:14:11 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Prejsnar Subject: Re: what poetry's for In-Reply-To: <5D5C5C8C3A41D211893900A024D4B97C44519D@md.facstaff.oglethorpe.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII My claim has nothing to do with whether or not we can imagine there being no poetry. I'm not interested in developing a highly generalized anthropological theory. Poetry is a basic defining activity because it is one of the things (like music, baseball, juggling, physics, Monty Python) wherein people stretch out from what has been, into some dynamic and interesting thing-that-wasn't-there-before ("thing" meaning in this case as much an active involvement as a material object...) And such stretching seems to me definitive of what is most interesting about us. It is precisely because we can imagine humans without poetry, that poetry becomes exciting, and worthwhile... No doubt my "basic defining activity" phrase was in some ways not the best for saying what i meant....But i was (and still am) trying to stress primarily the fact that poetry (and all similar art-activities) are things we do 'cause they are more enriching and more fun than...well, than not doing them. They should not be seen in functionalist terms and do not have a purpose. Mp On Tue, 23 Mar 1999, Lowther,John wrote: > a basic > defining human activity > > as much sense > to say *we* exist > in order to do it, > as it does delusion > that it "exists for something." > > not apprehendable in terms of function > ain't a functional thing > > (..it is more an > activity than a thing, in fact, but that's another post...) > > said mark prejsanar > > sonar > is no marking of the sky > > what is poetry for ? > > the object/process bit rears its head > (..it is more an > activity than a thing, in fact > > this is another post...) > says the interventionist > > i am entertained by the suspicion that 'poetry' > as category term > is too something leads us down dark pathways toward definitions > that seem > > fixed > as in > the price of fixity is unintelligibility > > mark says > it's a basic > defining human activity > > and i want to say it cd be > but that this sounds apologetic > eulogistic even > [taking my terms from Buchler > who i don't even like too much] > > i question how much utility there is > in posing poetry as this primal human attribute > as it's too easy > to imagine there being no poetry at all > > mark further then he does etxt as i do revise; > as much sense > to say *we* exist > in order to do it, > as it does delusion > that it "exists for something." > > yes > yes me up and down to this > unless > "exists for nothing" is > > not apprehendable in terms of function > ain't a functional thing > > because i think (doesn't 'mean' i am) > but > cdn't it be > cdn't, not 'poetry' > but a poem > be a functional thing > i'm trying to do that now and then others are too i know examples > etc > > that 'resolution of art object and art process' piece > > poem as 'thought experiment' > > ? > > > > )L > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 17:01:23 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: WENDY KRAMER Organization: N/A Subject: Ray Johnson Review MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thrill compels me again to say a little of what i've recently seen. A retrospective of the collagist and mail artist Ray Johnson closed last Sunday at the Whitney Museum, and i could cry like a toddler to make it come back and stay a little longer. Three and a half hours of a Thursday afternoon in those marvelous rooms wasn't nearly enough time in Ray Johnson's filial company. The only things of his that i'd seen before this exhibit were a few items in the Jargon archive at the Poetry Collection in Buffalo, and the Black Mountain College Dossier series book #4 that came out a couple of years ago. This exhibit, then, gave me a bigger window to press my nose to: forty-five-odd years' worth of window, arranged chronologically (the exhibitors admitted that they'd set it up by time despite Ray Johnson's distrust of chronology, not to mention his antagonism towards museum exhibitions themselves. Still, hearkening back to an earlier List discussion over the value of archiving the avant-garde, the Ray Johnson exhibit was an example of such value to those artists/poets who, had it not been saved and later presented,would not have gotten to see the work at all. Moreover, it was a way to absorb at least some of the scope and continuity of Johnson's lifelong activity). The exhibit began with some early paintings and collages; then, in the second room, it introduced Johnson's invention of the "moticos" (an anagram of the word"osmotic"). Like Schwitters's "merz" and Rauschenberg's "combine," Johnson's "moticos" is his term for his collage/assemblage work at that time (beginning sometime in the fifties). I was confused by the exhibit's description of what makes a moticos a moticos -- it seemed to have to do with a moticos being made of multiple kinds of material, including photographs, various kinds of paper, inks and washes, etc., but the collaging itself was clear: here was the beginning of a long and involved project of literal building and wordplay. Moving into the late 50s and into the 60s, the collages get chunky 3-d, with stacks of cardboard "tesserae" (a critic's term for Johnson's mosaic-like sanded, painted, and/or buffed blocks) abounding -- O, man after my own corrugated cardboard heart! oh joy! In "let it all hang out," the tesserae fell loosely into a pile towards the bottom of the piece. . . Lovely chaos! It went on endlessly. There were portrait collages, which he created by drawing a subject's silhoutte and then making and re-making series of collages out of it, sometimes referring to different people than the ones he was supposedly portraying (it put me in mind of Gertrude Stein, of whom Johnson was a fan). In an accompanying videotaped interview with one of the portrait subjects, one man describes how Johnson came back, after tracing the man's silhouette, with 26 different resulting collages! Then, over the months that they were negotiating a selling price, Johnson mixed and matched and otherwise re-made several of the portraits. There was a series of mail art made from Lucky Strike cigarette labels (happy sigh). There was a "potato masher" series in one of the last rooms, lauding various people's mothers. There was ephemera and mail art in glass tables throughout the exhibit. It was engrossing, and there was too little of it. There were documents from Johnson's New York Correspondance [sic] School, some of which described meeting activity and what everyone was wearing. There were homemade collage books. There was a letter from Joan Crawford thanking him for his fanmail. This little paragraph can't begin to cover it. So many things for which i feel affinity. . . my personal faves then. First, affinity for his motifs: Gertrude Stein, esp. when her head was inserted in the dollar bill where george washington normally is. His wordplay, esp. in the series play on the word "ice" (both the Black Mountain book and the exhibit point out his preoccupation with the solid-liquid-gas states of changeable water), which became "lice" and "ire," of all things. His use of the Jantzen swimming suit diver on a "zen" postcard. A tuna fish label. Marianne Moore. There was a series of collages based on her tri-corner hat. Also, there was another, earlier collage (reproduced in the Black Mountain College Dossier book) of her hat, with a big, open, diagrammatic mouth underneath, covering what would be her face. Secondly, then, affinity for his methods: Personal correspondence. His work is from one person to one other, often back and forth. The puns, jokes, context, and content have to do with the person to whom he is giving the collage. Such is the tender beauty of mail art and it's publicly intimate distribution system, the postal service. Collaboration. Goes with the above. There was one piece in particular that was striking. A friend of his acquired multiple reproduction copies of the mona lisa. He sent one to Johnson. Sometime later, Johnson sent it back with a sort of rope coil on the face, as a play on something that was said or drawn (i can't remember which) in their accompanying letters. Word-play. And not just of conventional words, as in the "ice" collages. Early on, Johnson drew and filled in glyphs from the contours of his individual moticos, which then made their way into later, further collages. Continuation. His pieces are ongoing conversations. A pun or a theme moves through several incarnations. He destroys one collage (his own or that of a correspondent) to make another, and so on. The pieces aren't discrete. Stacked cardboard. When i saw layers of cardboard glued together to get various depths, i jumped and scurried for joy. i read that he often used sandpaper to polish it and couldnt wait to get home and try it. i peered under the top layers, stared at the white paint coating each precarious column laughed and crammed my noggin with as much learning from his imagination as i could carry. There was an engrossing video interview with Ray Johnson looping in one of the exhibition rooms. He had the most alluring, active pair of hands i've seen on an ostensibly non-lesbian person (he was gay). He kept gesturing about how he worked. He was wearing a pullover sweater. i wanted to hug him. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 12:42:32 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Thomas Bell Organization: @Home Network Subject: Re: shifts in modalities MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I may be white, male, and of working class background. I still am a 'working' person and did put myself through a middle-ground state university by working my way through it. I attended some of the classes mentioned and wrote my share of crappy papers. I did eventually switch majors and depart from the scene referred to but I prefer to think it was because of my perceptiion of the basically hypocritical and political atmosphere of literature and writing programs (this was thirty years ago so no one here need take offens). I find the comments below offensive to me, my children, and their teachers, among others. Rebecca Wolff wrote: > > You need only take a look at the dismal thing that is the lowgrade grad > seminar at the middle-ground state university in which, say, a bunch of > middle class folks who "love books" or in this case "love poetry" and want > to write papers about it and teach it are being agonizingly weaned by a > well-trained, frustrated professorial practitioner who got her pHd, > needless to say, somewhere entirely else, away from the practice of looking > for "what it means" and toward the practice of coming up with salient > materialistic points for their inevitably crappy papers to know why this > particular shift will be the death of all joy in poetry. I have no doubt > that it will happen, and it will suck. -- //\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\ OOOPSY \///\\\/\///\\\/ <><>,...,., WHOOPS J K JOVE BY HHH ZOOOOZ ZEUS'WRATHHTARW LLLL STOPG [ EMPTY ] SPACER index of online work at http://members.home.net/trbell essays: http://members.tripod.com/~trbell/criticism/gloom.htm ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 13:39:58 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Katie Degentesh Subject: 6,500 reminder MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just a reminder that 9x9's release party for its magazine, 6,500, is happening tomorrow night, Thursday March 25, at New College of California, 777 Valencia, San Francisco, 7:30 pm. Hope to see/meet some of you there! --Katie ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 10:31:54 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Prejsnar Subject: Re: FYI--Academy of American Poets In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990323105427.010b4d40@mail.earthlink.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII So according to the AP and/or the AAP, Creeley writes in "an experimental style." I humbly submit that this underlines the truth i keep boring everyone with, to wit, the E word, and all its allied forms (the A compound word, the I word) are worse than useless. There is good, or interesting poetry, as i call it. And then there's the AAP. And if at this late date they're still fretting about RC, things are even sadder than we suspected.. I close with a difficult quote from the experimental voice-poet elvis mcmanus II: i used to be disgusted, now i try to be amused. mark prejsnar ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 08:29:07 -0800 Reply-To: robintm@tf.org Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "R. Tremblay-McGaw" Subject: class & gender MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The whole class issue is a complex one, and at the very least, warrants more attention and critical thought. I don't think I believe that issues like class and gender "naturally" find their way into the work. There is a kind of erasure and the silencing imposed by super structures and codes of all sorts--formal and political, and so on that are at work beneath the surface. They erupt and transfigure the surface, "cellular" structure, if you will. It's the active engagement with them that interests me. And I guess I think that sometimes revolutions arise from the page. Nothing is off limits. There is nothing inherently reductive about engaging with such issues on the page. I think of the work that Kathleen Fraser did via HOW(ever) to articulate/explore a feminist poetics in formally challenging work--very important for my own engagement. I've found that some of the work of fellow feminist writers is "polite," operates with a certain decorum (I fight against this myself), that is claustrophobic. For me, there is a connection with class and gender and sexuality issues here. What I love about Dodie's Letters of Mina Harker is that she slays all those sacred cows requiring decorum. And I think that the formal dynamics of the Mina Letters can be discussed in terms of class. In fact, the wheels are spinning right now on this topic. Look out for an essay on this in the future. Robin ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 07:18:00 +1200 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tony Green Subject: Re: what poetry's for MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit disquiet unquiet drawn to death's teeth smirking snorkeling ask anyone Tony Green ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 18:54:56 -0500 Reply-To: levitsk@ibm.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rachel Levitsky Subject: [FYI--Meet me in Philly] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: from killian.chelsea.net [207.25.36.14] by in1.ibm.net id 922211760.62064-1 ; Tue, 23 Mar 1999 17:56:00 +0000 Received: from station2.action (amelia-a42.pins.ny.us.chelsea.net [207.25.44.42]) by killian.chelsea.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id MAA22982; Tue, 23 Mar 1999 12:54:22 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199903231754.MAA22982@killian.chelsea.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Millions for Mumia" Organization: npcny To: "npcny@peoplescampaign.org" Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 12:51:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Communities, students build Millions for Mumia Reply-to: "npcny@peoplescampaign.org" Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.52) Millions for Mumia 39 W. 14 St., Suite 206 New York, NY 10011 Phone (212) 633-6646 Fax (212) 633-2889 Web: www.peoplescampaign.org E-mail: npcny@peoplescampaign.org FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE Attention: Assignment Editor March 23, 1999 Contact: Greg Butterfield, Brian Becker (212) 633-6646 Activity in Colleges, High Schools and Many Communities Builds Toward Massive 'Millions for Mumia' Marches April 24 in Philadelphia and San Francisco Growing Movement Demands: 'Stop the Execution! End Police Brutality! A New Trial for Mumia Abu-Jamal!' On Sat. April 24, people from all walks of life will march on Philadelphia and San Francisco as "Millions for Mumia," to stop the execution of African American journalist Mumia Abu-Jamal. They will demand a new trial for the death-row activist and add their voices to the growing chorus calling for an end to racist police brutality. The Millions for Mumia April 24 Mobilization has been endorsed by over 500 individuals and organizations, including Ossie Davis, Alice Walker, Angela Davis, former U.S. Attorney General Ramsey Clark, Rev. Benjamin Chavis Muhammad, 1199 Health & Human Services Union/SEIU, Pam Africa, Cornel West, Edward Asner, Barbara Smith, Leonard Weinglass, Susan Sarandon, Bobby Seale, Rafael Cancel Miranda, Leslie Feinberg, Noam Chomsky, Geronimo ji Jaga (Pratt), Kathleen Cleaver, Manning Marable, Art Spiegelman and Ani DiFranco. The immense level of activity in colleges, high schools and communities throughout the United States is a clear sign that the April 24 demonstrations will be among the largest in recent history, and the biggest ever on behalf of a U.S. political prisoner. In a March 19 call to action, Ossie Davis, Pam Africa, Ramsey Clark and other leaders said: "Mumia Abu-Jamal is a former Black Panther and a lifelong fighter against racism, repression and police brutality. He is a widely published author and radio commentator. In 1981 Mumia was framed for the murder of a white police officer in Philadelphia. All the evidence, however, indicates that he is innocent. "Mumia was sentenced to death. For the last 17 years he has been one of the most well known political prisoners in the United States. His last appeal to the State of Pennsylvania has been denied, despite the fact that witnesses who had been intimidated by the police have now come forward. He could be executed within six months." They concluded: "The campaign to win a new trial for Mumia is more than the struggle for justice for one person. It is part of an emerging movement of community, student and youth activism that stands in opposition not only to police brutality, but also the death penalty, attacks on affirmative action, and the intensification of racism, sexism, homophobia and repression." Communities, Students Mobilize Nationwide Philadelphia, New York and San Francisco are the sites of the National "Millions for Mumia" Offices. Mobilizing centers have also been established in more than 70 cities and towns nationwide to organize buses to the April 24 demonstrations. A partial list includes: Albany, N.Y.; Albany, Ga.; Ann Arbor, Mich.; Atlanta; Austin, Texas; Baltimore, Md.; Birmingham, Ala.; Boise, Idaho; Boston; Boulder, Colo.; Buffalo, N.Y.; Chicago; Cincinnati and Columbus, Ohio; Detroit; Grinnel, Iowa; Harrisonburg, Va.; Houston; Hempstead, Long Island, N.Y.; Lawrence, Kan.; Los Angeles; Louisville, Ky.; Manhasset, N.Y.; Middletown, Conn.; Milwaukee; Minneapolis-St. Paul; Missoula, Mt.; Nashville, Tenn.; New Brunswick, N.J.; New Paltz, N.Y.; Newark, N.J.; Oberlin, Ohio; Paterson, N.J.; Pittsburgh; Portland, Ore.; Providence, R.I.; Richmond, Va.; Rochester, N.Y.; San Diego, San Jose and Santa Cruz, Calif.; Seattle, Wash.; Springfield, Mass.; St. Petersburg, Fl.; State College, Pa.; Stony Brook, Long Island, N.Y.; Storrs, Conn.; Syracuse, N.Y.; Thorndike, Maine; Toledo, Ohio; Tucson, Ariz.; Western Massachusetts; Willimantic, Conn.; Woodstock, N.Y.; and Washington, D.C. Following is a partial list of college campuses where students are organizing buses to participate in the April 24 "Millions for Mumia" demonstrations: Antioch College, Ohio; Boise State University, Idaho; Borough of Manhattan Community College, New York; City College of New York; College of Saint Rose, Albany, N.Y.; College of Staten Island, N.Y.; Columbia University, New York; Connecticut College; Cornell University, Ithaca, N.Y.; DePauw University, Idaho; Eastern Connecticut State University; Florida International University; George Washington University, Washington, D.C.; Georgetown University; Grinnel College, Iowa; Hamilton College, Clinton, N.Y.; Hampshire College, Amherst, Mass.; Hofstra University, Hempstead, N.Y.; Hostos Community College, Bronx, N.Y.; Hunter College, New York; Kent State University, Ohio; Long Island University, N.Y.; Massachusetts Institute of Technology; Medgar Evers College, Brooklyn, N.Y.; Morgan State University; Nassau Community College, Long Island, N.Y.; New School for Social Research, New York; N.Y. Technical College, Brooklyn, N.Y.; New York University; Northwestern University; Oberlin College, Ohio; Philadelphia Community College; Portland State University, Ore.; Princeton University, N.J.; Queens College, N.Y.; Roxbury Community College, Mass.; Rutgers University, N.J.; Sarah Lawrence, N.Y.; State University of New York campuses in Binghamton, Purchase and Stonybrook; Swathmore College; Syracuse University, N.Y.; Temple University, Philadelphia, Pa; University of Alabama, Birmingham; University of Albany, N.Y.; University of California in Berkeley and Los Angeles; University of Connecticut, Storrs; University of Illinois, Chicago; University of Massachusetts, Amherst; University of North Carolina, Greensboro; University of Wisconsin in Madison and Milwaukee; Vassar College; Virginia Commonwealth; Wesleyan University, Conn.; William Patterson University, N.J.; Yale University, Conn.; and York University. Communities across the country are organizing contingents. Latinos/Latinas for Mumia are mobilizing in Boston; Hartford and Bridgeport, Conn.; Providence, R.I.; New York; New Jersey; Philadelphia; and Washington, D.C. Under the leadership of civil-rights leader Yuri Kochiyama, Asians for Mumia are sponsoring buses from both coasts. A lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender contingent, Rainbow Flags for Mumia, is growing, with over 150 endorsements and mobilizations in Atlanta, Baltimore, Boston, Los Angeles, New York, Philadelphia, San Francisco, Tucson and several other cities. An Italian Americans for Mumia contingent from New York is being organized by Italian Americans for a Multicultural U.S. In New York City, 100 buses have been reserved by the Millions for Mumia Mobilization to transport protesters to the Philadelphia march. That number is expected to grow as community groups, colleges and high schools plan their own buses to Philadelphia. "Millions for Mumia" April 24 actions are also planned in other countries. International mobilizing centers include: San Juan, Puerto Rico; Amsterdam, the Netherlands; Berlin and Bremen, Germany; Carlton South, Australia; Hamburg, Germany; London, England; Ontario, Canada; Oslo, Norway; Paris, France; Rheine, Germany; and Vancouver, Canada. More information is available from the National Mobilizing Office in New York. "Millions for Mumia" leaders, including Ossie Davis, Ramsey Clark and Leonard Weinglass, are available for interviews. Call (212) 633-6646. -30- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 10:15:25 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tom Orange Subject: Lettrisme MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII forwarded from a friend of mine. any info appreciated. please backchannel me or, if the interest is there, i will send out a compilation of any info i get. thanks, tom orange / london, ont. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- hi tom, could you do me a favour? can you ask the poetics list if anyone knows of any good stuff written in english about the Letteriste International, Isidore Isou in particular? ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 09:40:16 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: dbkk@SIRIUS.COM Subject: Re: class & gender Comments: To: robintm@tf.org In-Reply-To: <36F912D2.76ABBE57@tf.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 8:29 AM -0800 3/24/99, R. Tremblay-McGaw wrote: >I've found that some of the work of fellow feminist writers is "polite," >operates with a certain decorum (I fight against this myself), that is >claustrophobic. For me, there is a connection with class and gender and >sexuality issues here. Robin, I think you are so right here--"lady" poetics I call it. And it's not hard to understand why many younger women don't want to associate with the whole feminist thing. Though, these days, luckily, there are many strong counter-trends. The feminist poetics scene in SF nourished me--but it became clear fairly early on that I was not going to be supported there (quite the opposite) for the sexuality and vulgarity I was moving towards. (Though it wasn't as bad as when I recently read in Cambridge and nobody would look me in the eye or talk to me after my reading.) I had to go outside the feminists to male writers in order to find a safe bubble where I could develop my work, push it. Of course there was always Kathy Acker as an important model in the distance (for I didn't yet know her in the early 80s) but she was so impossibly hip in her buzz haircut and miniskirts and I was so impossibly not hip, there didn't seem much hope of a connection there. I'm greatful now to all the women that are my allies (and the ladies who aren't maintain a silence of tolerance). But it took a long time before any women were supportive of my work. I'm still reading feminist theory books (Rosi Braidotti is my new passion), and occasionally a kind soul such as Susan Gevirtz will talk to me about them. Dodie ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 12:05:44 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: derek beaulieu / house press Subject: Para>poetics Comments: To: Undisclosed.Recipients@mail3.cadvision.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Para>poetics reading series presents: Canadian Poet Anne Szumigalski 7 PM Thursday, April 1, at Truck Bsmt 815 1 St. SW (The Grain Exchange Building) Calgary, Alberta Anne Szumigalski's poetry explores the connection between myth, emotion, intellect, and spirit. A recipient of a number of awards, including the 1995 Governor General's Award, she is the author of over a dozen books, including Rapture of the Deep (1991), the voiced poem Journey/JournEe (with Terrence Heath, 1988), and most recently, On Glassy Wings (1997). She has also written works for stage play and for dance. Everyone welcome. Admission free. Sponsored by: the League of Canadian Poets and The Canada Council. for info call Truck @ 261-7702 or 289-7808 or email jonathon wilcke at : jcwilcke@ucalgary.ca ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 15:39:12 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: Thoughts about SILENCING THE SOUNDED SELF by Christopher Shultis Comments: To: silence MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" S I L E N C I N G T H E S O U N D E D S E L F John Cage and the American Experimental Tradition by Christopher Shultis [Northeastern U Press 1998] what cart? what horse? the intro lays out the poles of the study after noting that the inquiry "is governed by an assumption that an emphasis on process is a shared concern of all artists commonly regarded as *experimental*" (p.xvi) Shultis goes on to note that processes can be initiated in two ways 1) by a self controlling the process 2) by a self co-existing with process next we are given 3 criteria against which to contrast those whose work fits with option 1 and option 2 - these are their attitudes about Nature, Symbolism, and the Unintentional briefly the is outside of Nature, separate from it, is IN the environment, seeks to know, use, etc // uses Symbolism in the same way that it uses nature as a means to an end // and is closed to the unintentional the 'self coexistent with process' is inside Nature, not separate, part OF the environment // uses natural objects as themselves instead of as Symbolic of other things // & is open to the Unintentional ok so far this is all intro - where CS lays out the presuppositions of the study to follow - this is all enmeshed with a contrast between Emerson (who will be aligned with Charles Ives, Charles Olson - Projectivists) and Thoreau (Cage, Objectivists) part of what i like in all of this is that CS is very careful to state that the poles of his comparison are in some sense hypothetical - intentionally overdrawn - and that what he's interested in is the gray area between them & how consideration of Cage is useful to charting this space Emerson and the Charles' Olson and Ives - via their 'projectivist' stance (retro application warning) are in CS's view 'dualistic' - Thoreau, the Objectivists and Cage are 'nondualistic' i changed the heading of this post from "review" to "thoughts" b/c i find that i'm basically in sympathy with the book - and as Shultis has been quite careful in delineating just what he is making claims about and what he is not i find it hard to do much more than agree with the main points of the book within their chosen and carefully staked ground those who have an investment in Emerson or Thoreau might have differences or wish to debate terms but i have not these investments and so in addition to recommending the book to anyone interested in Cage's poetics as well as to Olsonites and fans of the Objectivists and others i'd like to ask some questions about the 'gray area between the poles' that Shultis' study highlights if - as Cage said - his purpose was purposelessness or perhaps - that nonintention was his intention then he does partake of both poles he intends not to intend some i'm sure find this contradictory just as Shultis (and maybe Cage fans generally) see it as breaking with the dualistic logic one finds in Emerson but an insistence on nonduality but i wonder i think Cage probably wd have said something similar and affirmed in some way what i hear Shultis affirming in his book but still i wonder whether it might be that Cage's position implies less a 'nondual' situation than a multiple one - i've read statements wherein he speaks against 'unity' in favor of 'multiplicity' is 'unity' a dualistic notion - maybe so but is non-dualism also built on a notion of unity ? one without any outside ? so cd it be that Cage's position has less to do with an argument between 1 and 2 but instead poses in some way an argument for a 3rd position ? in the Peircean triad each element necessarily mediates between the other two Cage's intention to be nonintentional mediates between the poles of Shultis' study likewise understanding what Cage is Intending in relation to "normal" Intention requires the mediation of some notion of Nonintention just as understanding in what sense Cage's work is nonintentional must be mediated by the fact that he does it - Intends it at present this is all i have to say about this but i'd be curious to hear other's responses to the book and to my few sketchy remarks )L ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 10:18:56 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: Re: defensive poetry MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Grant / Rebecca / poetix i must confess to a slight guilty joy when i read Rebecca's post b/c i too feel some frustration when reading something (hypotheticaly) about Howe or whomever and being led down the biographical trail in order to be 'set up for' a decisive reading of some poem of whatever but then, this is what academic critics do much of the time (not all the time) so why not simply ignore it ? i mean, is it dangerous to me if i pay no mind to its existence ? maybe so i imagine an argument cd be made that criticism has some power over me - what i can publish maybe but i continue to feel undominated [someone will lower the magic duck as the phrase of the day has been alluded to : 'false consciousness'] but another rub in this case is that Susan Howe has all these sort of biographical things around too - wherein she tell you and i and the whoever reads them things about her life family history etc i guess these too cd be ignored but what if they're good ? interesting ? what if they unsullied by the incursions of limping little academics fresh off an imagined treadmill.. what if they give you a sudden 'insight' about a poem of Ms. Howe's ? sleeping with the enemy ? )L > -----Original Message----- > From: Grant Jenkins [SMTP:Grant.M.Jenkins.14@ND.EDU] > Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 1999 6:18 PM > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: defensive poetry > > >This [the posting about S. Howe's particularities] is exactly what I was > >talking about earlier when I said that "it [the shift into classrooms > >producing critics whose facilities are lamed] will happen and it will > >suck." I do not want to know what Susan Howe's family home was like and I > >do not want to know what her husband does for a living. Cultural studies > is > >simple biographical criticism in thin disguise: an excuse for > >sensationalism and for those who are uncomfortable with ambiguity to > write > >about where their subject was born and how many doctors were around the > >table, color of baby blanket, etc. > > Well, I guess I should come to my own defense--if I am able, being only a > lame, lowgrade academic. > > All snideness aside, I have a question for you, Rebecca: what exactly then > do you think is the "joy of poetry"? > > What I can gather from reading the texts of Susan Howe--letters, poems, > journals, marginalia--that it is precisely the textual particulars of > another that she finds to be the "joy of poetry." Reading Melville's > Marginalia, a colletion of his notations in books he was reading, inspired > her to write a poem that exposes the irony, uncertainty, and change in not > only Melville's "life" but also in history (another text). Immersing > herself in the manuscripts of Emily Dickinson, Howe reclaims and > reconsiders Dickinson in a feminist context. I read much joy, Susan's and > mine, in both of those works. The joy comes not just from the work but > that it was written, by someone. > > This is not biographical criticism because it does not distinguish between > a "text" and a "life." Both are in language yet bear the traces of another > person who chose to write. Nor is this mere cultural criticism, as you > would have it. It's what Peter Neufeld in his post refered to as an > ethics > that calls for a consideration of the uncertainty and alterity that mark > our reading of an other's texts. There is more at stake than just > figuring > out "what it means." Anyway, I don't know to many academics who have this > goal. (Isn't so much of the poetry that we all enjoy and feel invested in > marked by a blur between poetry and criticism? Must we draw that line in > the sand again? Why?) > > For me, the joy of poetry comes not just from New Critically reading (or > writing) the Genius of a poem, In Itself. But from following the textual > threads out of the work and into other texts and other uncertainties, ad > infinitum. Not knowing "what it means" is the greatest joy. > > Grant ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 17:51:48 -0500 Reply-To: BANDREWS@prodigy.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: BETSY ANDREWS Subject: Re: defensive poetry MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Well, let me weigh in with a bit of retro-biographical information about Howe that speaks against the really wierd idea that the "crappy papers" of bunch of "middle-class" students who love poetry at "middle-ground state universities" toll the death knell of "all joy in poetry": In a 1995 Contemporary Literature interview, Lynn Kelly asked Howe," People objecting to experimental writing sometimes complain that whatever claims are made for its social engagement or marxist perspective, or its changing hegemonic structures of consciousness, that, in fact, the aduience it reaches is a very narrow, highly educated one, that the reader has to have tremendous intellectual confidence even to grapple with these texts. What do you think? Does that concern you?" Howe's reply: "No. The objection offends me. I think it is part of a really frightening anti-intellectualism in our culture. Why should things please a large audience? And isn't claiming that the work is too intellectually demanding also saying a majority of people are stupid? Different poets will always have different audiences. Some poets appeal to younger people, some to thousands, one or two to millions, some to older people, et cetera. If you have four readers whom you truly touch and maybe even influence, well then that's fine. Poetry is a calling. You are called to write and you follow." Howe's comments counter Rebecca's remarks from her post "Re: Shifts in Modalities" in two totally different ways. Firstly, Howe refuses to totalize. There are various aesthetic communities of readers and writers. There is no "all" anything. Secondly, Howe refuses to condescend. She's enraged by the condescension. I wonder if Rebecca thinks being middle class is the problem, or going to a "middle-ground" state university is a problem--I have an MFA from one of those places, George Mason in Fairfax, VA,--I went there on purpose, and believe me, there was all sorts of joyous experimentation and intellectualism there. Or if that provisional term of hers, "love" of poetry is the problem. What does "love" in quotation marks mean? ---------- > From: Grant Jenkins > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: defensive poetry > Date: Wednesday, March 24, 1999 6:17 PM > > >This [the posting about S. Howe's particularities] is exactly what I was > >talking about earlier when I said that "it [the shift into classrooms > >producing critics whose facilities are lamed] will happen and it will > >suck." I do not want to know what Susan Howe's family home was like and I > >do not want to know what her husband does for a living. Cultural studies is > >simple biographical criticism in thin disguise: an excuse for > >sensationalism and for those who are uncomfortable with ambiguity to write > >about where their subject was born and how many doctors were around the > >table, color of baby blanket, etc. > > Well, I guess I should come to my own defense--if I am able, being only a > lame, lowgrade academic. > > All snideness aside, I have a question for you, Rebecca: what exactly then > do you think is the "joy of poetry"? > > What I can gather from reading the texts of Susan Howe--letters, poems, > journals, marginalia--that it is precisely the textual particulars of > another that she finds to be the "joy of poetry." Reading Melville's > Marginalia, a colletion of his notations in books he was reading, inspired > her to write a poem that exposes the irony, uncertainty, and change in not > only Melville's "life" but also in history (another text). Immersing > herself in the manuscripts of Emily Dickinson, Howe reclaims and > reconsiders Dickinson in a feminist context. I read much joy, Susan's and > mine, in both of those works. The joy comes not just from the work but > that it was written, by someone. > > This is not biographical criticism because it does not distinguish between > a "text" and a "life." Both are in language yet bear the traces of another > person who chose to write. Nor is this mere cultural criticism, as you > would have it. It's what Peter Neufeld in his post refered to as an ethics > that calls for a consideration of the uncertainty and alterity that mark > our reading of an other's texts. There is more at stake than just figuring > out "what it means." Anyway, I don't know to many academics who have this > goal. (Isn't so much of the poetry that we all enjoy and feel invested in > marked by a blur between poetry and criticism? Must we draw that line in > the sand again? Why?) > > For me, the joy of poetry comes not just from New Critically reading (or > writing) the Genius of a poem, In Itself. But from following the textual > threads out of the work and into other texts and other uncertainties, ad > infinitum. Not knowing "what it means" is the greatest joy. > > Grant ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 16:15:32 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: pete spence Subject: Re: Ray Johnson Review Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain > >Thrill compels me again to say a little of what i've recently seen. A >retrospective of the collagist and mail artist Ray Johnson closed last >Sunday at the Whitney Museum, ,,,,there was also supposed to be a contemporary mail-art exhib at the whitney dedicated to R J haven't seen much mention of it in various docs i've seen on the show, did it happen??? 'cause i had a thing in it and also a collab with c vleeskens in it//pete spence Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 19:25:48 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Garrett Kalleberg Subject: Snake Hiss is Musick to Your Ears Comments: To: Poetics List Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Announcing: Snake Hiss / A Transcendental Friend Audio Project Snake Hiss is the inaugural CD from Immanent Audio, an imprint of Morningred Dot Com, produced by Debug & Co. The works on this disk were made by contributors to the Transcendental Friend as audio projects - works meant to be experienced as sound. From Anselm Berrigan's slanky sprechgesang with Edmund Berrigan on sprechguitar, to Laird Hunt's eerily driven Medeival tale to the accompaniment of 1000 humming Niebelungen, to Jen Hofer's spontaneous auto-lyricical-combustion on the Bay Bridge, to Heather Fuller's C-Wing Sub-Level 3 interrogation of a microphone, these works represent a wide variety of approaches to poetry & sound. Alan Gilbert & Garrett Kalleberg present "Pharmacality," a dialogic montage with Antonin Artaud, Roger Blin & Jacques Derrida. Lisa Jarnot performs her "Armadillo" on the streets of Queens, NY. Marcella Durand reads "Hunt" and "Tnuh" at the same time (some distortion cannot be avoided). Jonathan Skinner performs his translation of Ghrasim Luca's "15 Min. Meta-physical." (Skinner reports that his arms were sore for days afterwards.) Duncan Dobbelmann reads his translation of Paul Van Ostaijen's "Sur les Ponts de Paris," written in the aftermath of Great War Europe, against a sonic mediascape. Daniel Machlin & Serena Jost perform "14 Days, 30 Seconds," a collaborative diary of the creative life of a poet, a musician, a cello, keyboard, bass, acoustic and slide guitar, and various household paraphernalia. Jen Hofer improvises "What I Mean to Say" and "Good Directions" on the S. =46. Bay Bridge. Laird Hunt reads his translation of "The Vair Palfrey," from the Old French of Huon le Roi. Cole Swensen's "Maest=E0" is presented as a montage of voices in counterpoin= t. Jesse Glass reads P. M. Deshong's "A Dream," a visionary poem by an unknown 19th century Maryland poet. Heather Fuller recorded "stricken [from]" with an unknown accomplice. Anselm Berrigan performs "Fortune's Drift," with Edmund Berrigan on guitar. Heather Ramsdell & Garrett Kalleberg perform "Send in the Clown," a piece for two voices and pratfalls. There is a bonus track. Sound samples, in the mp3 file format, can be heard from the Snake Hiss page= at http://www.morningred.com/immanentaudio/pages/snakehiss.html. =46or orders, send a check to: Debug & Co. / 71 Devoe Street, 3L / Brooklyn, NY 11211. The Snake Hiss CD is $12, including postage. (All packages sent first class mail.) Be sure to include your name and address, all that stuff. =46or bulk orders or other inquiries, please write snakehiss@morningred.com, or contact Garrett Kalleberg, at (718) 599-7603. Garrett Kalleberg mailto:tf@morningred.com The Transcendental Friend can be found at: http://www.morningred.com/friend ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 22:11:19 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "P.Standard Schaefer" Subject: RIBOT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit This year's publication of the College of Neglected Science, Ribot #7, will be co-edited by Paul Vangelisti and myself. The theme is music. Not necessarily meditations on music, but certainly work with musicality involved. The deadline for that issue is, frankly, right upon us. April 15. The issue is filling up quickly, but anything received by then will be considered. Send submissions to: PO Box 65798, LA CA 90065 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 19:35:04 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Garrett Kalleberg Subject: Critique of Instrument's Reason - TF9, March 1999 Comments: To: Poetics List Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Announcing TF9, March-April 1999 - Instruments http://www.morningred.com/friend/1999/03/cover.html Issue No. 9 of The Transcendental Friend is called "Instruments" as a tribute to those who contributed work to the Snake Hiss CD. Snake Hiss is an Audio Project of the Transcendental Friend, released for the one year anniversary celebration of TF - a truly wonderful reading and evening in New York (thank you all!). This issue of the Schizmata offers "Pas de deux + others," recent work by the remarkably inventive Stacy Doris, protege of Lully and de Sade, ballet not included. This month's Report from Afield is the first edited by Leonard Schwartz, connoisseur of Gnostic and early Christian speed metal techniques, and includes work by Danish poet Katrine Marie Guldager (translated by Anne Mette Lundtofte) and Russian poet Alexander Ulanov (translated by the author and Michelle Murphy). Kristen Prevallet, currently under the employ of "Angel" Heurtebise in the manufacture of musical instruments made of fire, presents early work by Jean Cocteau in this month's Idiosyncratica. The Bestiary features a short piece by virtuoso radio player (and part time microscopist) Heather Ramsdell, called "Newt." This issue's Project page contains more information about the Snake Hiss CD, as well as sound samples in the mp3 format. Thanks for your interest! (And thank you everyone for your well-wishes for our one year anniversary.) Yours truly, Garrett Garrett Kalleberg mailto:tf@morningred.com The Transcendental Friend can be found at: http://www.morningred.com/friend ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 22:29:50 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mairead Byrne Subject: Re: shifts in modalities In-Reply-To: <36F93218.B6F1E8C7@home.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT I tend to agree with Tom Bell on this. Rebecca's post struck a number of jangling notes for me. I probably do love poetry, like I love air (even though I'm almost afraid of breathing around here when I see the black veil that shrouds snow after only a few days). I probably also love books. My PhD is probably not from the type of institution Rebecca's frustrated professor emerged from. And yes, I have written all those "crappy papers." I might even be middle-class -- at least I fervently hoped so when I was a child, though the last 20 years has been quite disappointing on that front. Anomalous is probably the word that best describes my grad student / teaching experience. I don't know which is more wearying: Rebecca's common rendering or the baffling and ongoing anomalies which are my daily experience of teaching, writing, reading and trying to support a family in this country. Mairead On Wed, 24 Mar 1999, Thomas Bell wrote: > I may be white, male, and of working class background. I still am a > 'working' person and did put myself through a middle-ground state > university by working my way through it. I attended some of the classes > mentioned and wrote my share of crappy papers. I did eventually switch > majors and depart from the scene referred to but I prefer to think it > was because of my perceptiion of the basically hypocritical and > political atmosphere of literature and writing programs (this was thirty > years ago so no one here need take offens). I find the comments below > offensive to me, my children, and their teachers, among others. > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 19:33:34 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Kathy Lou Schultz Subject: Re: gender class poetics poetry MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I found Grant Jenkins post (thanks for "de-lurking") concerning Susan Howe to be extremely useful--and I strongly agree with Rebecca Wollf's simplistic dismissal of it. What Jenkins importantly highlights is the conditions of production and the possible relationship(s) between that and the writing process and product. What he was NOT doing is drawing a simple straight line between a writer's biography and a particular assesment of the writing. The conditions of a writers' production are IMPORTANT. Who has control of the means of production in publishing is important. Who has access to those who control the means is also very important. Yes, there is a cultural elite in this country. One of the problems inherent in drawing lines around a category such as "working class writing," however, is that what is recognized as being a part of that category is usually a narrative description of an "appropriate" content: in this case, working, usually in fact men's work. It's interesting to me, too, that a writer's own class is proposed as not being a necessary factor for their work to be considered as part of "working class writing." What I always think of is the category of "African-American literature." What would happen to that category if we applied the same rule? Not that I'm defending these categories. On the contrary what I'm interested in is how these categories are developed and perpetuated within literary criticism, and how they relate to the process of canonization. And finally, by the way, I don't think that cultural studies is some kind of weak veil for "biographical criticism." Kathy Lou Schultz >Grant Jenkins: Class pressures and situations condition >every aspect of a writer as well as his or her relationship to culture, >community, and history. Howe's upper-middle class upbringing in the >household of a Harvard University professor as well as her marriage to a >famous sculptor--just to name 2 of many many factors--provided her with >many economic/social opportunities (and problems) that she does not >incorporate consciously into her work. > >Furthermore, there is no necessary or predetermined relation between class >and poetic production. The meaning of those pressures and how they shape a >life/work is a matter of careful study and analysis of particular >situations. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 08:23:48 +1000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Pam Brown Subject: Invitation Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear Poetics List, Please add this to your hectic calendar of events. And please come along if you're in Sydney on April 9th "overland" magazine editor Ian Syson and poetry editor Pam Brown invite you to the launch of a special "Four Poets" issue featuring previously unpublished poems by Judith Wright, the late John Forbes, Adam Aitken and Coral Hull with essays on their work by Gig Ryan, Martin Duwell, Ouyang Yu and John Kinsella.Plus Ken Bolton & John Forbes in poetic correspondence.Cover painting by Ken Searle, plus a supplement of painted portraits of poets by Jenny Mitchell accompanied by an essay by Carmel Bird, poetry by Lee Cataldi, Cath Kenneally, the Kelen brothers & everyone listed below, essays & reviews by Nathan Hollier, Kerry Leves, Rae Desmond Jones and others, plus the usual superlative local & global reports & articles & much much more. Reading on the night - Adam Aitken, Carolyn Van Langenberg, Philip Hammial, Rae Desmond Jones, Mark O'Flynn and Kerry Leves. Refreshments. Poetic Yakking. Everyone welcome On Friday 9th April at 6pm at Gleebooks 49 Glebe Point Road Glebe Phone (02) 9660 2333 overland magazine website - http://dingo.vut.edu.au/~arts/cals/overland/overland.html Best wishes, Pam Brown http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Workshop/7629/ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 03:52:57 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: david bromige Subject: re C Daly & Loyola fans Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Actually, I only posted because Aldon Neilsen has been indisposed, and this indisposition removes him some 70 miles from his computer. And because I am his friend, and because I support the series at Loyola, and because . . . . Wd be glad to hear a full report. I am removed some 400 miles from this series. I can understand C Daly's misgivings abt the spelling of my name. She is not the first. Besides Bromige (which is how I write it), there is Bromage, Bromidge (which is how I say it) and Bromwich. It is sd to derive from old english words either for dairy farm or for the ridge where the broom grows, and would pin the ancestors to the W Midlands. But London is a melting-pot, so quien sabe? I found a chemistry treatise by a Jugoslav whose name is Bromig. Possibly this is pron. as the c in Simic wd be were he in the land of his birth : tch. But then again, there is a name on the subcontinent Brahmaraja or close, and that wd be the most suitable for me. Of course, there are alternative spellings of many names, (Daley for e.g. with Daly) no doubt due to illiterate precursors. Accent determined spelling, impinged on the 'norm' of the scribe. As with all those Ellis Island, excuse the pun, christenings. (Or variants on port of origin : Heiftiz, Jaffe, Jaffer. . . . Or variants on verb-forms most assoc. with the person : e.g, Bowering, from Borrowing. [smiley face here]. ) When a very young movie and tv fan,our daughter would speak of Alfred Hedgehog, which was probably one origin of the name Hitchcock. A name feels cast in concrete but is constantly redefining. Like for e.g. _The Fall of Because_ a new work by Dave Baratier is and isnt a sonnet sequence. (Btw, I recommend this for a thorough reading. I think it isnt available quite yet, but I'll post those details) David ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 16:16:50 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: WENDY KRAMER Organization: N/A Subject: Ray Johnson on moticos MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit nancy burr was kind enough to forward this exerpt about moticos and what RJ says about them. and actually, this exerpt _was_ in the whitney exhibit; to my chagrin, i was too stuck on the physical materials they were made of to connect with this so lucid concept: > oh, this is fromTheories and Documents of Contemporary Art: A sourcebook > of artists' writings, ed Kristine Stiles & Peter Selz: > > "What Is a Moticos? (1954) > > Editor's Note: On 3 November 1994, Ray Johnson, in response to questions > from Kristine Stiles about the blank spaces and unfinished sentences in > this text, said, "I don't know." When predssed further, Johnson again > responded, "I don't know." After a long silence, Johnson said, "Why don't > you put in 'I don't know'?" Johnson's responses are particularly poignant > in light of his suicide on 13 January 1995. > > The next time a railroad train is seen going its way along the > track, look quickly at the sides of the box cars because a moticos may be > there. Whether the train is standing still or speeding past you, a moticos > Don't try to catch up with it. It wants to go its way. > But have your camera ready to snap its picture. It likes those moments of > being inside the box. When your film is printed and the moticos is finally > seen, it will not be seen, unless you paste the photograph of the moticos > on the side of a box car so someone can see the moticos or take its > picture. It may appear in your daily newspaper. Someone may put it there. > Cut it out. Save it. Treasure it. Make sure it is in a box or between the > pages of a book for your grandchildren to find and enjoy. > The moticos is not only seen on railroad trains, but on > It really isn't necessary to see the moticos or know where it > is because I have seen them. Perhaps I might point them > out to you. The best way is to go about your business not thinking about > silly moticos because when you begin seeking them, describing what they > are or where they are going is So just make sure you wake > up from sleeping and go your way and go to sleep when you will. The > moticos does that too and does not worry about you. Perhaps YOU are the > moticos. Destroy this. Paste the ashes on the side of your automobile and > if anyone asks you why you have ashes pasted on the side of your car, tell > them. > Or write the word 'moticos' on the top of your automobile. It > loves moving and rain water. Not so many people will wonder what it means. > There will be no questions, hence no need for answers. And if you have an > automobile, drive to pleasant places because Have you seen a > moticos lately? Perhaps you have. They are everywhere. As I write this I > wish someone were here to point one out to me because I know they exist." thanks, burr wendy ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 04:33:08 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: david bromige Subject: class etc in poetry Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" This topic is one I follow with interest. I dont know if what I'm about to say, adds anything to the literature on the subject. To testify, I was born to a couple from the British workingclass, and many of my class-loyalties lie there. But my parents were omnivorous readers. So were my sister and I. My taste in reading became sophisticated beyond that of a number of my classmates. I won a scholarship to an upper-middle-class school. I was attacked by workingclass kids on my way home from school, all that. My love of reading made me a fan of many persons who would never have sat down to break bread with our family. Evelyn Waugh started higher than I and aspired yet higher, a horrible snob. But what he could do with narrative and dialog was seductive. Why I Dont Do Social Realism, etc. Writing well takes time, and time takes money, and so the monied classes have given us a 'disproportionate' number of authors. Tilt. In my work "Lines" e.g. dark night of the soul ---------------------- currently unemployable or to be human is to be a conversation ----------------------------------- i'm doin okay I hear among whatever else an underclass avenger subverting an overclass person of letters, while effecting an odd reconciliation. Even in parricide --------- commonly botched I read a murderous inpatience with caste. But I misgive that a blue collar would find such as enjoyable as cowboy verse. Class feels particularly evasive in the U S A. In Canada, as someone brilliantly generalized, everyone is workingclass. (Exceptions shut up!) In England, where they tell you class is breaking down, which is a load of bollocks, it's mainly overclass kids adopting cockney accents, class remains manifestly a prime shaper of attitudes, expectations, diction, literature. 'Manifestly,' --yet sub rosa.But the U S A . . .I was shocked to encounter signs of class war (as subtler, but no less unmistakable, than, i.e., the bosses' cops gunning down workers) upon coming here. Like much of the rest of the world, I suspect, I had been focussed upon the egalitarian presumption. There's more to say, but this is long enough. David ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 07:55:28 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rebecca Wolff Subject: Re: shifts in modalities In-Reply-To: <36F93218.B6F1E8C7@home.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I am afraid I made myself un-understandable by a too-swift posting. My use of the quotation marks around "love books" and "love poetry" was meant to indicate not irony but sincerity. Did not mean to offend. Meant to try to explicate my particular frustrations, which I am sure are quite particular. I think I'll shut up now. Rebecca Wolff ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 08:03:46 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rebecca Wolff Subject: Re: and again I shut up In-Reply-To: <36F93218.B6F1E8C7@home.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" And let me try to dig myself even a tiny little bit further out of the hole by saying that I don't identify with the "well-trained professor" of my oh-so-hasty posting, but rather more with the "folks." Reading over what I said now I can only lament how ironically I expressed myself. Really I'm amazed, more than anything, at the fluctualities of the inflections of my tones there. There are, of course, opinions expressed in the posting that I do stand by, but they are not particularly well-expressed. Thank you, and good night. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 23:30:26 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Kevin L. Magee" Subject: Re: Sondheims Kattrin posted 24 Mar 01:58:44 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello Is there any more info on Peter Evans' September virtual writing residency that could be forwarded to the poetics list? worker 1: THE INTERNET IS INFORMATION INFORMATION IS KNOWLEDGE KNOWLEDGE IS POWER worker 2: WASHINGTON IS PREPARING FOR WAR WITH RUSSIA ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 22:14:07 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "P.Standard Schaefer" Subject: Otis MFA Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable For those who have asked about more information regarding the Otis MFA program, the Otis website address is-- www.otisart.edu The requirements are listed below. MFA IN WRITING First Year Critical Theory & Practice (3 units - 2 semesters) =97 Two-semester, joint offering with the Graduate Program in Fine Arts, required of both first year Fine Arts and Writing students. The course is an in-depth examination of a critical or theoretical text, focusing on contemporary issues in the verbal and visual arts, and how the text and the issues raised ultimately relate to the students' own work. Fiction Workshop/ Poetry Workshop (4 units - 2 semesters) =97 Two-year course sequence in the student's area of emphasis, i.e. fiction or poetry, with a different poet or fiction writer each semester. Also, as part of the course, the student will meet with the program director, as well as other graduate faculty during the semester. Writing as Critical Practice (3 units - 2 semesters) =97 Two-year course sequence in which both fiction writers and poets discuss practical critical issues by focusing on a literary historical or genre issue, such as the epic tradition, the quotidian, writing as social sign, the contemporary literary scene, etc. Topics and instructors will rotate on a semester basis. Special Topics in Literary Studies (3 units - 2 semesters) =97 First year sequence: "Translation Seminar" (in which students will attempt fiction or poetry translations, confronting the fundamental problem of literary translation, as well as acquiring some first-hand knowledge of literary traditions outside that of Anglo-American literature); and an elected course from pertinent "Advanced Topics in English" offerings, designated for upper division/graduate credit. Units: 26 Second Year Fiction Workshop/ Poetry Workshop (4 units - 2 semesters) Writing as Critical Practice (3 units - 2 semesters) Special Topics in Literary Studies (3 units - 2 semesters) =97 Second year sequence: "History & Practice of the Book" (an examination of the material history and theory of the "book," and its continuing problematic issues of reception, in which students will construct a small book that embodies the personal and public concerns implicit in their own writing); and an elective from "Advanced Topics in English" offerings. Art History Elective (2 units - 1 semester) =97 To be chosen, preferably in first semester of second year, from the "Art History & Theory" courses offered in Liberal Studies. Writer's Tutorial (3 units - 1 semester) =97 Second year students meet once a week with the director and other instructors to discuss work or issues of particular importance to their progress in the program. Units: 25 Fifth Semester (with non-resident option) Thesis (4) TOTAL PROGRAM UNITS: 55 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 04:15:20 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Ben Basan Subject: Class Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain I'm glad the issue of class has cropped up because for years I've wondered what class is. It's interesting to me that whenever class is discussed actual definitions of class seem to evade the argument. Since I have spent my life thus far between America and the UK I would have thought that, particularly from living in the UK, I should have some idea of what class is. I have asked this question before and have had answers ranging from the idea of wealth being tied with class to simply an accent. That class and language are connected in some way is tempting; so is it language that separates the classes? I've been told several times that because I don't know what class I am I must be middle class; On my first or second day of my undergrad. degree a lecturer told us that no matter what we thought we were, we are now middle class since we entered a university course. My nieghbor who alone earns more than my wife and I together considers himself working class (he does have the accent). this class issue seems to me awfully muddled, as I think much of this anterior identity seeking is. I don't mean to be confrontational. I simply do not know what class is... that is not to say I don't see social discrepancies between individuals or groups, but to add the structure of class...? Benjamin Basan Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 11:39:16 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetry Project Subject: Re: query--poetry project newsletter Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Said rumor is just that. The Newsletter will be retaining it's molecules for a thousand years, or at least until the war in Yugoslavia escalates. A. Berrigan ps -- it might be nice to know how the rumor got started, seeing as how gossip & news are one and the same on just about every level of the culture at the moment. On the backside, tho'. >Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 18:00:11 -0800 >From: Mark Weiss >Subject: query--poetry project newsletter > >Heard a rumor today that I hope is unfounded that the St Marks Poetry >Project Newsletter is soon to be no more. Confirm, deny, or elucidate? ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 16:34:57 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetry Project Subject: upcoming Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Next week, due to Easter (we're in St. Mark's Church), there are no readings or workshops at the Poetry Project. Larry Fagin's workshop will resume April 13th; the other workshops will resume April 9 &10th. If you have any questions about this, please call us at (212) 674-0910. Readings will resume on April 5th with an Open Reading (sign-up at 7:30 pm) Then Anne Waldman & Victor Hernandez Cruz on Wednesday, April 7th at 8pm And then, a two-reading evening as part of the People's Poetry Gathering (co-sponsored by Poets House & City Lore) on Friday, April 9th: The Shadow Writing Project at 9:30 pm Robert Bly & Robert Pinsky at 10:30 pm In the Meantime: Marcella Durand, Program Coordinator for the Poetry Project, will be participating in a Roundtable Discussion on Monday, March 29th at 7 pm "Readings, Launch Paries and More: Events Planning in New York City for Literary Publishers" at Poets House, 72 Spring St, 2nd floor, NYC Admission is free for staff of literary magazines, $5 for others RSVP by March 29th, 12 pm to the Council of Literary Magazines and Presses at (212) 741-9110 or e-mail to CLMPNYC@aol.com. Also forthcoming, as part of the upcoming conference at Barnard on April 9th at 9 am, a panel on Women at the Poetry Project Participants include Brenda Coultas, Marcella Durand, Kimberly Lyons, Prageeta Sharma and Eleni Sikelianos--more information on this next week (sorry, someone took our Barnard information packet...) ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 15:36:34 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maz881@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Page Mothers & Delinquent Daughters Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Yes, Linda. I disagree with that quote too, which i noted at the time. I was saying it was one way that l-p could be read. And thank you for pointing out the problems that result from that reading (eg gender gets nullified). i also agree with you in that i don't see l-p as a relevent term or grouping now. i tend to believe it was real at one point tho. and admire the energy and work that resulted from it. I think I misread your original post, where somehow it seemed you were the one calling for more "taxonomies" like l-p. i can't see where i or tom0 were calling for new taxonomies. I guess i read the open letter issue as a taxonomy "move" like l-poets made. Here is some theoretical work and here are some of my friends here, here and here, and here are their poems and we're united against capitalism. and you can tell that by the disconnected style we use. also i think some of the writers included in that issue were a little surprised to find themselves apparently unified under the rubric of jeff. so my problem i suppose is that move was interesting (to me) back when i was starting to read. but now it sounds hollow. editing projects that are more interesting to me don't group by form, friends, loyalities. i think the New (Am) anthos suffers from a lyrical form grouping, a weird nationalist grouping and not enough people of color. tho it has the advantage of not surrounding the poems with theoretical constructs through which we are supposed to read. chain is a funny example because it groups by form. but discrete form, not the correct form of a new movement. the end result is hard to describe. which is good. tinfish has a similar confusion, tho grouped around "region". identity groupings by gender, race, class, seem more valuable to me. or valid. or grounded in their opposition, but i don't have the theoretical vocabulary to say anything relevent re . i guess i am suspicious of the new open letter's largely white grouping. it is a problem of the avant-gararge. i suppose i am part of that problem too. i guess what i meant by many to many relationships is to avoid seeing yourself as part of one mini-group composed of relatively similar reflections of yourself. because that leads to mini-group fight. eg langp-po nyc mini group and nyc school mini-group in early 80s. if bruce andrews reads 1st with elinor nauen, l-poets stay for bruce and walk for elinor. nyc school poets show up late and miss bruce. they dislike each other for no good reason i can think of. contradictorily, i believe it's important, maybe even vital, to have close writer friends and alliances. and those friendships, those mini-groups tend to be fairly homogeneous wrt to the big identity 3. friendship "is" that way. but it's vital to seek out much that is outside that mini-group. to break down the notion that friendship is natural. so you can see i don't really know what i mean by grouping. an essay i like is called SpiderWasp and literary criticism by J spahr, the ideas of which i seem to be summarizing rather poorly: "There is clearly right now an increase in mismatchings, in joinings. . . . and the joinings that are happening here are as diverse as the things joined. But nonetheless, all this work can be characterized by its refusal of allegiance to any specific school and a parallel proclamation of an allegiance to more than one school." i think that is a getting at of a definition of many to many. which is a relational database term. take user and group as entities (tables). if there is a many to many relationship between these entities, one user can be in many groups and one group can contain many users. alternately, i read, reductively i'm sure, early l-p and the recent open letter as enacting a one to many relationship. a group can contain many users, but a user belongs to only one goup. thanks for your time. it seems like we are really in agreement on much of this. i don't know how to proceed. Bill Linda wrote: < to me it seems more important (now) to look for commonalities among different > groupings and try to create permeable groups, to seek out many to many > relationships. I would tend to agree but then your terms are so general here that I'm not sure what I'd be agreeing with. What do you mean by grouping -- a sort of self-selection? or that of the taxonomist? We can't first look for commonalities without first deigning to articulate them, no? But these writings would then be your "ghosts"? How does one proceed?>> _____________________________________________________________ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 17:23:26 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: Re: Ray Johnson MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain > RE: Ray Johnson > someone sent me this list i thought it seemed worthy to post > http://www.actlab.utexas.edu/emma/emailartgallery.html > > http://www.artpool.hu/Ray/Ray_about.html > > http://www.faximum.com/jas.d/asg_15.htm > > http://newyork.sidewalk.com/detail/97177 > > http://www.informatik.uni-trier.de/~ley/db/indices/a-tree/j/Johnson:Ray.ht > m > )L ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 08:21:08 +0100 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Dubravka Subject: [Fwd: [Fwd: Belgrade: a feminist report]] (fwd) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII dear lsit, i sent this to charls bernstein, but send to the list also. this is the massage from belgrade pacifist groups. thanks to charles and all friends to love and support. i hope i will write more soon .. it is really horrible dubravka djuric ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 22:17:12 +0100 From: Zarana Papic To: Aco Divac , Alain Lipietz & Francine Comte , Aleksandar Kron , Aljosa Mimica , Brana Stojkovic , Chele , Danica Ilic , Darka Radosavljevic , Dimitrije Todorovic , Dragan BULATOVIC , Dragica Vujadinovic-Milinkovic , Dragoljub Zarkovic , Drinka Gojkovic , Dubravka Djuric , Dunja Blazevic , Duska , Evropski pokret u Srbiji , Goran Milicevic , Ivana Aleksic , Iveta Todorova , Jelena Djordjevic , Jelena Santic , KOTEVSKA Ana , Liga socijaledmokrata Vojvodine , Marija Bogdanovic , Milena Dragicevic-Sesic , Mima Pesic , Mirjana Kovacevic , nikola tucic , Pedja Dojcinovic , Rade Veljanovski , Rastko Mocnik , Slobodanka Ast , Snjezana Milivojevic , Srdjan Darmanovic , Srdjan Rajkovic , Svetlana Slapsak , Tinde Kovac-Cerovic , vesna rakic-vodinelic , Zaga Golubovic , Zarko Paunovic Cc: Autonomous Women's Center Against Sexual Violence Subject: [Fwd: [Fwd: Belgrade: a feminist report]] autonomous women's center against sexual violence tirsova 5a, beograd, fr yugoslavia tel/fax: 381.11.687.190 e-mail: awcasv@eunet.yu -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Belgrade: bombing day second Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 18:29:51 +0000 From: "Women's Center Belgrade" To: Zarana Papic Belgrade, 24 march, 99 2pm. dear friends, we have received many letters of support, calls from our friends from Bosnia, Croatia and Slovenia, thank you. The situation: Many women are affraid more or less. last night some of us have worked in the Womens Center untill 9pm, and after that the town was calm and empty, and some citizens were around entrance of houses and some in the cellers. The parts of the town near the military bases felt hard detonations and saw the fire. Those in the center of town did not. The telephone lines have become difficult. The worry of pacifists is the situation on Kosovo. First, most artillery the serbian army has concentrated in the region of Kosovo. Last night i finally caught the telephone lines with Pristina and talked to my friend, and she said that the biggest worry is the vengeance of serbian army against albanian population. The CNN and BBC TV stations are obviously very pro-violence oriented and they have inflicted much fear into people in Kosovo, on top of the facts that are fearfull in themselves. The serbian officials have cut electriciy in Pristina last night, and tuned in this morning. The cutting of electricity was clearly the act of producing more fear on the one already there. So you can imagine the mood in Pristina. This morning there is no bread and milk in most of the shops in Belgrade and Pristina. and it is a beautifull sunny day. The fact that enrages is that serbian regime has totally and apsolutelly taken the control of all the media. Which means that only few words come in, and that language of hatred, production of enemies and vengeance politics is increasing every minute. Four TV stations fused in one and two others in the other one. The people who do not have satellite TV get few news per hour, about shelters and enemies, and nothing else. This is as well frightening. Many women did not sleep last night, and sirenas are on and off every couple of hours. So some of us are constatly on the phone with those who feel bad. Once again feminists and pacifists from Belgrade are again this time sending sisterly tender words for our friends and Albanian women and their families in Kosovo. lepa mladjenovic autonomous women's center against sexual violence tirsova 5a, beograd, fr yugoslavia tel/fax: 381.11.687.190 e-mail: awcasv@eunet.yu ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 19:53:54 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Bobbie West Subject: Class, Working Pages, and the Mothers Conference Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Since Kathy Lou Schultz brought up my name in the discussion of class, I guess it=92s time to toss in a few of my own thoughts and observations on = the subject. Most of us here are interested in exploring poetic form, with all its possibilities and limitations, so I=92ll leave that aside for now and concentrate on content -- which is where I believe class differences show = up most clearly among =93arty=94 writers. (Thanks for that term Dodie.) Conce= ding to Grant Jenkins that =93there is no necessary or predetermined relation betw= een class and poetic production,=94 I still see some general tendencies that a= ppear to fall along class lines. Among what I consider to be academically (middl= e class) influenced magazines and presses, the grittier aspects of life are often not addressed at all or they=92re abstractified to the point of numb= ness. The middle class tendency to smooth over all roughness, to hush the noise,= to tame the emotions, can lead to smooth poetry, soothing to the mind=92s ear= , but producing about as much engagement as watching a roomful of people think. Added value is accrued by including references to philosophical or literar= y texts that are either unavailable or seem irrelevant to the concerns of th= e lower classes. Of course I=92m not saying that all working class people li= ke it rough and all middle class people like it smooth, but that the rough is mo= re quickly dismissed and that those who do the dismissing are more likely to = be from a middle class or higher social background. Now, on a slightly different tangent: the social aspects of class as they = play out among those on our end of the poetic spectrum. I want to say Amen! to = Joe Amato=92s post, in which he states: =93there=92s nothing i do re which mon= ey doesn=92t matter...=94 This lesson, ground into some of us from early childhood, con= trasts sharply with a middle class conversational avoidance of the subject of mon= ey. (For those of you who wanted a definition of class, this is a good startin= g point. Also check out Dorothy Allison=92s writing.) Joe=92s post and this whole discussion was sparked by events at the Page M= others conference. More than just an academic affair, it was also a fairly lively social occasion, providing opportunities to meet lots of people interested= in similar kinds of poetry and finally to see faces attached to familiar name= s from this list. The organizers, panel participants, and attendees, of cour= se, were good people, some of them from working- or lower-class backgrounds. B= ut in terms of class, the milieu was obviously not geared toward making lower class people feel comfortable. For example, the refreshments offered the f= irst afternoon were of the wine & cheese variety, no beer or pretzels in sight = (at least I don=92t remember seeing any). The sessions were held in the relati= vely sterile Seuss room of the UCSD library, not in, say, the meeting hall atta= ched to the campus pub. And why? Mainly because of who was expected to attend, = I would guess. How much noise they would be willing to put up with (another class identifier). It was probably also a question of legitimacy, of gaini= ng a certain level of =93cultural capital=94 for all of us who were involved in= the conference. (Corn chips as a sign of poetic inferiority! (laugh)) Well, this has been a brief and inadequate attempt to raise aspects of the class issue that have been on my mind for some time. Now back to lurking (hiding). Bobbie West ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 13:38:10 -0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: travmar03 Subject: Fw: April 3, 1999 -- Comments: To: Writers House , vhanson@netbox.com, TDevaney@brooklyn.cuny.edu, swineburne@yahoo.com, swalker@dept.english.upenn.edu, Ron Silliman , potepoet@home.com, Philadelphiawriters@dept.english.upenn.edu, philadelphiapoets@dept.english.upenn.edu, Kyle Conner , Kevin Varrone , jon8stark@aol.com, gbiglier@nimbus.ocis.temple.edu, dburnham@sas.upenn.edu, Brendan , Barbara Cole , banchang@sas.upenn.edu, avraham@sas.upenn.edu, Amossin@aol.com, amorris1@swarthmore.edu, Adam degraff , American Poetry Review , Andre Codrescu , Brett Evans , Buck Downs , Chris McCreary , Chris Stroffolino , Cindy Burstein , Heather Fuller , Heather Starr , Janine Hayes , Jenn McCreary , Kerry Sherin , Kristen Gallagher , Michael Magee , Molly B Russakoff , Nawi Avila , Poetry Project , "Rothschild, Douglas" , Sub Po Etics , T Sinioukov , tf@morningred.com Watch for the Age in its Cage and other spectacular feats of daring by the amazing duo: - >Stephen Rodofer and Shawn Walker >Highwire Gallery >139 N. 2nd Street >Philadelphia >Saturday April 3, 1999 >8 PM >BYOB > >Stephen will give a talk titled: The Age in its Cage >At 5 PM at the Writers House. > >Bring a friend, a family member, a small pet, and a whole lot of endurance. >E-mail this out to any you may think are interested. > >xoxo >your sponsors >Fuchs and Connor > > > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 21:51:43 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Grant Jenkins Subject: class and shutting up In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Rebecca and List, The beauty of email is that we can pop off and vent when we need to without overcensoring ourselves--especially on a List like this where we can usually count on sympathetic or invested ears. I can't speak for anyone else, but I just keep my skin a little tougher when I post. You can never tell how another will read you, and in this medium the other can tell you immediately how she/he read you. Rebecca wrote: >There are, of course, opinions expressed in the posting that I do stand by, >but they are not particularly well-expressed. I think you should elaborate those opinion rather than shut up (the recent post on politeness in women's writing comes to mind). I still am interested in whty you think the joy of poetry is because why we DO poetry at all is intertwined with this class question. A few more thoughts on class, then, while I'm at it. As David Bromige wrote: >Writing well takes time, >and time takes money, and so the monied classes have given us a >'disproportionate' number of authors I think one should still start asking questions of class in the context of economics. It seems in this arena, there is a confluence of many conditions: race, gender, history, etc. Virginia Woolf says that a (woman) writer needs about 50 pounds a year in order to create the minimum conditions necessary to writing. That was in 1929, mind, and the problem was (and still is), of course, how a woman could achieve such a financial goal. But the sentiment I think still holds true today: one must have support to write. For many reasons, one would be very hard pressed to be below the poverty line and write. Being an academic, especially at a non-PhD granting institution, as Mairead pointed out in her post, is still work. When I have 50 essays to grade over a weekend, it's likely I won't get much writing done. It's just an economic limit. If I won the lottery, I guarantee I would write more. Simple economics. I think it's crucial to avoid a more vulgar position that says middle-class = bad, working class = good, or whatever. There is no necessary relation between class and output by a writer. Class is a condition, not a determinant. This is why the class one identifies with (which may be different than economic category) can make a difference in one's writing. Now, I'll shut up. This is a great thread. I'm learning a lot. Grant ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 27 Mar 1999 16:38:32 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Kevin L. Magee" Subject: Re: Wittgenstein on working class MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit DUMBSHOW they are remote exchange-effort they are obviously all from the same town as good a definition as any for a bad theater to make the widest and most distant ring itself flowed from the previous day's alarms a drummed insistence dogged by drumming on a drum drawing to itself the declaration it is a spinning disk, not a summer flower last month's rehearsals had driven the mothers facing the immediately practical problem of finding their way, and then the phone rings is this the irruption of the broken spell acting displace reading mobility and volume the best rehearsals get done in the boredom the blossom a rhythm in the giant striding mouth-made eye of the beholder holy rolling electric passages, accent's pikestaff a black-ringed misspoken broken Wall roaring as gentle as any sucking dove in propria persona the new proletarians reared & yawned & donned their Sunday best usurping the court's monopoly of discourse "that would hang us, every mother's son" what are they that do axe about their class undiscussed and more than technical hebraic onoming mechanicals whose time is come there will be thunder and then a whisper weighs the idea down, Titanic-Titania tell the actors to burn down the theater speak from deep within disorder a photograph taken for the archive or posters more artless than ever, WRECKA STOW writ on a love-note past to me from the back row ABOLISH SYMBOLIC LABOR P.S. Dear San Fran, one of Wittgenstein's students writes somewhere that his dear teacher once said that philosophy is simply the (mechanical?) effort to ask the same question 1000 times. Could anyone do a reprise on Ben Hollander's essay on Reznikoff re "accent?" It's in one of those circulars that came out of 7722 Lynn in the spring of 95 republished in France. One of the sharpest contributions to this question of class I remember is Kim's "you sound like immigrants" spoken at the class talk when? That to move from one class to another is not a betrayal, per se, unless you're a dogmatist, or self-flagellationist, but an act or migration as brave and intelligent and necessary as every woman and child and man who scales the wall south of san diego. Kevin ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 22:10:25 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: kathylou@ATT.NET Subject: Correction! The first sentence of my recent post on class & poetics should read: I found Grant Jenkins post (thanks for "de-lurking") concerning Susan Howe to be extremely useful--and I strongly DISagree with Rebecca Wollf's simplistic dismissal of it. Sorry for the confusion. I stare at a computer screen all day long at work and get major eyeball burn-out. Best, Kathy Lou Schult ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 27 Mar 1999 14:49:47 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: derek beaulieu / house press Subject: bpNichol's TTA? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit poetic'eers i was wondering what yr opinion/response was to bpNichol's _TTA:Translating Translating Appolinaire_ - having read it now, and in the process responding to a freind's essay on TTA, i believe that TTA explores, much like bp's other works - the physical materiality of language. with TTA, bp also probes the space between languages (that s the difficulties of placing a translated text between the original (and its language base) and the restraints of the 2nd language) as well as the chalenges of faithful translations. the process of manipulation and translation is then used as a means of exploring the alphabetic symbols (as in the pieces from TTA18) as well as memory as both recollector and creator... (TTA also can relate to nichol's other works of translations like Six Fillous, the catallus poems, etc) i was just wodnering if anyone else had critical response to TTA, or if they would like to receommend further homolinguistic translations, etc... well thats it... ciao derek beaulieu ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 06:57:19 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Susan Wheeler Subject: Readings Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I'll be reading at the Borders Bookstore at 830 North Michigan Avenue in CHICAGO at 7:00 tomorrow, Monday, the 29th; and at Iowa Writers Workshop in IOWA CITY Friday, April 2, at 8:00 -- "a tough gig, Good Friday," as a former student now there said. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 06:52:45 +1200 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tony Green Subject: Re: Lettrisme MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit There is some discussion of Lettrisme & Isou in Marcus Greil. _Lipstick Traces_Secker & Warburg, London, 1989 (ISBN 0-436-27338-1) Interesting is exh.cat. _on the Passage of a few people through a rather brief moment in time: ed.Elisabeth Sussman, THE SITUATIONIST INERNATIONAL 1957-1972_ The Institute of Contemporary Art, Boston, Mass. MIT Press, 1989. (ISBN 0-262-23146-8 hardcover, 0-262-73095-2 paperback). Tony Green ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 18:08:10 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Jessica Pompeii Subject: PinkFlash Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit <------ PinkFlash: I have one about my horse, Baltimore PinkFlash: today I brought her carrots PinkFlash: she is a chocolate brown pinto PinkFlash: Baltimore I will visit tomorrow Gnomus513: ok PinkFlash: in her stall PinkFlash: she lives standing up PinkFlash: being led around PinkFlash: Baltimore loves to leap PinkFlash: but last week she threw me Smokey8300: No Jacki WarholStar: ok PinkFlash: just as we were assaulting the gate PinkFlash: boom PinkFlash: her leg hit the 2by4 PinkFlash: and now dad says we have to sell her PinkFlash: to the jello- people WarholStar: ok PinkFlash: so tomorrow when I visit PinkFlash: Baltimore PinkFlash: it will be to say goodbye PinkFlash: I tried PinkFlash: I cried and threw a fit PinkFlash: but mom and dad said no PinkFlash: to princess PinkFlash: end ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 22:52:09 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: kathylou@ATT.NET Subject: Class is . . . Education Language Entitlement Access to power Access to money Neighborhood Region Accent Vocabulary Grammar Privilege Choice Cultural capital Leisure Food Voice Access to health care Expectations Manners Grace Clothing Respect Suffering Worn upon the body *** (etc.) Class plays itself out in contradictory ways. For example, some traditionally male working class union jobs pay more than teaching jobs which require a college education. But ya' know? I'm a girl from the working class and I swear I can smell class. I can sniff it out. I'm rarely wrong. What does this mean? Perhaps that those less privileged become adept at reading class codes--and often at adopting those of the upper classes as a means of survival. For example, I've been hyper-aware of my grammar since I was a child because I was deeply pained by the disrespect heaped upon my parents (in particular my father) and I understood that the way they were treated was in part because of the way they spoke and dressed. These experiences are very real and become deeply ingrained in the psychology of children. Another question, what happens to the "power of the father" in the face of a working class father who has little power outside of the home/in the marketplace? These are not easy questions. They have everything to do with reading/writing. Kathy Lou Schultz ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:00:26 EST Reply-To: Irving Weiss Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Irving Weiss Subject: A desperate Cry Comments: To: wr-eye-tings@sfu.ca MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=BltzB323F68700026E8B000008A6B782 This is a MIME-encoded message. To decode it, try a utility such as MPack. --BltzB323F68700026E8B000008A6B782 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: "Viktor Todorovic" I just received the following. Viktor is the son of Miroljub Todorovic, longtime publisher of = SIGNAL and a visual poet. All I can think of is to send it to the literary listservs I belong = to. I think the bombing must stop, but it probably won't for fear = of loss of face, and the US will hardly invade with ground troops = insofar as we sensationalize the recovery of one downed pilot, and, = in any case, I'm sure all of you who are concerned have gone = through the back-and-forth thinking I and others I know have been = used to in our own minds without knowing what to do. If any of you = can think more effectively about all this,please let us know. At most I try to keep in touch with yugo-links at http://noel.pd.org/topos/free-zone/yugo-links.html and Chris Cheek's recommendation of http://www.pd.org/topos/links/links-frame.html So far I can't get immediate news from either and when I get Real = Audio unfortunately it's in Serbian (i.e., I can't translate, not = Serbian meaning the bad guys). The Todorovics are Belgrade Serbians = active in the student strikes in Belgrade of a year or so past. I include enclosure, but I don't understand it. >To whom it may concern and to everyone else who cares, > >I'm Milos from Batajnica. It is a suburb of Belgrade and in its = vicinity >is our major military airport. I have been in Batajnica up till = now but >the situation has become unbearable and terrifying. The people of = this >community rarely have the chance to leave the air raid shelters, = since >bombs are falling ever closer to my home, day and night with few = and >short interuptions of cease-fire. The shelters are literally = packed with >people - Serbs, Gypsies, a few ETHNIC ALBANIAN families, refugees = from >Bosnia, and maybe I'm even missing some other ethnic minorities (I >apologize to them). They are mainly frightened, some cry, some = comfort >the ones who are crying, some stare with empty gazes at the = massive >concrete walls lost in thought, some try to joke but the facial >reactions are grimases only faintly resembling smiles or laughter. = When >everything is taken into account, we have been managing quite = well. The >folks are quite disciplined and everyone is doing his/her best to = keep >the calm and awareness that we all need. But this is the status = quo >after only four days, and I can hear on foreign news bulletins = that NATO >is prepared to prolong this into weeks, months.... The talking = heads say >this, as if all of it was some kind of holiday excursion. Do you = people >have a clue what it feels like when you hear an air raid siren, = the >terror of images rushing through ones mind of what might happen in = YET >another air raid this morning, evening, afternoon, night, dawn, = dusk or >any other moment of time that is yet to pass on. After only four = nights, >people are weak from lack of sleep or insomnia, psychologically = sapped >of energy and strength by their concious and subconcious = premonitions. >They say that only military targets are being hit, but I have = already >seen two civilian targets destroyed by NATO fire-power, and heard = of >dozens of similar cases from people I constantly keep in touch = with via >email or telephone, and lots of them had human casualties. >This has to stop. NATO says that it is doing this to avert a >humanitarian catastrophy, but its automatically contradicitng = itself by >noticing that "the Serbian army has stepped up with massacers", >although, again, there is no authentic data to confirm this, = meaning >that what it really wants is to step in with ground troops and = "finish >us off". >On the other hand, they say that they are doing this to hurt = Milosevic >and strip him of power, but they know very well that this will = only >enforce his rule even more and enable him to eliminate any = reformist >movement that may challenge his power. >Do you people understand that any opportunity that may have = existed for >this country to finally break free of isolation, xenophobia and >repression and enter THE WORLD again is now irreversibly smothered >regardless of the outcome of this war (because it is a war). >America has is creating yet another puppet state in which it can >excersize its power, blackmail Europe with constant threat of war = and >introduce drug flow BIG TIME into Europe (try getting some info on >Albaninan mafia and what they do $F6 then you'll find out where = the money >for their "brave struggle for independence" comes from). Finally, = after >disposing of us nasty Serbs, they can (and will) revive their >aspirations towards Russia and their enormous potential in = resourses. >In the end I can only look back in anger and see what NATO has = done to >the Balkans in the past decade through the warlords it has = installed as >leaders of all major ethnic groups here, pushing them against each = other >in a struggle for power and wealth, supporting them whenever there = was >even a glimmer of a chance for them to lose their reins. We, the = people >of the Balkans, have payed the price for this operation of = protecting >"American interests" in wasted or lost lives, property, and a very = dark >future. > >DO NOT SIGN THIS LETTER IN ANY WAY, SINCE YOU SHALL ENDAGER MY = LIFE > > --BltzB323F68700026E8B000008A6B782 Content-Type: text/plain; name="tnosugar.vcf"; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="74747874" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="tnosugar.vcf"; creation-date="28 Mar 1999 14:30:27 -0400";modification-date="28 Mar 1999 14:30:27 -0400" begin:vcard n:;Milosavljevic Milos x-mozilla-html:FALSE version:2.1 email;internet:tnosugar@net.yu x-mozilla-cpt:;0 fn:Milosavljevic Milos end:vcard --BltzB323F68700026E8B000008A6B782-- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 16:07:45 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Marcella Durand Subject: no fold MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Belated response: The Poetry Project Newsletter is not folding. It will, however, be on summer vacation for August. I get nervous when people ask these things. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 21:18:19 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Harold Teichman Subject: Is anyone going to the Cambridge CCCP April 23? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I am new to the list and rather new to contemporary innovative poetry in general (some of us are pretty slow, what can I say), but am happily trying to find my feet. I am going to attend the Cambridge (UK) poetry conference on April 23-25, bracketing it with a brief holiday in London and Edinburgh. I would be very happy to meet any list members (or anyone else) who might be attending this event, and would love to hear from you via email before- hand. Also, if anyone could clue me in on interesting poetry events in London during April 19-22 or Edinburgh during April 26-29 I would be very grateful. Thanks and regards to all, Harold Teichman hteichma@erols.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 01:40:58 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: louis stroffolino Subject: LYNN KELLY's Q & SUSAN HOWE'S A In-Reply-To: <199903252323.SAA86554@pimout4-int.prodigy.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Looking over the exchange that Betsy Andrews post between the two aformentioned writers, I come to a different conclusion about this exchange. You may notice that LK's question (her formulation of an 'objection' that could be raised to Susan Howe's poetry) is not really being addressed by SH, at least that's what I noticed.... For LK asks about EDUCATION, asks whether a poetry like Howe's may only reach a "very narrow, highly educated," audience, and whether, in America today, one may have "tremendous intellectual confidence" WITHOUT being "highly educated." I thus see HOWE as misreading LK's question, because S.Howe seems to "elide" the distinction between "highly educated" and "intellectualism".... I think it's possible that one may be "intellectual" without being "highly educated." It's even quite plausible that in many cases being "highly educated" can GET IN THE WAY, or detract, from being intellectual. And even though I, with Howe, question the "frightening anti-intellectualism" of our society, and even her Stevensian notion that poets may (if not must) address themselves to an elite, I think the distinction (implicit at least) in LK's question between an "highly educated" elite and an "intellectual" one (i use the term intellectual more loosely, as a sense of rigorous thought-engagement even if it lacks the proper pedigrees and references) needs at least to be entertained if not stressed.... For, I know many intellects who have succumbed to a feeling of inadequacy in not being "highly educated" enough, many intellectuals who lack "intellectual confidence" (just as conversely, there are some who "possess" such "intellectual confidence" who may not be as intellectual as many of those who lack such confidence....) Anyway, perhaps this is too nitpicky (my method of stressing a few of the words, in a way I call "close reading"), but I think it DOES relate to Rebecca Woolf's original point (however expressed, and misunderstood, and perhaps by myself). I, speaking only for myself here though, find a reductive binary formulation contrasting "highly educated" and "intellectual" useful here: I consider Howe (and Olson and Pound, who in many ways she resembles) to be a poet that does require a more "highly educated" indidividual to read and appreciate (the learned references that point the reader to texts by COTTON MATHER or Fenellosa, etc., as if one must read them in order to "fully appreciate" Howe's and Pound's project) and would contrast this to other poets that, though they themselves may be considered "elite" and certainly at least as "highly educated," do not require as blatantly such "highly educated" readers (say, Stein, Riding, Stevens, Ashbery, for instance....if I'm going to play the lineage game here....). Sure, there are moments in some of this latter group in which "allusions" and references may flatter the highly educated (Ashbery's titles referencing the "tradition" and all the "in jokes" and "appropriations" from other texts), but it's been my experience at least that they are not as NECESSARY to the appreciation of the poem and the project, one can "get" and/or at least enjoy Ashbery without knowing that he's quoting a lengthy passage from a famous victorian. Anyway, I guess right now, I "side" with the latter mode, but I am certainly open to anybody calling my formulation into question....... chris stroffolino On Thu, 25 Mar 1999, BETSY ANDREWS wrote: > Well, let me weigh in with a bit of retro-biographical information about > Howe that speaks against the really wierd idea that the "crappy papers" of > bunch of "middle-class" students who love poetry at "middle-ground state > universities" toll the death knell of "all joy in poetry": > > In a 1995 Contemporary Literature interview, Lynn Kelly asked Howe," People > objecting to experimental writing sometimes complain that whatever claims > are made for its social engagement or marxist perspective, or its changing > hegemonic structures of consciousness, that, in fact, the aduience it > reaches is a very narrow, highly educated one, that the reader has to have > tremendous intellectual confidence even to grapple with these texts. What > do you think? Does that concern you?" > > Howe's reply: "No. The objection offends me. I think it is part of a > really frightening anti-intellectualism in our culture. Why should things > please a large audience? And isn't claiming that the work is too > intellectually demanding also saying a majority of people are stupid? > Different poets will always have different audiences. Some poets appeal to > younger people, some to thousands, one or two to millions, some to older > people, et cetera. If you have four readers whom you truly touch and maybe > even influence, well then that's fine. Poetry is a calling. You are > called to write and you follow." > > Howe's comments counter Rebecca's remarks from her post "Re: Shifts in > Modalities" in two totally different ways. Firstly, Howe refuses to > totalize. There are various aesthetic communities of readers and writers. > There is no "all" anything. Secondly, Howe refuses to condescend. She's > enraged by the condescension. > > I wonder if Rebecca thinks being middle class is the problem, or going to a > "middle-ground" state university is a problem--I have an MFA from one of > those places, George Mason in Fairfax, VA,--I went there on purpose, and > believe me, there was all sorts of joyous experimentation and > intellectualism there. Or if that provisional term of hers, "love" of > poetry is the problem. What does "love" in quotation marks mean? > ---------- > > From: Grant Jenkins > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > > Subject: defensive poetry > > Date: Wednesday, March 24, 1999 6:17 PM > > > > >This [the posting about S. Howe's particularities] is exactly what I was > > >talking about earlier when I said that "it [the shift into classrooms > > >producing critics whose facilities are lamed] will happen and it will > > >suck." I do not want to know what Susan Howe's family home was like and > I > > >do not want to know what her husband does for a living. Cultural studies > is > > >simple biographical criticism in thin disguise: an excuse for > > >sensationalism and for those who are uncomfortable with ambiguity to > write > > >about where their subject was born and how many doctors were around the > > >table, color of baby blanket, etc. > > > > Well, I guess I should come to my own defense--if I am able, being only a > > lame, lowgrade academic. > > > > All snideness aside, I have a question for you, Rebecca: what exactly > then > > do you think is the "joy of poetry"? > > > > What I can gather from reading the texts of Susan Howe--letters, poems, > > journals, marginalia--that it is precisely the textual particulars of > > another that she finds to be the "joy of poetry." Reading Melville's > > Marginalia, a colletion of his notations in books he was reading, > inspired > > her to write a poem that exposes the irony, uncertainty, and change in > not > > only Melville's "life" but also in history (another text). Immersing > > herself in the manuscripts of Emily Dickinson, Howe reclaims and > > reconsiders Dickinson in a feminist context. I read much joy, Susan's and > > mine, in both of those works. The joy comes not just from the work but > > that it was written, by someone. > > > > This is not biographical criticism because it does not distinguish > between > > a "text" and a "life." Both are in language yet bear the traces of > another > > person who chose to write. Nor is this mere cultural criticism, as you > > would have it. It's what Peter Neufeld in his post refered to as an > ethics > > that calls for a consideration of the uncertainty and alterity that mark > > our reading of an other's texts. There is more at stake than just > figuring > > out "what it means." Anyway, I don't know to many academics who have > this > > goal. (Isn't so much of the poetry that we all enjoy and feel invested > in > > marked by a blur between poetry and criticism? Must we draw that line in > > the sand again? Why?) > > > > For me, the joy of poetry comes not just from New Critically reading (or > > writing) the Genius of a poem, In Itself. But from following the textual > > threads out of the work and into other texts and other uncertainties, ad > > infinitum. Not knowing "what it means" is the greatest joy. > > > > Grant > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:14:32 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Steven Clay Subject: Lyn Hejinian and Emilie Clark presentation Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" During most of 1998 Lyn Hejinian and Emilie Clark collaborated on a wonderful book project 'The Traveler and the Hill and the Hill' which was published by Granary Books. On Wednesday, March 31 at 7:00 artist and poet will present a slide show and reading from the work at Teachers and Writers 5 Union Square West in New York City. The event is free and open to the public. Hope to see some of you there! ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 08:40:32 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Joe Amato/Kass Fleisher Subject: Re: Ray Johnson In-Reply-To: <5D5C5C8C3A41D211893900A024D4B97C445D05@md.facstaff.oglethorpe.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" the march 29 issue of _the nation_ has a nice write-up by arthur danto on "correspondance school art," incl. a discussion of the ray johnson show at the whitney in the context of fluxus... best, joe ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 08:51:34 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Summi Kaipa Subject: query In-Reply-To: <5D5C5C8C3A41D211893900A024D4B97C445D05@md.facstaff.ogletho rpe.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Does anyone out there know anything about the work of Abigail Child? I just recently saw part of a film of hers entitled "Is This What You Were Born For?" which had Hannah Weiner's words dubbed into it. Any leads? --Summi ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 01:51:40 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: louis stroffolino Subject: Barnard Conference... In-Reply-To: <199903252323.SAA86554@pimout4-int.prodigy.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Recently, I've been informed that the panellists giving papers, and/or talks at the Barnard Conference HAVE TO PAY A FEE in order to attend this conference. I personally (as well as some others I've talked to) find this appalling. When Stephen Cope (are you there Stephen; if so, backchannel please) invited me to be part of the conference, he made no mention of it, and since it was "in my backyard" as it were, I was thinking I--if not getting paid for my efforts--would at least not have to PAY to participate. I do not know if the "big names" are getting paid to present here, and I certainly have no gripe with them if they are, but the idea that us "smaller names" have to PAY is something I wish I would have been told up front. I understand that the organizers are putting a lot of work into this conference, but Barnard, one would think, certainly wouldn't benefit from the "petty cash" it would extract from underpayed (underused) academically unafffiliated writers.... So, I'm wondering if there's anything that can be done about this? Best, Chris Stroffolino ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 02:14:32 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "A. Jenn Sondheim" Subject: Sewn in You MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII \ Sewn in You @salt and gold your limbs around me / holes caught in trees and flowers give me thorns piercing the soft flesh thorns of love screaming against your holes on the way to Armageddon this is the way to Armageddon. so this is the way the thorns go, ripping the pink flesh. ripping the ribs and rims of the flesh, emerging from filth. call it filth and draw brown blood from me into havoc. don't you dare call me havoc. @havoc -> #@$(*&(*&$%))(*@#$ [noise is on the line] +++ You have been disconnected. Do you wish to reconnect? perfect love is always interruption. cut my nipples from my breasts: plant them. @cut @plant @grow Soldiers of the Golden Fleece and they have black bellies of black bombers cut into straight and rigid angles and just so reflecting radar and midnight tracers everywhere across your body's violent hills. @you your belly, holes and fabrics drawn from love and nature. i i i i i ruffles combs serrations raked across your shoulders, i can imagine drawing blood into the page among us i can't sleep without you, live without you any longer, can't breath without your flesh heavy in my lungs. i want your lungs in me. i want to breathe your breath, i want to eat your flesh. i want your lungs. i want your flesh. the @premonition of the Argonauts Black plane cuts the furrows weather-vaning across tillage and you can dream your bright lights, you can dream your trees. At night I try to sleep in the fires, there are lips and labia everywhere, skin swollen and cracked to the burst- ing point. There's no difference between you and me. Between the two of us. The deep slits in the dry dark earth carry water down and out to the road. The road's always filled but the people are invisible and I do not love them and will not learn to love them. don't give me your dreams as well. oak floors are hard but they tend to swell in floods, pushing out the walls of the house, everything falls to pieces, you can't find the planes @jason The Argonauts are coming: MEDEA OF THE FALLEN TIMBERS whose skin tears along those lines separating us. Our love will bring the planes down. Our love makes the growth of every living thing. if you leave me i will kill you, if i kill you, you will leave me. @sewn I spent my time sewing us together. I spent my time sending needles into and across the skin that holds the sky. Planes seep contrails everywhere sown like teeth holding culture against barbarian hordes, all hordes are barbarian. you shit on me, i crawl through it, to you you you; bury me alive, i'm there for you, the black planes replace the freighters, air replaces water, you replace my mind with your own and teach me things i never dreamed, lines and lineages of the black planes, the smell of silt and shit in the furrows gone down to the road, the path of the road gone down to the village where we are fucking the planes are coming again, the Argonauts have carried medusa, your cock is stone, i love your cock i love the taste of your shit, your vomit, your milk, your blood down on my knees beg you crawl through me @sword @shield @mail i can't feel anything any more but you, you're all i want to feel, threads cut through the flesh, threads seal our mouths and holes together @Argonaut They do capture and they do bring us before the king and Medea. Medea begs us to fuck her, Phaedra begs us to fuck her. We do fuck her. Do we violate Jason with the plane and spike. Do we thrust the sword and lance through mouth and hole. Does his tongue rot? does his tongue rot ours? his tongue does _no such thing,_ his tongue does no thing, there are no thing. @people There are people around & we want to fuck in front of them & strip each other & expose ourselves utterly. We can't keep our hands off each other. We swallow each other. We draw blood against the bone. Our hair is matted with blood. We give each other every possible disease and drug. We give each other every possible dream and mind. We do know the world and could make everything true and beautiful. We choose to fuck and love violently and hard. The planes are coming. we choose to draw blood with blood. we choose to draw planes with our blood. we choose to draw bombs with our blood, we draw broken homes and windows too. we draw smashed streets and cities too. we draw smashed people everywhere lying and screaming on the ground. we fuck so hard our cocks come out our cunts, our cunts out our mouths, our mouths out our cocks @out They do only to go back again. They do bind each other into violent knots. They do go back. we die for our love, our flesh and blood feeds the soil of all good-bad things @Argonaut A large shadow looms over the landscape, a male chained in armor carrying an iron sword, there are whirlwinds and shadows, there are duststorms and fires, there is the sound of a great word spoken in a great language. @speak @sew @fuck this is understood between us when our bodies clash together, hungered hard, torn apart and chain-male woven, you better hold me forever, you better hold me forever, you better be good to me, you better bury the planes, you better sew the fields and lips, till the fields, rake the shoulders of all surface burn the shoulder-furrows @write Write the name of aeroplanes and war. @havoc - @#$@^&$)(%$(*&#$%& [noise is on the line] +++ You have been disconnected. Do you wish to reconnect? @love Love soars its way through the bullets and bombs and everyone hears the truth. They fuck so hard it is louder than any word. They scream and scream and scream and scream. ___________________________________________________________________ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:28:04 +0100 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: svp Comments: To: british-poets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sub Voicive Poetry 1999 # 4 - delayed issue contains a new poem by Colin Simms and an extract from a new sequence by Bob Cobbing Sub Voicive Poetry 1999 # 6 - a poem by Elizabeth James which is a rather successful tribute to the excellent and important painter Bridget Riley - visual & possibly for sounding; an extract from the sequence Narcissus A by the Canadian Paul Dutton; programme notes by John Chris Jones to his scheduled performance of "Notes and Plays" at SVP in London UK on 30 3 99; a note on COMM ART 99 due to be held in Sabac, Jugoslavia this month; and e-letters on the NATO attack on Jugoslavia from Clemente Padin in Uruguay, and from Viktor and Miroljub Todorovic in Serbia Each £1 + 50p p & p for one or both in UK payable to Lawrence Upton. Will exchange with those unable to pay sterling Publication 1 4 99 Address 32 Downside Road, Sutton, Surrey SM2 5HP ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- BOMB THE GOOKS / BOMB THE GOOKS / BOMB THE GOOKS ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:56:37 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Barbara Henning Subject: apartment listing in NYC for June & July Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I'm going to be out of the country this summer and I'm looking for someone to sublet my apartment in June and July. I live in the East Village and the rent is $1,100 a month plus deposit. Barbara Henning henning@mindspring.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 14:53:50 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: An Evening with the Atlanta Poetry Group [3.1.99] Comments: To: Richard Harrington MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" The Characters; "Django" Prejsnar revolutionary & jazz poetist Fernando Prunty tall man with a large suspicious-looking sack James Sanders lawyer and beligerant trucker Rebecca 'the wrecker' Hyman proprietor of the the APG's current den of operations Luther Jondross ex-member of the line break police & sappy-bad r&b singer Miguel Xavier Maogoolaham internet smut merchant and/or poet-type-guy Two Students played Robbie the Robot & C3PO (both in drag) Jimmy Dickey a private eye who's now foresaken his sensitive poet image Finster a cat Cagney and Lacy and Stacy two TV cop detective women staging a real-life pilot in their bid to make it back on the air in the age of 'real-TV' - in this quest they've added a new partner 'Stacy' played by Loretta Swit The Camera Man yet another character in drag scene 1 [Rebecca's dining room] Django Prejsnar : and with this ode i deliver another smashing blow to the corporate capitalist state! [a grunt is heard drifting on the wind from downtown] Luther Jondross : (in a croony singsong as always) but you did go out of turn and i don't think that sets a very good precedent for the post revolutionary world now, do you? (rummages around in his bag) hey i forgot something, i gotta run down to my car scene two [on the staircase - two students are walking up Luther is walking down] Two Students: (in unison) um... do you know where Rebecca Hyman lives? Luther: well ahh.. yes - upstairs in number 10. you haven't got violence on your mind or anything do you ? i see that you have suspicious under-arm bulges and very cop-like footwear... Two students: (in unison) no. of course not. nothing like that. we are just students. students of rebecca hyman. we were just in the neighborhood. that is all. students. Luther: (releaved) O, OK.. scene 3 [in the back of a surveilance van M.X.Maogooglaham is bound and seated on the floor - Jimmy Dickey sits in a chair listening to Luther and the Two Students on a tiny speaker] Miguel: you'll never get away with this Dickey! Dickey: shut up you (hits Miguel in the ear with a coffee cup) scene 4 [rebecca's stark and inhospitable bohemian flat - Luther walks in the door] Luther: where are the two students Rebecca: they came, they left. they were supposed to meet someone at the cafe and got stood up so they came looking for me. Luther: but where did they go ? i didn't see them on the stairs or coming back from my car - all i saw was a big dark colored cable repar van out there with some smack & groan noises coming out of it James: well, i refrained from asking but i didn't think they looked like students - i thought they looked like the new class-09 surveilance droids the firm has taken to using whenever one of our temp secretaries calls in sick Rebecca: i assure you i've seen them in class - they're always perfectly punctual James: ah-ha! Fernando: so, Luther did you find what you were looking for? (he raises an eyebrow suggestively) [ just then the door bursts open and in rushes Jimmy Dickey gun in hand in a trenchcoat with elbow patches ] Jimmy: nobody move or i'll blast you bunch a pinkos right where you sit Fernando: (laughing) check out his fly! [Dickey looks down and everyone lunges for him - in the struggle Django pauses after stepping on Dickey's toe and has a sip of his beer - a flying elbow shatters the glass and chaos erupts as the Two Students enter from the bathroom and attack - it's a free-for-all] Luther: Ouch! Two Students: (in unison) ZAP! Fernando: POW! Rebecca: i'll flunk you losers James: ah-ha! [everyone turns to look at James who triumphantly yanks the cords out of the backs of the two students leaving them immobile] James: you see, they were droids - either we forgot that they'd come over and then gone to the bathroom together or they came in thru the mysterious window. but either way, their big mistake was in plugging themselves into the bathroom socket. Jimmy: you better let me go you poet-freaks - i got yr friend Miguel Xavier Maogooglaham and if i don't walk outta here safe and sound he'll be buried under computer book contracts for the next 8 -10 months Everyone (except Jimmy): Gasp! [a tense silence follows.. finally Luther Rebecca Fernando James and Django start to speak all at once. everyone stops again] Luther: i think i speak for all of us... we're not letting you leave Dickey - you see, it's just as easy to make fun of Miguel when he aint here as when he is - and you definately ain't walking out of here until you autograph The Younger American Poets for us Dickey: curses! oh alright, gimme it... [Fernando hands it over] Luther: say "to my dear friend Luther, you're more of a poet when you're flatulent than i when at my peak" Fernando: wait aminute, that's MY book, Dickey, write "I'm a big loser and i wish i was cool enough to be in the APG." Rebecca, James, Django: that's good... yeah [at this point the APG realizes that someone has been hurt and that there is, as per the Stein title, BLOOD ON THE DINING ROOM FLOOR - Dickey's trenchcoat and paper towels are used to mop up the blood - meanwhile Django, discovering he's lost another finger cries out] Django: dang it.. what next (he holds his arm up to help it stop bleeding) [Cagney, Lacy & Stacy burst thru the doorway followed by a cameraman] Cagney: alright nobody move Lacy: yeah, take it easy everyone Stacy: Klinger get a close up of Dickey (cameraman complies and we see that it's the lovable Corporal Klinger in a Mata Hari style ensemble) so what have we got here ? Cagney : well - there's Luther Jondross, one time member of line break police - and that's Django Prejsnar Lacy: these wd be the two droids i see Cagney: yes... Stacy: two worthless poets, two droids, two lamps, Jimmy Dickey and who might you be ? (she turns abruptly to James who had been sitting quietly at the table with a Weekly World News obscuring his face) James: i'm their lawyer (he gestures toward Luther and Django) any questions you ask them you ask thru me, got it? [there is obvious friction and desire in the room as Hotlips locks eyes with our not so nice trucker and bardly barrister] Cagney: give it a rest, Stacy - let's just get Dickey and go rough him up a little, whataya say ? [from out of nowhere Finster the cat lunges at the exposed ankle of Jimmy Dickey tearing away a hunk of flesh - he screams - the APG appauds - the police women momentarily forgetting their desire to do bodily harm to Dickey and attempt to keep Finster away from him] Lacy: it's too dark in here - turn on one of these lamps. Cagney: (reaching out she grasps Rebecca's earlobe and yanks) bulb must be burned out - these lamps are strange neither of the shades match but the bases are both wearing sweaters that neither match the shades or each other Stacy: aesthetics is not our beat [the cat is not found and Cagney, Lacy & Stacy drag Dickey out the door and down the hall - he can be heard pleading for a chance to write directions for the use of small appliances or perhaps school lunch menus - their cruel laughter drifts back into the apartment] Fernando: (taking off his lampshade) that was close Rebecca: (also removing hers and dropping it back into the suspicious sack brought by Prunty) and that yank on the lobe was an oucher! Luther: well, cool, all that's over with. same time next week? Rebecca, Django, Fernando, James, Finster: yeah. sure. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 10:07:06 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Richard Carfagna Subject: Re: Armand Schwerner Tablets Hi miekal, I don't know if this will be of any considerable help, but check out the essay at this site: http://www.valdosta.edu/vsu/dept/cas/eng/note/lavazzi.htm If you can't get to it , let me know and I can either e-mail or fax a copy to you. ric ---------- From: POETICS[SMTP:POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU] Sent: Thursday, March 25, 1999 9:39 AM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: Armand Schwerner Tablets Im working on a piece for armand schwerner & am having an impossible time finding anything from the tablets on the net, (if I go interlibrary loan it could take months out here), does anyone out there in popoland have ecopy of any, or know of any secret websites that may have excerpts? (who knows maybe alta vista is a shitty searchengine.) Or mayhaps someone is courageous enuf to key in their own favorite or lovely sections & post it herefront. just doesn't feel the sample without one-liners, something abt community. miekal ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 27 Mar 1999 17:38:32 PST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Chris Wall Subject: Re: VISUAL WORLD PEACE Comments: To: emgarrison@uswest.net, wr-eye-tings@sfu.ca Comments: cc: webart@onelist.com, olorin@EUnet.yu, grauer@pps.pgh.pa.us, tumblewd@micron.net, tompur@relia.net, tblan@telerama.lm.com, TinkerNet@onelist.com, trbell@home.com, warnell@memlane.com, tcwbanff@agt.net, thomast@infomatch.com, laconic@btinternet.com, skipsil@telepath.com, r.strasser@xterna-net.de, joris@csc.albany.edu, potepoet@home.com, pas@MNSi.Net, dtv@mwt.net, Mamalouise@aol.com, runawayslinky@hotmail.com, linguistics@onelist.com, poet@intergate.bc.ca, krheaton@hotmail.com, joecow@buffnet.net, jandrews@speakeasy.org, janan@sonic.net, jfuhrman@u.washington.edu, gwg6@cornell.edu, textra@edison.chisp.net, 2relax@intercomm.com, gizard@xanadu.cyborganic.com, clkpoet@ptd.net, clepadin@adinet.com.uy, dinsmore@studiocleo.com, cjoslyn@bingsuns.cc.binghamton.edu, csmeyers@concentric.net, ctheil@gladstone.uoregon.edu, boek861@tinet.fut.es, boek861@nil.fut.es, Bakuninmeow@hotmail.com, abrahams@ipmc.cnrs.fr Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain this focus, this communication, this concentration, let it's power reign, let it make a change It may be so easy for us to say as our skies are not filled with fire here and we do not hide in our houses in such a way but as we are human one family we feel and we pray bring an end to all suffering bring an end to all violence ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 10:35:40 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Subject: Zine Conference / Basinski MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit this came to the administrative account. Chris ----- Date: 3/26/99 3:04 PM -0500 From: "Michael D Basinski" Zine Conference - Connecting Counterculture an open form for zine editors, writers, readers and artists featuring panels and workshops on: technology, and zine culture, electronic distribution, zines and style, art and activism, zines and social change, zines and issues of race, class and gender, elitism and counterculture, oppression in the underground etc.... Bowling Green June 11-13. for more info email jason: praxis99@hotmail.com ---------------------------- Michael Basinski Poetry/Rare Books Collection SUNY at Buffalo 716-645-2917 Fax: 716-645-3714 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 08:38:30 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: charles alexander Subject: Re: bpNichol's TTA? In-Reply-To: <000301be789b$d05d6c00$759194cf@cfthomps.acs.ucalgary.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" derek and others interested: Yes, TTA presents the things you mention below, as well as a different way of thinking about literary history, how we view past works and what we might do with them, and definitely an appreciation of the physical manifestation of the text, so it's not, to me, just the "physical materiality of language," but how all aspects of physical presentation contribute to the *meaning* of the work. Not all of these aspects are characteristics of language, some are products of the photocopying process as in SHARP FACTS: Variations on TTA 26, and some are Nichol's inventions concerning possible arrangements of the specific language of the poem. Several parts of Translating Translating Appolinaire, as well as different writers'/artists' extension of the work, are online at the Light & Dust poets site. To find them, go to http://www.thing.net/~grist/l&d/lighthom.htm and scroll down the alphabetical author list to the Nichol entries. charles At 02:49 PM 3/27/99 -0700, you wrote: >poetic'eers > i was wondering what yr opinion/response was to bpNichol's >_TTA:Translating Translating Appolinaire_ - having read it now, and in the >process responding to a freind's essay on TTA, i believe that TTA explores, >much like bp's other works - the physical materiality of language. with TTA, >bp also probes the space between languages (that s the difficulties of >placing a translated text between the original (and its language base) and >the restraints of the 2nd language) as well as the chalenges of faithful >translations. the process of manipulation and translation is then used as a >means of exploring the alphabetic symbols (as in the pieces from TTA18) as >well as memory as both recollector and creator... (TTA also can relate to >nichol's other works of translations like Six Fillous, the catallus poems, >etc) i was just wodnering if anyone else had critical response to TTA, or if >they would like to receommend further homolinguistic translations, etc... > well thats it... > ciao > derek beaulieu > > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 09:02:44 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: charles alexander Subject: Re: Barnard Conference... In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" thanks for this, chris, particularly in the midst of the class/money thread. I know that this was one conference I found out about only too late to think of participating in as a panelist, but the fees also made me immediately dismiss it as something I would not be able to attend. I know not all conferences can be underwritten by grants and university funds -- but for some of us, particularly if we are unaffiliated with programs that might pay for us to go there, there's just no chance. As for another recent conference, I had been told that book sales would not be allowed at the PageMothers conference, and that took away one possible avenue of paying at least part of the expenses of a San Diego trip (not far from here), which contributed to my inability to attend that conference. I try to take one trip a year, either to a conference or to give readings, because once a year I can apply and usually receive some funding from local and state arts agencies for such travel purposes. Other trips may happen when there are invitations to totally funded readings. Beyond that, it's pretty much just stay home and work -- and that's not bad, but certainly the in-person contact with colleagues is limited. I agree with Joe Amato, everything points to or from money in one way or another. charles At 01:51 AM 3/29/99 -0500, you wrote: >Recently, I've been informed that the panellists giving papers, and/or >talks at the Barnard Conference HAVE TO PAY A FEE in order to attend >this conference. I personally (as well as some others I've talked to) >find this appalling. When Stephen Cope (are you there Stephen; if so, >backchannel please) invited me to be part of the conference, he made >no mention of it, and since it was "in my backyard" as it were, I >was thinking I--if not getting paid for my efforts--would at least >not have to PAY to participate. I do not know if the "big names" are >getting paid to present here, and I certainly have no gripe with them >if they are, but the idea that us "smaller names" have to PAY is >something I wish I would have been told up front. I understand that >the organizers are putting a lot of work into this conference, but >Barnard, one would think, certainly wouldn't benefit from the "petty >cash" it would extract from underpayed (underused) academically >unafffiliated writers.... >So, I'm wondering if there's anything that can be done about this? > >Best, >Chris Stroffolino > > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 15:25:49 +0000 Reply-To: baratier@megsinet.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: David Baratier Organization: Pavement Saw Press Subject: Larry's Comments: To: sub , poetry MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I have been voted on to the advisory board for Larry's & as result of thinly veiled debate followed by injuries we will have an excellent Spring line-up. We are funded by the OAC and located at 2040 N. High Street, Columbus OH Readings on Mondays, followed by an open Starts at 7pm March 29th Tom Bridwell - Former publisher / editor of salt-works press. Whose _Notes of a Cistern_ was one of the best books I read last year. For a 3 page preview contact Steve Ellis (who is here somewhere) & buy the new Oasia Broadside. April 5th Annie Finch April 12th Larry Smith & Michael Waldecki April 19th Kathy Fagan April 26th Brian Richards May 3rd Deborah Sobeloff Winner, Redding Memorial Contest May 10th David Shevin Please come out. Be well David Baratier ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 13:48:37 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: miekal and Organization: Awkword Ubutronics Subject: a manifesto, a media prayer & 3 questions Comments: To: wr-eye-tings@sfu.ca MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit (the unwar {z}one) http://net22.com/qazingulaza/o_so_vo/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 14:05:14 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: ken|n|ing Subject: A REMINDER / Comments: To: Poetics List In-Reply-To: <337304.3131692540@maclab6.walkway.buffalo.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII As a reminder: The spring issue of KENNING is soon to be on its way to subscribers -- is due in about a week or slightly more. Those who haven't taken the opportunity to check out my little magazine are encouraged to do so now. Sample copies ($5.00 / per) of vol. 1, no. 3 are still available, though running out fast. This issue features Daniel Bouchard, Standard Schaefer, Sheila E. Murphy, Charles Bernstein, John Lowther, Hoa Nguyen, Peter Ganick, Mark DuCharme, Lisa Jarnot, Ida Yoshinaga, Mark Prejsnar, Andrew Levy, Susan Smith Nash, Gustaf Sobin, Ra DiPalma, John Taggart, Tina Darragh, & Nathaniel Mackey interviewed by Brent Cunningham. Those wishing to subscribe should send $9.50 made out to the editor, Patrick F. Durgin, to the address below. Subscriptions received after mid-April will begin with vol. 1, no. 4 and end with the summer issue, no. 5, details below: Vol. 1, No. 4 [forthcoming]: Elizabeth Treadwell, Anselm Berrigan, Dale Smith, Leslie Scalapino, Mac Wellman, Eileen Myles, Bill Luoma, among many others. Vol. 2, No. 5 [forthcoming]: Lyn Hejinian, Jon Cone, Rachel Blau DuPlessis, Peter O'Leary, Brian Kim Stefans, Michael Gottlieb, among many others. There will be a full announcement once the spring issue "hits the stands" including ordering options other than direct from the publisher. Remember: the small-press community is self-defining, and a subscription here and there is one of the most vital ways to participate! Patrick F. Durgin | | k e n n i n g````````````````|`````````````````````````````````` a newsletter of contemporary |poetry, poetics, and non-fiction writing |418 Brown St. #10 Iowa City, IA 52245 USA ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 14:48:33 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Maria Damon (Maria Damon)" Subject: Re: Barnard Conference... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 1:51 AM 3/29/99, louis stroffolino wrote: >Recently, I've been informed that the panellists giving papers, and/or >talks at the Barnard Conference HAVE TO PAY A FEE in order to attend >this conference. I personally (as well as some others I've talked to) >find this appalling. When Stephen Cope (are you there Stephen; if so, >backchannel please) invited me to be part of the conference, he made >no mention of it, and since it was "in my backyard" as it were, I >was thinking I--if not getting paid for my efforts--would at least >not have to PAY to participate. I do not know if the "big names" are >getting paid to present here, and I certainly have no gripe with them >if they are, but the idea that us "smaller names" have to PAY is >something I wish I would have been told up front. I understand that >the organizers are putting a lot of work into this conference, but >Barnard, one would think, certainly wouldn't benefit from the "petty >cash" it would extract from underpayed (underused) academically >unafffiliated writers.... >So, I'm wondering if there's anything that can be done about this? > >Best, >Chris Stroffolino chris this is pretty common, as at MLA, ASA, etc. you have to register, which costs bucks, sometimes big bucks, and then pay your own expenses when yr there... unless you've got a generous dept. or special travel funds... sucky but true... ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 15:14:52 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Lowther,John" Subject: The APG in Tuscaloosa 3.6.99 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" on March 6th three parts of the APG (Atlanta Poetry Group) - namely Mark Prejsnar, Randy Prunty and )ohnLowther set out from @lanta for Tuscaloosa and a day of poetry-related activities - also a day of forgetting that Tuscaloosa is on the other side of the time line and thus lots of thinking we were late and/or getting to places early the ride went and town was reached motel checked-in and campus found (in spite of slanty directions - and a raspberry for Jon Berry) - at 1pm a panel began to take form in yellow brick english building - milling about and then seated, in addition to the APG were Hank Lazer, Jake Berry, Jon Berry, Jack Foley, Michael Martone, a collector of experimental literature named Sachler (i believe), William Doty, Bill Lavender, Adele Foley (ever-present on the microphones an tape machine) and some folks we didn't know or meet Jon Berry read a list of questions - supposedly 6 or 7 - for lack of anything else let's call the topic 'contemporary literature' - and then the show began... well the 'panel' - not really that 'showy' but you follow i took no notes and so will undoubtedly miss much - but - M.Martone's talk was about a series of 'travel pieces' he's been writing about Ohio - he's interested in the frame in which they get published and instead of sending them to ficton venues or whatever he tries to publish in small local newspapers in ohio Jack Foley had a prepared talk for which i wd be hard pressed to extract any single thesis - various phrases stuck out "a blind man haunts literature" (homer, don't you know) much was made of this by Foley that it was a challenge to literature on the page and - "the crisis of literature" apparently something due to the various options we have now, print, orality, electronic - this drew a lot of questioning - mainly from me as i felt and feel that the 'crisis' but is much overplayed - what of the crisis of colas ? we RC, Pepsi, etc... Foley used a series of examples that one can find in early Derrida and at times seemed to be ghosting along in parallel to a Jerome Rothenberg essay that i read someplace - within al of this it seem that he wants to see a more conscious return to Orality (big O) and he feels that the web/net (has anyone remarked on the slight creepiness of those two images) will somehow promote this thing he wants to happen - after criticizing langpo as poetry that is 'only on the page' he told me i wd see what more cd be done with poetry if i attended the reading that evening Jake Berry's comments were impressionistic and responsive to the mood up until that point - he put no program forward but seemed generally pleased that the internet was in some sense letting poets have more access and exposure Marvin Sachler spoke next from the standpoint of collector and audience for poetry & literature but not - as he insisted - producer - with his talk the themes of internet triumphalism that had been manifest in Foley's talk and pointed at in Jake's came rushing to the fore - this provoked some pointed questions about why poets should strive to have big audiences and general critique of the rah rah web web cheering that had been going on - Mr Sachler is certainly entitled to his opinions but to my ears they boiled down to a) writers should make their work more appealing visually so more people will be motivated to look at it and b) everyone should use the internet so that they can have a bigger audience - as was his wont Jack Foley got into this on Sachler's side of the debate and when i said something about poetry never having had a large audience by today's standards he disagreed and cited some work of the 19th C and how widely distributed it was - i have forgotten what this was unfortunately but i'm tempted to think it was by Longfellow - my suggestion was that if this sort of popularity was wanted then this sort of work ought be written Hank Lazer was next and he addressed more directly and with greater balance the web rhetoric as rhetoric while also not dismissing the work that is available there - Hank's talk was full of questions and had a poetic structure in many senses (which was unfortunately interrupted by another panelist who desired to talk over it at times) - sorry to say that much of what he was doing or trying to do in his piece was i think overshadowed by the specters of arguments already raised it ended with Sachler showing us some goodies from his collection the APG went in search of food and drink times passed we noted that we had little remaining until the performance was set to begin we were wrong (time zone) and arrived an hour early the evening's performance was held in a small theatre - a good space i thought for this sort of thing - the nights program was divided into two parts - roughly an hour each in the 1st hour Jack and Adelle Foley, Jake Berry, and Hank Lazer performed - the Foleys read together to begin - Jack seemingly the dominant (certainly louder) and then Adelle coming in to read on top of him in a performance that was - if nothing else - Loud - the material itself was hard for me to get much sense of behind the very theatrical inflection and general ostentatiousness of their production - but what i cd make out gave me some sense of why Jack cited Dylan Thomas several times during the afternoon panel - their performances cd also i think be characterized by a two-tone sense of dynamics; loud (relative to speaking) and LOUD relative to anything (be warned - i'm not in sympathy with Foley's work and so what merits it may have i cannot hope to point to) - but Hank was great - he was working with musical accompaniment from Jake Berry (guitar playing submerged bluesy stuff) and Wayne (forgot the last name - he's a photographer i understand and a pretty sympathetic accompanist on a variety of non-standard percussion instruments) - Hank's readings were varied and i had varied responses to them - one that struck me as particularly successful had him read a whole text of a poem to light accompanying sounds and then to improv his way thru it a 2nd time in collaboration with more input from Jake and Wayne - another that stuck out for the APG featured a line something like "Chilli Davis Legged out a grounder" - which Mark P - baseball man that he is 'got' to me it was a rush of interesting sounds that left me wondering for several seconds before something whispered 'baseball?' in my head Jake Berry read from Brambu Drezi book II (i think) and had only Wayne on percussion to work with - but i must say that while i am generally skeptical about the use of musical stuff with poetry - i think that these two worked very very well together - one reason for this is that Jake's work live has a chant-like insistence to it that Wayne was able to highlight without ever getting in the way of - a portion of Jake's reading was in some other language (made-up? real? glossolalia?) - this was maybe my favorite part of the whole thing as he really kicked the words out of his mouth with a lot of energy and yet never succumbed to theatricality - the live reading didn't change my thinking about Jake's work but definitely intensified the sense of it as a life-project and thickened the vibe which at times suggests snake-handling and 'old-time religion' (think of the beefheart song) as well as a sort of gothic sensibility with hints of voodoo and - frankly - suffering (why this collection doesn't add up to pretense is what makes Jake's work worthwhile) the 2nd hour was a grab bag of everybody else who came that had something to read - a visual highlight was a tuscaloosa native named Darryl standing tall and dressed in a charmingly outlandish fashion with dozens of ear-rings bracelets necklaces buckles and straps with flowing garb + a derby hat (there were feathers involved someplace i know) - but the visual highlight was him holding up in the spotlights a large translucent green dildo which wagged limply back and forth sending out green reflections Susan Holbrook a poet from vancouver read from a series of prose poems that build on lines from the brother grimm - i think the project is called 'Grimm" but am not sure - the syntax was mostly normative and the action came out of the sexual hints and suggestions in the opening lines which wd then get played out and turned around and around as the piece moved on we of the APG read as well - Mark took stage first and read from his Loss Leider poems - and did i think a pretty bang up job of it - i read from a ms. called Aeros in Err - Randy read a selection of poems and managed to get the house lights turned up and had copies for everyone in the audience which i think helped what was already a really great performance on his part (clearly the best of the three of us that evening) the last reader and a stupendous show-closer was Bill Lavender - introduced as The Man from New Orleans - Bill has great presence on stage and sort of lacsidasical presentation that combined beautifully with a substantial piece of poetry that made loops within itself to continually revisit a particular joke the terms and punchline of which varied throughout - it was really pretty great - not much else i can say about it after the performance we all went to a mexican restaurant when thru a series of mime-like activities and gestures i was able to get something that had no meat in it - everybody drank beer and margaritas and got pretty silly until time to go to sleep & Jake Berry looked very green under fluorescent light Hank was a great host and we look forward to going to other events there in the future - perhaps there are others in the southeast that might also in the future attend )L ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 09:01:41 +1200 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tony Green Subject: Re: [Fwd: [Fwd: Belgrade: a feminist report]] (fwd) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello Dubravka, I have forwarded your message to 2 more webnews@herald.co.nz largest NZ newspaper & news@TV3.co.nz "independent" commercial TV channel keep hoping best Tony Green -----Original Message----- From: Dubravka To: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Date: Tuesday, 30 March 1999 02:41 Subject: [Fwd: [Fwd: Belgrade: a feminist report]] (fwd) >dear lsit, i sent this to charls bernstein, but send to the list also. >this is the massage from belgrade pacifist groups. thanks to >charles and all friends to love and support. i hope i will write >more soon .. it is really horrible >dubravka djuric >---------- >Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 22:17:12 +0100 >From: Zarana Papic >To: Aco Divac , > Alain Lipietz & Francine Comte , > Aleksandar Kron , > Aljosa Mimica , Brana Stojkovic , > Chele , Danica Ilic , > Darka Radosavljevic , > Dimitrije Todorovic , > Dragan BULATOVIC , > Dragica Vujadinovic-Milinkovic , > Dragoljub Zarkovic , > Drinka Gojkovic , > Dubravka Djuric , > Dunja Blazevic , Duska , > Evropski pokret u Srbiji , > Goran Milicevic , Ivana Aleksic , > Iveta Todorova , Jelena Djordjevic , > Jelena Santic , KOTEVSKA Ana , > Liga socijaledmokrata Vojvodine , > Marija Bogdanovic , > Milena Dragicevic-Sesic , > Mima Pesic , > Mirjana Kovacevic , > nikola tucic , Pedja Dojcinovic , > Rade Veljanovski , Rastko Mocnik , > Slobodanka Ast , > Snjezana Milivojevic , > Srdjan Darmanovic , Srdjan Rajkovic , > Svetlana Slapsak , > Tinde Kovac-Cerovic , > vesna rakic-vodinelic , > Zaga Golubovic , Zarko Paunovic >Cc: Autonomous Women's Center Against Sexual Violence >Subject: [Fwd: [Fwd: Belgrade: a feminist report]] > > > >autonomous women's center against sexual violence >tirsova 5a, beograd, fr yugoslavia >tel/fax: 381.11.687.190 >e-mail: awcasv@eunet.yu > >-------- Original Message -------- >Subject: Belgrade: bombing day second >Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 18:29:51 +0000 >From: "Women's Center Belgrade" >To: Zarana Papic > > >Belgrade, 24 march, 99 >2pm. > > >dear friends, > >we have received many letters of support, calls from our friends >from Bosnia, Croatia and Slovenia, thank you. >The situation: >Many women are affraid more or less. last night some of us have >worked in the Womens Center untill 9pm, and after that the town was >calm and empty, and some citizens were around entrance of houses and >some in the cellers. >The parts of the town near the military bases felt hard detonations >and saw the fire. Those in the center of town did not. >The telephone lines have become difficult. > > >The worry of pacifists is the situation on Kosovo. >First, most artillery the serbian army has concentrated in the region >of Kosovo. Last night i finally caught the telephone lines with >Pristina and talked to my friend, and she said that the biggest worry >is the vengeance of serbian army against albanian population. >The CNN and BBC TV stations are obviously very pro-violence oriented >and they have inflicted much fear into people in Kosovo, on top of >the facts that are fearfull in themselves. The serbian officials have >cut electriciy in Pristina last night, and tuned in this morning. >The cutting of electricity was clearly the act of producing more fear >on the one already there. So you can imagine the mood in Pristina. >This morning there is no bread and milk in most of the shops in >Belgrade and Pristina. >and it is a beautifull sunny day. > > >The fact that enrages is that serbian regime has totally and >apsolutelly taken the control of all the media. Which means that >only few words come in, and that language of hatred, production of >enemies and vengeance politics is increasing every minute. Four >TV stations fused in one and two others in the other one. The people >who do not have satellite TV get few news per hour, about shelters >and enemies, and nothing else. This is as well frightening. > >Many women did not sleep last night, >and sirenas are on and off every couple of hours. So some of us are >constatly on the phone with those who feel bad. > > >Once again feminists and pacifists from Belgrade are again this time >sending sisterly tender words for our friends and Albanian women and >their families in Kosovo. > > >lepa mladjenovic > >autonomous women's center against sexual violence >tirsova 5a, beograd, fr yugoslavia >tel/fax: 381.11.687.190 >e-mail: awcasv@eunet.yu > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 10:26:26 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mairead Byrne Subject: Re: Class is . . . Comments: cc: kathylou@ATT.NET In-Reply-To: <19990326225231.EBWO16356@webmail.worldnet.att.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT On Fri, 26 Mar 1999 kathylou@ATT.NET wrote: > I'm a girl from the working class and I swear I > can smell class. I can sniff it out. I'm rarely wrong. > What does this mean? Perhaps that those less privileged > become adept at reading class codes--and often at adopting > those of the upper classes as a means of survival. Kathy Lou, this seems to me a very mixed blessing. I suppose there were always those who could sniff out a Catholic or a Jew or a Black. Often the sniffing is offensive rather than defensive. Sniff away: I find the notion obnoxious. Mairead ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 19:14:13 -0500 Reply-To: i_wellman@dwc.edu Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Don Wellman Subject: Re: Lettrisme MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In an issue of Adz, early 1980's there is an interview in English with Jean-Paul Curtay, a second or third generation Letterist with a book in french to his credit, Lettrrism. That book is undoubtedly a very important resource for info on the topic. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 21:57:09 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Noam Scheindlin Subject: READINGS Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Chez Laroe, a performance space on Park Avenue in Manhattan, will have three readings by poets on Saturday nights between April 17 and May 15. The schedule is as follows: April 17: Ruth Altmann, Lisa Buscani, Bill Kushner, and Thaddeus Rutkowski May 1: Tom X. Chao, Tom Savage, Noam Scheindlin, and Michele Madigan Sommerville May 15: Donna Cartelli, Merry Fortune, Lilla Lyon, and Dominic Hamilton-Little The address is 303 Park Avenue between 23 and 24th streets. Readings begin at 8. Refreshments are included with admission ($10). Reservations are required! Please call (212) 677-9133. (Please do not email me to do this, because I am only the conduit for this information.) Also, I have just finished beginning making my home page, and one can now read some of my poems online at http://nonoam.home.mindspring.com. Best, Noam Scheindlin ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:31:59 -0500 Reply-To: BANDREWS@prodigy.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: BETSY ANDREWS Subject: Re: A desperate Cry Comments: To: Irving Weiss MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Does anybody know the White House and State Dept email addresses? ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:42:47 -0800 Reply-To: Robert Freedman Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Robert Freedman Subject: Re: Armand Schwerner Tablets MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Miekal, You probably already know about this, but "Poems for the Millennium," Volume II (Rothenberg/Joris) has about 4 pages of excerpts. If you don't have access let me know and I'll copy the stuff for you and send it by email. Bob Freedman ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Carfagna To: Sent: Thursday, March 25, 1999 7:07 AM Subject: Re: Armand Schwerner Tablets > Hi miekal, > I don't know if this will be of any considerable help, but check out > the essay at this site: > http://www.valdosta.edu/vsu/dept/cas/eng/note/lavazzi.htm > If you can't get to it , let me know and I can either e-mail or fax a > copy to you. > ric > > > ---------- > From: POETICS[SMTP:POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU] > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 1999 9:39 AM > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: Armand Schwerner Tablets > > > > Im working on a piece for armand schwerner & am having an impossible > time finding anything from the tablets on the net, (if I go interlibrary > loan it could take months out here), does anyone out there in popoland > have ecopy of any, or know of any secret websites that may have > excerpts? (who knows maybe alta vista is a shitty searchengine.) > > > Or mayhaps someone is courageous enuf to key in their own favorite or > lovely sections & post it herefront. > > > just doesn't feel the sample without one-liners, something abt > community. > > miekal ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:29:05 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Poetics List Subject: Re: A desperate Cry MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The President may be contacted via the www at The White House site, ; this is done with a form, so there's no "portable" email address I can provide. The State Department, too, has a "feedback" section; the URL for that site is . Their "foreign policy opinion" email address is . Email is better than nothing, but personally I think it's a good idea always to couple that with a snail-mail letter or a telephone call - the relative ease of email contact (and email petitioning) is not lost to these people. Chris ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:39:44 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mairead Byrne Subject: ictus MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Ictus is a listserv set up for the immediate purpose of communicating with poets in Kosovo and Serbia. I have been a member of various poetry/poetics listservs through the bombing of Iraq and now Serbia. I would like to see if it is possible to establish longer dialogues than those which have erupted in immediate reaction to attack. Poets everywhere are welcome to join. This is an unmoderated list. Mairead Byrne http://ictus.listbot.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 12:06:11 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Prejsnar Subject: Re: LYNN KELLY's Q & SUSAN HOWE'S A In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII i feel that i would argue that howe's formulation of the question is *the better of the two*... quite simply, the question as it was put to her, does point up precisely the anti-intellectualism that is a basic structural component of U.S. culture. De Toqueville mentioned it sharply. It is deeply rooted and old, and distinguishes this national culture from many others.. i understand the point Chris is making below; it is not a totally wrongheaded distinction, i think; but (his "nitpicky" comment does indeed get a bit at what i feel...) it is a very fine-grained distinction, and i believe it doesn't do justice to the relevance of Howe's point. These questions about educational level, etc., are often thrown at interesting poetry; and are very instructive for what they suggest about the person asking 'em.. but often they are not, fundamentally, an accurate critique of nonmainstream writing....partly for the reasons Howe mentions; poetry has many different functions and niches, and should not be imagined as aimed at a "Common Reader;" Almost all vital work done in the arts in the last 80 years has a specific audience, one that is not authorized (as a "mass audience") by the approval-machinery of the culture bizness; whether one thinks of Ingmar Bergman or Robert Wilson or Ornette Coleman.... And the 20th century was not the only time this has been true, over history. mark prejsnar On Mon, 29 Mar 1999, louis stroffolino wrote: > Looking over the exchange that Betsy Andrews post between the two > aformentioned writers, I come to a different conclusion about this > exchange. You may notice that LK's question (her formulation of an > 'objection' that could be raised to Susan Howe's poetry) is not really > being addressed by SH, at least that's what I noticed.... > For LK asks about EDUCATION, asks whether a poetry like Howe's > may only reach a "very narrow, highly educated," audience, > and whether, in America today, one may have "tremendous intellectual > confidence" WITHOUT being "highly educated." I thus see HOWE as > misreading LK's question, because S.Howe seems to "elide" the > distinction between "highly educated" and "intellectualism".... > I think it's possible that one may be "intellectual" without > being "highly educated." It's even quite plausible that in many cases > being "highly educated" can GET IN THE WAY, or detract, from being > intellectual. And even though I, with Howe, question the "frightening > anti-intellectualism" of our society, and even her Stevensian notion > that poets may (if not must) address themselves to an elite, > I think the distinction (implicit at least) in LK's question between > an "highly educated" elite and an "intellectual" one (i use the term > intellectual more loosely, as a sense of rigorous thought-engagement > even if it lacks the proper pedigrees and references) needs at least > to be entertained if not stressed.... > For, I know many intellects who have succumbed to a feeling of > inadequacy in not being "highly educated" enough, many intellectuals > who lack "intellectual confidence" (just as conversely, there are > some who "possess" such "intellectual confidence" who may not be > as intellectual as many of those who lack such confidence....) > > Anyway, perhaps this is too nitpicky (my method of stressing a few > of the words, in a way I call "close reading"), but I think it DOES > relate to Rebecca Woolf's original point (however expressed, and > misunderstood, and perhaps by myself). I, speaking only for myself here > though, find a reductive binary formulation contrasting "highly educated" > and "intellectual" useful here: I consider Howe (and Olson and Pound, who > in many ways she resembles) to be a poet that does require a more > "highly educated" indidividual to read and appreciate (the learned > references that point the reader to texts by COTTON MATHER or Fenellosa, > etc., as if one must read them in order to "fully appreciate" Howe's > and Pound's project) and would contrast this to other poets that, though > they themselves may be considered "elite" and certainly at least as > "highly educated," do not require as blatantly such "highly educated" > readers (say, Stein, Riding, Stevens, Ashbery, for instance....if I'm > going to play the lineage game here....). Sure, there are moments in > some of this latter group in which "allusions" and references may > flatter the highly educated (Ashbery's titles referencing the "tradition" > and all the "in jokes" and "appropriations" from other texts), but it's > been my experience at least that they are not as NECESSARY to the > appreciation of the poem and the project, one can "get" and/or at least > enjoy Ashbery without knowing that he's quoting a lengthy passage from > a famous victorian. Anyway, I guess right now, I "side" with the latter > mode, but I am certainly open to anybody calling my formulation into > question....... > > chris stroffolino > > > > On Thu, 25 Mar 1999, BETSY ANDREWS wrote: > > > Well, let me weigh in with a bit of retro-biographical information about > > Howe that speaks against the really wierd idea that the "crappy papers" of > > bunch of "middle-class" students who love poetry at "middle-ground state > > universities" toll the death knell of "all joy in poetry": > > > > In a 1995 Contemporary Literature interview, Lynn Kelly asked Howe," People > > objecting to experimental writing sometimes complain that whatever claims > > are made for its social engagement or marxist perspective, or its changing > > hegemonic structures of consciousness, that, in fact, the aduience it > > reaches is a very narrow, highly educated one, that the reader has to have > > tremendous intellectual confidence even to grapple with these texts. What > > do you think? Does that concern you?" > > > > Howe's reply: "No. The objection offends me. I think it is part of a > > really frightening anti-intellectualism in our culture. Why should things > > please a large audience? And isn't claiming that the work is too > > intellectually demanding also saying a majority of people are stupid? > > Different poets will always have different audiences. Some poets appeal to > > younger people, some to thousands, one or two to millions, some to older > > people, et cetera. If you have four readers whom you truly touch and maybe > > even influence, well then that's fine. Poetry is a calling. You are > > called to write and you follow." > > > > Howe's comments counter Rebecca's remarks from her post "Re: Shifts in > > Modalities" in two totally different ways. Firstly, Howe refuses to > > totalize. There are various aesthetic communities of readers and writers. > > There is no "all" anything. Secondly, Howe refuses to condescend. She's > > enraged by the condescension. > > > > I wonder if Rebecca thinks being middle class is the problem, or going to a > > "middle-ground" state university is a problem--I have an MFA from one of > > those places, George Mason in Fairfax, VA,--I went there on purpose, and > > believe me, there was all sorts of joyous experimentation and > > intellectualism there. Or if that provisional term of hers, "love" of > > poetry is the problem. What does "love" in quotation marks mean? > > ---------- > > > From: Grant Jenkins > > > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > > > Subject: defensive poetry > > > Date: Wednesday, March 24, 1999 6:17 PM > > > > > > >This [the posting about S. Howe's particularities] is exactly what I was > > > >talking about earlier when I said that "it [the shift into classrooms > > > >producing critics whose facilities are lamed] will happen and it will > > > >suck." I do not want to know what Susan Howe's family home was like and > > I > > > >do not want to know what her husband does for a living. Cultural studies > > is > > > >simple biographical criticism in thin disguise: an excuse for > > > >sensationalism and for those who are uncomfortable with ambiguity to > > write > > > >about where their subject was born and how many doctors were around the > > > >table, color of baby blanket, etc. > > > > > > Well, I guess I should come to my own defense--if I am able, being only a > > > lame, lowgrade academic. > > > > > > All snideness aside, I have a question for you, Rebecca: what exactly > > then > > > do you think is the "joy of poetry"? > > > > > > What I can gather from reading the texts of Susan Howe--letters, poems, > > > journals, marginalia--that it is precisely the textual particulars of > > > another that she finds to be the "joy of poetry." Reading Melville's > > > Marginalia, a colletion of his notations in books he was reading, > > inspired > > > her to write a poem that exposes the irony, uncertainty, and change in > > not > > > only Melville's "life" but also in history (another text). Immersing > > > herself in the manuscripts of Emily Dickinson, Howe reclaims and > > > reconsiders Dickinson in a feminist context. I read much joy, Susan's and > > > mine, in both of those works. The joy comes not just from the work but > > > that it was written, by someone. > > > > > > This is not biographical criticism because it does not distinguish > > between > > > a "text" and a "life." Both are in language yet bear the traces of > > another > > > person who chose to write. Nor is this mere cultural criticism, as you > > > would have it. It's what Peter Neufeld in his post refered to as an > > ethics > > > that calls for a consideration of the uncertainty and alterity that mark > > > our reading of an other's texts. There is more at stake than just > > figuring > > > out "what it means." Anyway, I don't know to many academics who have > > this > > > goal. (Isn't so much of the poetry that we all enjoy and feel invested > > in > > > marked by a blur between poetry and criticism? Must we draw that line in > > > the sand again? Why?) > > > > > > For me, the joy of poetry comes not just from New Critically reading (or > > > writing) the Genius of a poem, In Itself. But from following the textual > > > threads out of the work and into other texts and other uncertainties, ad > > > infinitum. Not knowing "what it means" is the greatest joy. > > > > > > Grant > > > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:25:41 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "David L. Erben" Subject: Robert Pinsky Comments: To: UB Poetics discussion group MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Robert Pinsky will be speaking at the Doerman Theater at the University of Toledo, Ohio, on Friday, April 2. His talk will start at 4 PM. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 23:03:02 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: kathylou@ATT.NET Subject: Re: Class is . . . (fwd) ---------------------- Forwarded Message: --------------------- From: kathylou@att.net To: mbyrne@ithaca.edu Subject: Re: Class is . . . Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 19:04:49 +0000 Mairead, I don't care if you think it's obnoxious. Survival is survival. One does what one needs to do in order to survive. For poor and working class folks survival is often the name of the game--not "offense." In any case, you're just trying to turn what I said on its head without responding to the crux of my point, which I find obnoxious. Backchannel further, please. Thank you. Kathy Lou Schultz > > > On Fri, 26 Mar 1999 kathylou@ATT.NET wrote: > > > I'm a girl from the working class and I swear I > > can smell class. I can sniff it out. I'm rarely wrong. > > What does this mean? Perhaps that those less privileged > > become adept at reading class codes--and often at adopting > > those of the upper classes as a means of survival. > > Kathy Lou, this seems to me a very mixed blessing. I suppose there were > always those who could sniff out a Catholic or a Jew or a Black. Often > the sniffing is offensive rather than defensive. Sniff away: I find the > notion obnoxious. > Mairead > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 15:17:47 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Taylor Brady Subject: Re: query In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19990329085134.006ae464@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Summi (and all who might be interested) - Might not be the case any longer, but I know that as recently as last year a video was available which archived three (?) of Child's 70's and early 80's works - I remember, in particular, "Mayhem," don't know offhand whether "Is This What You Were Born For?" was included. The distributor was one commonly used by Media Studies folks at Buffalo - Anya Lewin would be a good person to ask. Anya, are you out there? In any event, if Anya isn't on the list, I'd be happy to forward queries to her - hesitant as always to give out private e-mail addresses on lists, but I'd like to help however I can. Overcautiously yours, Taylor -----Original Message----- From: UB Poetics discussion group [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU] On Behalf Of Summi Kaipa Sent: Monday, March 29, 1999 6:52 AM To: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: query Does anyone out there know anything about the work of Abigail Child? I just recently saw part of a film of hers entitled "Is This What You Were Born For?" which had Hannah Weiner's words dubbed into it. Any leads? --Summi ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 06:17:48 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Harris Schiff Subject: George Schneeman's 1999 Calendar: Paesaggi Senesi Comments: To: harris@cyberpoems.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sample George Schneeman's 1999 Calendar: Paesaggi Senesi Please forward this message to anyone who might be interested, thanks. http://cyberpoems.com/cyberchiks1/calendario.htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 16:34:43 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Charles Bernstein Subject: Post from Dubravka Djuric (fwrd) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; types="text/plain,text/html"; boundary="=====================_1278556==_.ALT" --=====================_1278556==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dubravka Djuric is a poet and translator and journalist living in Belgrade, who among many projects is an editor of Pro Femina. She also a good friend (Dubravka and her husband the philosopher and art historian Misko Suvokovic, spent a semester in Buffalo some years ago as Poetics Program Fellows). Dubravka asked me to pass along this post if I thought it would be of interest to the list (she notes that the names of the days of the week may be wrong). A few days ago, Dubravka posted a statement to the list from the Belgrade feminist peace activist Lepa Mladjenovic. --Charles Bernstein Date: Sat, 27 Mar 1999 09:53:34 +0100 (CET) From: Dubravka monday: i was in the center of the city seeing some friends. people already start talking about bombing. i heard comment 'we will be occupied as macedonia, bosnia and croation' didn't comment it. i stop commenting because it doesn’t have any sense. we all think what we want to think. thursday: all day spent in front of tv, reading newspapaers and was nervous and paralyzed. wednesday: decided do go to visit some friends who work in presses and to give them new issue of pro femina magazine that appeared few days earlier. on my way to the center first impression was that the town had very few people on streets, which is unusual. belgrade is full of people specially because so many refugees become its citizens, you could hardly walk through streets they were so full of people and crowded with cars. my friends kept talking about bombing, about buying enough food. again on streets, i could feel fear in the air. belgrade was city of ghosts. went to NUNS (office of independent journalist association, also pro femina is there) met friend who told me about veran matic (b 92 is publisher of pro femina). all around could feel fear. in the evening sirens. we could hear few detonations. spent some time behind tv, but not much information till 21 hours, then some confused one. during the night sirens, but we continued to sleep. saturday: went to downtown. few people on the street. went to buy food twice. supermarket was full of people who buy food and didn't comment on anything. you could feel fear on their faces. at night we were in darkness. few detonations near my husband’s and my place. then we went in bed. friday: went to downtown. more people on streets, more cars. the atmosphere calmed. people walked. went to NUNS to pick up the some books. met friends who spoke about what might happened. at quarter past four heard sirens. jumped into the bus. look to the people on the street who just continued to walk normally, back home. all afternoon was on line with misko replying to friends from slovenia, croatia, usa that we are ok. friends from belgrade and novi sad called and we called then. words of courage, and deep worrying. people are scared how long this could last, what could happen. the experience is that all our lives are in danger. and i think about people, many of them our friends and close relatives, in croatia and bosnia during the war... forwarded a message from friends written by belgrade feminist peace activist lepa mladjenovic . went to bed around 22. i couldn't sleep, and suddenly detonations. we all went downstairs, whole city was in darkness. heard detonations for about 20 minutes, somewhere relatively near us. scared. spent few minutes outside in yard. but didn't see anything. arround 4 in the morning another siren, one detonation. continued to sleep. ...... thanks all friends who are continually in contact by e mail with us! --=====================_1278556==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dubravka Djuric is a poet and translator and journalist living in Belgrade, who among many projects is an editor of Pro Femina. She also a good friend (Dubravka and her husband the philosopher and art historian Misko Suvokovic, spent a semester in Buffalo some years ago as Poetics Program Fellows). Dubravka asked me to pass along this post if I thought it would be of interest to the list (she notes that the names of the days of the week may be wrong). A few days ago, Dubravka posted a statement to the list from the Belgrade feminist peace activist Lepa Mladjenovic.  --Charles Bernstein



Date: Sat, 27 Mar 1999 09:53:34 +0100 (CET)
From: Dubravka <dubravka@opennet.org>





monday: i was in the center of the city seeing some friends. people already start talking about bombing. i heard comment 'we will be occupied as macedonia, bosnia and croation' didn't comment it. i stop commenting because it doesn=92t have any sense. we all think what we want to think.
thursday: all day spent in front of tv, reading newspapaers and was nervous and paralyzed.
wednesday: decided do go to visit some friends who work in presses and to give them new issue of pro femina magazine that appeared few days earlier. on my way to the center first impression was that the town had very few people on streets, which is unusual. belgrade is full of people specially because so many refugees become its citizens, you could hardly walk through streets they were so full of people and crowded with cars. my friends kept talking about bombing, about buying enough food. again on streets, i could feel fear in the air. belgrade was city of ghosts. went to NUNS (office of independent journalist association, also pro femina is there) met friend who told me about veran matic (b 92 is publisher of pro femina). all around could feel fear.  in the evening sirens. we could hear few detonations. spent some time behind tv, but not much information till 21 hours, then some confused one. during the night sirens, but we continued to sleep.
saturday: went to downtown. few people on the street. went to buy food twice. supermarket was full of people who buy food and didn't comment on anything. you could feel fear on their faces. at night we were in darkness. few detonations near my husband=92s and my place. then we went in bed.
friday: went to downtown. more people on streets, more cars. the atmosphere calmed. people walked. went to NUNS to pick up the some books. met friends who spoke about what might happened. at quarter past four heard sirens. jumped into the bus. look to the people on the street who just continued to walk normally, back home. all afternoon was on line  with misko replying to friends from slovenia, croatia, usa that we are ok. friends from belgrade and novi sad called and we called then. words of courage, and deep worrying. people are scared how long this could last, what could happen. the experience is that all our lives are in danger. and i think about people, many of them our friends and close relatives, in croatia and bosnia during the war... forwarded a message from friends written by belgrade feminist peace activist lepa mladjenovic . went to bed around 22. i couldn't sleep, and suddenly detonations. we all went downstairs, whole city was in darkness. heard detonations for about 20 minutes, somewhere relatively near us. scared. spent few minutes outside in yard. but didn't see anything. arround 4 in the morning another siren, one detonation. continued to sleep.

......

thanks all friends who are continually in contact by e mail with=20 us!

 --=====================_1278556==_.ALT-- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:46:12 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "Loss Pequen~o Glazier" Subject: Wednesday Reading - Buffalo Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable A reminder for those in the area: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- Digital Poetry Reading / Hypertext Performance JIM ROSENBERG &=20 LOSS PEQUE=D1O GLAZIER Wednesdays at 4 Plus Series=20 Weds., March 31, 4pm=20 CFA Screening Room Rosenberg is one of the leading hypertexual/web poets and theorists, whose= =20 best known work is Intergrams (Eastgate Systems). Poet Glazier is Director of UB's Electronic Poetry Center and Webmaster for= =20 the College of Arts & Sciences. Books include Leaving Loss Glazier, and= Small=20 Press: An Annotated Guide. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:46:09 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Michael Magee Subject: Re: LYNN KELLY's Q & SUSAN HOWE'S A In-Reply-To: from "Mark Prejsnar" at Mar 29, 99 12:06:11 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit According to Mark Prejsnar: > > These questions about educational level, etc., are often thrown at > interesting poetry; and are very instructive for what they suggest about > the person asking 'em.. > Mark's absolutely right here - who brings up these questions in most cases? - highly educated mainstreamers, no? In places like NYTBR, no? As evidence to the contrary of this correlation btwn "experimental" and educated "elite" I'd point to the many poets I know working in various "poetry in the schools" projects and to one specific example: Susan Stewart using Harryette Mullen's *Muse & Drudge* in a literacy program and then having Harryette flown in to read for those students, to great affect and much fun, I hear. Elitist? Hardly. In contrast, could *anything* be more alienating to, say, an undereducated, working class person than, say, Richard Wilbur's "Still, Citizen Sparrow"? Now *that's* a poem which requires the full regalia of a long and evil "education." -m. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 18:33:01 -0600 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Maria Damon Subject: Re: Class, Working Pages, and the Mothers Conference In-Reply-To: <4513d87e.36fc2c22@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable At 7:53 PM -0500 3/26/99, Bobbie West wrote: =2E.. Among what I consider to be academically (middle >class) influenced magazines and presses, the grittier aspects of life are >often not addressed at all or they=92re abstractified to the point of numbn= ess. >The middle class tendency to smooth over all roughness, to hush the noise, = to >tame the emotions, can lead to smooth poetry, soothing to the mind=92s ear,= but >producing about as much engagement as watching a roomful of people think. >Added value is accrued by including references to philosophical or literary >texts that are either unavailable or seem irrelevant to the concerns of the >lower classes. Of course I=92m not saying that all working class people= like it >rough and all middle class people like it smooth, but that the rough is mor= e >quickly dismissed and that those who do the dismissing are more likely to b= e >>from a middle class or higher social background. > this is very interesting. can you mention anyone other than dorothy allison who seems to you to correspond to the class differences you indicate? what about kathy acker? i'd peg her as a "nice middle class jewish girl" and she does indeed allude to lots of high-falutin writers in her work, but it's not exactly smooth. someone like hejinian i can see ---a number of my working class students are genuinely mystified by why anyone would want to write like her or like jane bowles... ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 09:14:30 -0400 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Pierre Joris Subject: Re: Lettrisme MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Don Wellman wrote: > In an issue of Adz, early 1980's there is an interview in English with > Jean-Paul Curtay, a second or third generation Letterist with a book in > french to his credit, Lettrrism. That book is undoubtedly a very > important resource for info on the topic. The book is called _La Poésie Lettriste_, was published by Seghers in 1974 and is excellent -- a long historico-critical intro on lettrism, followed by a solid anthology of lettrist texts. The book is most certainly out of print (unless recently reprinted) but should be available in some University libraries via Interlibrary loan, if one has an institutional affiliation. Pierre -- ======================== Pierre Joris joris@csc.albany.edu http://www.albany.edu/~joris/ 6 Madison Place Albany NY 12202 tel: 518 426 0433 fax: 518 426 3722 ======================== Nomadism answers to a relation that possession cannot satisfy. — Maurice Blanchot ======================== ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 09:36:34 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Gerald Schwartz Subject: Re: LYNN KELLY's Q & SUSAN HOWE'S A Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Is there any validity to considering this a question of who sets the agenda? I poet's "explanation" of a reality may serve as the context in which a reader considers the meaning of an "event", even if the reader nd the poet have diametrically opposede renderings of the same occurence. By strssing poetry as information, I do not mean to suggest that a poem's information is the only source. But, given the audience, may be of a limited power in swaying. Take it further, there are probably poetic productions that lower their audience's aspirations to advance. What I mean to suggest is that a poem can impart to occurences their public persona/character as it transforms a mere happening to a publically recognizeable event. Along these lines I am thinking of some performances as the modern replacement of the town crier. Some performances, perhaps more in a griot tradition, track "fires", reporting on them, while offering help or initiating criticism as appropriate. Gerald ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 07:03:46 +1200 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Tony Green Subject: Re: Lettrisme MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit & more bibliography: _Experimental -- Visual -- Concrete : avant -garde poetry since the 1960s_ ed.K.David Jackson, Eric Vos & Johanna Drucker. (Avant garde critical studies; 10) Rodopi B.V., Amsterdam-Atlanta.Ga 1996. ISBN: 90-5183-959-6 (bound) ISBN: 90-5183-941-3 (paper) Several references to Isou. Neat summary of activity of Lettrism pp 46-47 in Johanna Drucker's useful essay _ Experimental, Visual, and Concrete Poetry: A Note on Historical Context and Basic Concepts._ The book resulted from the Yale "Symphoposium" on Contemporary Poetics and Concretism, April 5-7, 1995. The conference was initially to be about Augusto & Harold de Campos, but it expanded to include later visual, sound, aleatoric, & concrete poetries. The result was an encounter between early Concretism & its disciples & later practitioners in a related but much wider range of poetries. You might guess what my spell-checker suggests for all this. Tony Green ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 16:53:07 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: sylvester pollet Subject: Enslin Special Offer Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" (Chris, I'm sending this again--I don't think it ever got through) Sylvester Theodore Enslin's _THEN, AND NOW_ Selected Poems 1943-1993, ed. Mark Nowak (Orono: National Poetry Foundation 1999) is here, and it's a beautiful book. 430 pages, including an interview the editor did at Ted's home in Maine, August 1997. Regular price: $19.95 paper, $34.95 cloth Special offer : $15. paper, $28. Cloth. Add $3. for shipping (U.S.) or $5. (international). send orders to The National Poetry Foundation, Room 302 5752 Neville Hall University of Maine Orono ME 04469-5752 or you can e-mail them to Gail Sapiel & be billed, but mention the special offer. Here's part of the jacket copy: "Theodore Enslin began his artistic career as a musician, trained by Nadia Boulanger; and the titles of many of his books suggest his continuing fascination with the "musication" of language: _Etudes, Opus O, Songs w/o Notes, Carmina, The Diabelli Variations_. Like other poets of his generation, such as Robert Creeley, Robert Kelly, and Edward Dorn, Enslin carries forward Charles Olson's sense of the large historical and ethical function of poetry and his dedication, at once ecopoetic and ethnopoetic, to place. Also identified with the Objectivist tradition of Louis Zukofsky, Lorine Niedecker, and George Oppen, he writes about meaning in the dailiness of human life and the ineluctable reality of the things in this world." Enslin will be reading in Orono April 9--contact me for details, if you're passing through. Sylvester Pollet ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 17:14:24 EST Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Catherine Daly Subject: Spelling Bromige Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Well, not Spelling TV, at least. I confess to more interest in the translation (or not) of place names, and their spelling and pronunciation. Shouldn't maps be the same in any language? How to get to Loyola Marymount: Go toward the airport, and turn at the giant donut. When the street names are the same as the names of famous Jesuits, you're there. When the angelus rings eight, the reading is supposed to start. Try to mill around looking cool, like you're not waiting for the reading. I toured around the business school, and picked up a free bumper sticker being given out by the Center for Ethics and Business, "More Fun than Decent People Think Should be Legal!" While I believe I am more familiar with Peter Gizzi's work than with Elizabeth Willis', I have her _Human Abstract_ book and none of Peter's books. Therefore, I was struck by the difference between what I thought while reading Elizabeth's poems and what I thought hearing them. I was very interested, reading, about the religious arguments, but was more interested, listening in the grey room, about the images of and from visual art. Ah, Blake, I might say, had she not read mostly new work that was not from _Human Abstract_. A series called "Turneresque" was very enjoyable, and I guess I have to go to the Getty again, something of a scary religious experience itself, to see their Richard Dad painting. Gizzi's emergent thread was Villon and ballads, IMO. Rgds, Catherine Daly e.g. << new fictitious business name cadaly@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 17:44:40 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: KENT JOHNSON Organization: Highland Community College Subject: Anti-war resources MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Z Magazine has a number of excellent statements on the Yugoslavia bombing: Articles by Noam Chomsky, Edward Herman, Diana Johnstone, position papers by the Green Party USA, War Resisters League, and numerous other things. A very helpful site for cutting through Washington/ NATO/ CNN propaganda. http://www.lbbs.org/ZNETTOPnoanimation.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 15:57:02 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Mark Weiss Subject: Re: Class is . . . In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Mairead: In any multi-ethnic, multi-class environment everyone does this kind of sniffing. When I moved into a largely Irish and Italian neighborhood in Brooklyn the stoop-sitters very quickly quizzed me and pronounced me Jewish. There was no malice in it, ever, and I lived there for close to a decade. What they learned was what category of their experience I fit into, and my behavior was measured against that norm (and served to moderate it to some extent) rather than against what would be expected of an Irishman. It wasn't "What else can you expect from a Jew" but "He's Jewish, which means that x behavior probably indicates..." The ability to maintain and apply disparate approximate models of behavior is a necessary survival skill in cosmopolitan environments. Ethnicity and class are among other things behavioral languages that often need to be translated. My ex-wife, who came from a part of North Carolina where, as she expressed it, there were three classes: Southern, Mountain, and Black, was always amazed at my ability (perfectly average for a New Yorker) to arrive at quick and usually accurate hypotheses about class and origin--her environment, with its fewer and starker distinctions, hadn't trained her to do likewise. At 10:26 AM 3/29/99 -0500, you wrote: >On Fri, 26 Mar 1999 kathylou@ATT.NET wrote: > >> I'm a girl from the working class and I swear I >> can smell class. I can sniff it out. I'm rarely wrong. >> What does this mean? Perhaps that those less privileged >> become adept at reading class codes--and often at adopting >> those of the upper classes as a means of survival. > >Kathy Lou, this seems to me a very mixed blessing. I suppose there were >always those who could sniff out a Catholic or a Jew or a Black. Often >the sniffing is offensive rather than defensive. Sniff away: I find the >notion obnoxious. >Mairead > > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 21:41:46 -0700 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: derek beaulieu / house press Subject: Re: bpNichol's TTA? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit charles and etc: >as in SHARP FACTS: Variations on TTA 26, and some are Nichol's inventions >concerning possible arrangements of the specific language of the poem. admittedly i havent seen SHARP FACTS as of yet - altho i am working on getting a copy - and i think that whil esome texts can be reproduced online that i dont know how well TTA works online - esp with the exclusion of some of the more graphical pieces - the light and dust site reproduces solely the text based interpretations / translations. . . what abt some of Nichol's other translation work, like the catallus poems? yrs derek ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 15:41:28 +1000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: "d.j. huppatz" Subject: RADI OS In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Listfolk Sorry to go back over old ground but I've been searching for a copy of Ronald Johnson's RADI OS & Small Press Distribution said they don't have a copy & it's definitely out of print. Could anyone please give me any leads as to where I might be able to buy a copy (preferably over the internet as I live in Australia)? OR Is anyone out there willing to sell me their copy or happen to have a spare or know of anyone who might? Backchannel much appreciated. Dan Huppatz Melbourne TEXTBASE WEBPAGE: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 02:13:01 +0000 Reply-To: baratier@megsinet.net Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: David Baratier Organization: Pavement Saw Press Subject: Re: Class is . . . (fwd) MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I can smell class, they almost fired me for it once. Survival is survival. Gertrude Stein. Smell whitey. Really. Smell has nothing to do with class. The chain bottom of survival is a process of watching others and knowing your limitations. To anticipate their next move from the last. To know where things are. Mix desperation with cool to ask at the right moment. The right moment has a lot to do with it. But it is watching and understanding the nature of the subject until the moment. Be well David Baratier ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:08:29 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Rebecca Wolff Subject: The Joy of Poetry Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" "Poetry is a calling. You are called to write and you follow." Grant kindly requests that I elaborate on what I meant by "the joy of poetry" when I intimated that the practical implementation of cultural studies classrooms would have the effect of killing said joy. Above I quote Susan Howe for my own purposes: For me the joy of poetry--the phrase bringing to mind big, white-jacketed instruction manuals--has always been (and I am going to preface everything I say with "For me" so as to avoid the inevitable universalizing) its quality of given-ness, of temporal rightness, unavoidableness, inevitibility. As a writer of it and a frequent reader of it--though not a student of it--I would argue that the reading of poetry is also a calling, in that there are equivalently inspired moments of comprehension, agreement, pleasure as occur in the writing. Now, I've always wondered about critics: what kind of engagement with a poem do you have to have to write about it (well)? Is it the same kind of feeling of cohesion? I suppose I've now worked my way around to undermining my first complaint, about poetry in the classroom, as I guess my tentative answer to my own question is that critics/students of poetry are not purporting to engage with the poem as merely writer or reader, but also as worker. Poem as material with which to make money by writing papers, getting jobs, getting better jobs? So that the lack of the particular kind of joy I was referring to would not in the end be such a criminal thing, but an allowed exigence. I faintly realize that I am again treading on eggs what with my distinction here between poem as aesthetic object of transcendent aetheriality and poem as cultural artifact--But I said "For me." Here's a response to previous responses. I wrote it a couple of days ago but had to stay away from the List for a little bit so as not to get an ulcer. *** I have decided to try to avoid contention, and so would like to frame most of my response as sincere (ie, not rhetorical) questions. I do realize that some of these questions are naive. I am not an academic but have had close contact with this world, and find it fascinating. The opinions I tried to vent in my earlier posting about cultural studies spring out of my actual practical experience as a student in a classroom such as I have described, wherein the student body's attempt to guess at what the professor was hinting at, and her programmatic approach to the reading list, were depressing and ire-provoking. It has likewise been pointed out to me that I probably don't really understand what cultural studies IS or undertakes to be, and my response again is that I was trying to speak not about the theory but about my experience of its practice in the actual classroom. I did not mean (disclaimer, apology) to suggest that I recommend "close reading" as the only viable means of teaching poetry, nor that those who take joy in studying poetry through the lens of cultural studies should just stop: (although I guess I sounded like that's what I meant, and I think that's just because contention is the most available tone to strike when making these postings, and that's why I'm going to try to stop after this). I really was just trying to describe what it was like to be a student (middle-class or otherwise; that descriptor was a red herring) in such a classroom at a middle-ground university (also perhaps irrelevant, though if I had left it out that would be a pretty close reading indeed) and to have the experience of an attempt at that shift in modalities as I understood it per the listserv discussion. Sincere questions: 1) How can the production of increasingly rarified critical papers and books (a production embedded in and directly spurred by a factory-like academic industry) be seen to be an agent for social change? 2) How is it materially different for a grad student to write a paper on, say, Emily Dickinson's love affair with her sister-in-law, and trace its progress through her poems, than for a grad student to write a paper on lesbian inter-family relationships in the early part of the century, and trace the progress of Emily Dickinson's love affair with her sister-in-law as it is visible in her poems? One seems self-contained, and not purporting to impact social anything, and the other goes outside literary circumspection for its points of reference. So is the difference then that one has the potential to effect social change, and the other doesn't? And if that potential is not fulfilled, does that alter the quotient of actual difference between them? 3) OK, so this one's not a question: in response to the relaying of Susan Howe's interview responses to questions of anti-intellectualism and whether a given poem needs to be applicable to everyone or just to a few: However anachronistically, I do continuue to believe that poems, once shot out, are beyond the control of the poet, and so the kinds of responses to them that are had by readers are also out of the poet's control. So if I choose to read Susan Howe without the benefit of knowing, again, what her husband's job was, or even knowing how she would LIKE me to read the poems, then that's mah perogative. And if that makes me not her chosen reader than that's really OK; I can continue to read her. And if that makes me un- or anti- intellectual then those are my own unfortunate limitations and I suppose I am to be pitied rather than despised. I would also like to suggest that Ms. Howe's response is to be reviewed: I thought I detected a certain archness which did not in fact indicate "enragement" over the idea that some readers would not be qualified/equipped to read her work as she wanted it read, but instead bemusement that the question should be thrown upon her. True, I have a tendency to read archness in often where it is not, but again I suppose this is harmless, and makes reading--and writing--a whole lot more fun for me than it otherwise might be. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 17:33:11 +0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: kathylou@ATT.NET Subject: Re: query Abigail Childs' films are available through Canyon Cinema in San Francisco, an artist-member organization where much of the rental fees go to the filmmakers. Very cool. Canyon Cinema Co-op 2325-Third Street San Francisco (415)626-2255 Best, Kathy Lou Schultz > Summi (and all who might be interested) - > > Might not be the case any longer, but I know that as recently as last year a > video was available which archived three (?) of Child's 70's and early 80's > works - I remember, in particular, "Mayhem," don't know offhand whether "Is > This What You Were Born For?" was included. The distributor was one commonly > used by Media Studies folks at Buffalo - Anya Lewin would be a good person > to ask. Anya, are you out there? > > In any event, if Anya isn't on the list, I'd be happy to forward queries to > her - hesitant as always to give out private e-mail addresses on lists, but > I'd like to help however I can. > > Overcautiously yours, > Taylor > > -----Original Message----- > From: UB Poetics discussion group [mailto:POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU] > On Behalf Of Summi Kaipa > Sent: Monday, March 29, 1999 6:52 AM > To: POETICS@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: query > > Does anyone out there know anything about the work of Abigail Child? I > just recently saw part of a film of hers entitled "Is This What You Were > Born For?" which had Hannah Weiner's words dubbed into it. > > Any leads? > > > --Summi ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 13:38:18 -0000 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: travmar03 Subject: Fw: April 3, 1999 -- Comments: To: xentrica@earthlink.net, Writers House , vhanson@netbox.com, tf@morningred.com, TDevaney@brooklyn.cuny.edu, T Sinioukov , swineburne@yahoo.com, swalker@dept.english.upenn.edu, Sub Po Etics , Ron Silliman , potepoet@home.com, Poetry Project , Philadelphiawriters@dept.english.upenn.edu, Nawi Avila , Molly B Russakoff , Michael Magee , Margit , louis stroffolino , lkoutimhot@aol.com, Kyle Conner , Kristen Gallagher , Kevin Varrone , Kerry Sherin , Justin , jon8stark@aol.com, Janine Hayes , ianjewell@netscape.net, Heather Starr , Heather Fuller , gbiglier@nimbus.ocis.temple.edu, Don Riggs , dburnham@sas.upenn.edu, Cindy Burstein , Chris McCreary , Buck Downs , Brett Evans , Brendan , Barbara Cole , banchang@sas.upenn.edu, avraham@sas.upenn.edu, Andre Codrescu , ampoupard , Amossin@aol.com, amorris1@swarthmore.edu, American Poetry Review Watch for the Age in its Cage and other spectacular feats of daring by the amazing duo: Stephen Rodofer and Shawn Walker Highwire Gallery 139 N. 2nd Street Philadelphia Saturday April 3, 1999 8 PM BYOB >>Stephen will give a talk titled: The Age in its Cage >>At 5 PM at the Writers House. >> >>Bring a friend, a family member, a small pet, and a whole lot of endurance. >>E-mail this out to any you may think are interested. >> >>xoxo >>your sponsors >>Fuchs and Connor >> >> >> > > > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:50:10 -0500 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Michael Boughn Subject: Re: Class is . . . (fwd) In-Reply-To: <19990329230307.BCDN23619@webmail.worldnet.att.net> from "kathylou@ATT.NET" at Mar 29, 99 11:03:02 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Kathy Lou Schultz: You quickly learn to keep such knwledges secret unless you're looking for a fight. See Melville's _White Jacket_. Best, Mike > Mairead, > I don't care if you think it's obnoxious. Survival is > survival. One does what one needs to do in order to > survive. For poor and working class folks survival is > often the name of the game--not "offense." In any case, > you're just trying to turn what I said on its head without > responding to the crux of my point, which I find > obnoxious. Backchannel further, please. > Thank you. > Kathy Lou Schultz > > > > > > On Fri, 26 Mar 1999 kathylou@ATT.NET wrote: > > > > > I'm a girl from the working class and I swear I > > > can smell class. I can sniff it out. I'm rarely wrong. > > > What does this mean? Perhaps that those less privileged > > > become adept at reading class codes--and often at adopting > > > those of the upper classes as a means of survival. > > > > Kathy Lou, this seems to me a very mixed blessing. I suppose there were > > always those who could sniff out a Catholic or a Jew or a Black. Often > > the sniffing is offensive rather than defensive. Sniff away: I find the > > notion obnoxious. > > Mairead > > > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 01:13:43 -0800 Reply-To: UB Poetics discussion group Sender: UB Poetics discussion group From: Stephen Cope Subject: New Writing Series at UCSD Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" The New Writing Series at UCSD announces its spring Schedule of Events. Unless otherwise noted, all readings take place at the Visual Arts Performance Space on the University of California, San Diego campus at 4:30 PM. Readings are free and open to the public. * Mervyn Taylor April 7 Mervyn Taylor, who divides his time between New York and his native Trinidad, has published two books of poems, _An Island of His Own_ and _The Goat_, both from Junction Press. He teaches high-school English in Harlem and creative writing at the New School for Social Research. * Leslie Scalapino April 14 Author of numerous books of poetry, prose, drama, and criticism, Leslie Scalapino's recent publications include _Green and Black: Selected Writings_ (Talisman House, 1996) and a collaboration with Lyn Hejinian, _Sight_ (Edge, 1999). She edits and publishes O Books. * Aldon Nielsen April 21 Aldon Nielsen is the author of four volumes of poetry, the most recent of which _Vext_ (Sink Press), and four books of literary/cultural criticism, including _C.L.R. James: A Critical Introduction_ and _Black Chant: Languages of African-American Postmodernism_. * Michael Davidson April 28 Long-time UCSD professor Michael Davidson is an internationally celebrated poet and critic. His most recent book-length punlications are _The Arcades_ (O Books, 1999) and _Ghostlier Demarcations: Modern Poetry and the Material Word_ (U. of California, 1997). * Kit Robinson May 5 The author of numerous books of poetry, including the recently published _Democracy Boulevard_ (Roof Books, 1998), Kit Robinson has been called by Kevin Killian "one of the most accomplished poets working in America today." He lives in the San Francisco Bay Area. * Charles Bernstein May 12 * Taking place at the Seuss Room, Geisel Library, UCSD at 4:30PM Author of over two dozen books of poetry and criticism, Charles Bernstein is the 1999 recipient of the Roy Harvey Pearce/ Archive for New Poetry Prize - awarded biennially to an American poet/scholar. Among his recent publications is _My Way: Speeches and Poems_ (U. of Chicago, 1999). * Lewis Warsh May 19 Editor and publisher of United Artists Books, Lewis Warsh is the author of two novels, _A Free Man_ and _Agnes & Sally_, a book of stories, _Money Under the Table_, and numerous books of poems, including _Information from the Surface of Venus_ and _Avenue of Escape_. * In Memoriam Armand Schwerner May 26 A celebration of the life and work of the poet and performance artist Armand Schwerner, with a filmed performance of Schwerner's reading from his masterwork _The Tablets_. Guest appearances by David Antin, Eleanor Antin, Jerome Rothenberg, Quincy Troupe, Mark Weiss, and others.